DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: R.R. on November 11, 2006, 02:01:34 AM
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Congressman Rangel:
As a proud Mississippian and resident of the Katrina-ravaged Gulf Coast, I would be happy to tell you ‘who the hell wants to live in Mississippi.’
I will not waste your time with the litany of world-class writers, artists, athletes, entertainers, scientists, surgeons, astronauts, musicians, soldiers and statesmen who have called Mississippi home. I will tell you of the 93,000 people still housed in FEMA trailers due to the loss of over 10,000 apartment units and over 150,000 homes to Hurricane Katrina.
Congressman Rangel, these people went through hell to live in Mississippi!
-Wendy Barthe Peavy, Biloxi, MS
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I think it was a bad thing to say. He doesn’t live in Mississippi, he doesn’t know anything about us. A lot of people here have a lot to say about it because we’re not a big city like New York City. We are humans. We don’t think that’s right.
-Debbie Crapps, Florence, MS
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Mr. Rangel owes the people of Mississippi an apology. I hope his remarks are not the kind of insults, slander, and defamation that Mississippians will come to expect from the Democrat leadership in Washington, D.C.
I have friends and colleagues from New York that are fine people and I’ve visited their state and think it is a wonderful place. But I love Mississippi. I would rather live in Mississippi, raise my family in Mississippi, and serve Mississippi - and there are millions of Mississippians who agree with me.
From the Coast to the Delta to the Pinebelt to the Hills and across Mississippi, there is beauty in every city, charity in every heart, love in every church, and majesty in every countryside. When I travel this state I see it in the resolute handshakes, the hospitable smiles, and the sincere prayers of our neighbors: we love Mississippi and we are proud and happy to live here.
Last year, Hurricane Katrina devastated the Mississippi Coast. We have been working hard not only to rebuild our own homes and communities, but also to repair and protect the network of refineries, pipelines, and transmission grids that supply energy, gas, and oil to the rest of the country, including New York. If Mr. Rangel believes those efforts required more than our fair share of federal money, he is welcome to send that energy back to our state and find an alternative supply. At the very least, he should send us an apology.
-Charles W. Pickering Jr., Laurel, MS
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Congressman Rangel:
As a proud Mississippian and resident of the Katrina-ravaged Gulf Coast, I would be happy to tell you ‘who the hell wants to live in Mississippi.’
I will not waste your time with the litany of world-class writers, artists, athletes, entertainers, scientists, surgeons, astronauts, musicians, soldiers and statesmen who have called Mississippi home. I will tell you of the 93,000 people still housed in FEMA trailers due to the loss of over 10,000 apartment units and over 150,000 homes to Hurricane Katrina.
Congressman Rangel, these people went through hell to live in Mississippi!
-Wendy Barthe Peavy, Biloxi, MS
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I think it was a bad thing to say. He doesn’t live in Mississippi, he doesn’t know anything about us. A lot of people here have a lot to say about it because we’re not a big city like New York City. We are humans. We don’t think that’s right.
-Debbie Crapps, Florence, MS
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Mr. Rangel owes the people of Mississippi an apology. I hope his remarks are not the kind of insults, slander, and defamation that Mississippians will come to expect from the Democrat leadership in Washington, D.C.
I have friends and colleagues from New York that are fine people and I’ve visited their state and think it is a wonderful place. But I love Mississippi. I would rather live in Mississippi, raise my family in Mississippi, and serve Mississippi - and there are millions of Mississippians who agree with me.
From the Coast to the Delta to the Pinebelt to the Hills and across Mississippi, there is beauty in every city, charity in every heart, love in every church, and majesty in every countryside. When I travel this state I see it in the resolute handshakes, the hospitable smiles, and the sincere prayers of our neighbors: we love Mississippi and we are proud and happy to live here.
Last year, Hurricane Katrina devastated the Mississippi Coast. We have been working hard not only to rebuild our own homes and communities, but also to repair and protect the network of refineries, pipelines, and transmission grids that supply energy, gas, and oil to the rest of the country, including New York. If Mr. Rangel believes those efforts required more than our fair share of federal money, he is welcome to send that energy back to our state and find an alternative supply. At the very least, he should send us an apology.
-Charles W. Pickering Jr., Laurel, MS
Where does all this whiny , sappy shit come from? Mississuckians must have a real bad inferiority complex to leyyold Charley get to them this way,
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Mississuckians must have a real bad inferiority complex to leyyold Charley get to them this way,
Nah, They just told Rangel to go screw himself, politely, of course.
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"Where does all this whiny , sappy shit come from? Mississuckians must have a real bad inferiority complex to leyyold Charley get to them this way,"
This must explain the reaction of New Yorkers to John Rocker , inferiority , yes that is the ticket....
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Mississuckians must have a real bad inferiority complex to let old Charley get to them this way,
Nah, They just told Rangel to go screw himself, politely, of course.
Well , you cant tell that by RR's pissedoffedness.
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"Where does all this whiny , sappy shit come from? Mississuckians must have a real bad inferiority complex to leyyold Charley get to them this way,"
This must explain the reaction of New Yorkers to John Rocker , inferiority , yes that is the ticket....
John did not attack New Yorkers per se , but "foreigners" who once again are not in control of where they were born. Rocker is , I suppose, the quintessential Southern Gentleman:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/cover/news/1999/12/22/rocker/
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I think you have to consider someone's history and upbringing when you look at their words.
According to this biography, Rangel dropped out of high school, went to Korea, where he rescued soldiers from behinkd enemy lines. Decorated war veteran.
'Discharged honorably as a staff sergeant in 1952, Rangel immediately began work on completion of his high school education. In one year's time he went through two years' worth of study and earned his diploma in 1953. By 1957, he had graduated from New York University's School of Commerce. His academic performance was stellar and he won a full scholarship to St. John's University.
In 1960 Rangel graduated from St. John's Law School and was admitted to the bar. After a year in private practice, Rangel was appointed U.S. attorney in the Southern District of New York by Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy. In 1966, he was elected to the New York State Assembly as the representative for the 72nd District in Central Harlem. Before long he was the acknowledged leader on issues affecting working class and lower income people. '
Maybe he looks at Mississippi and thinks, how much could I have accomplished if I lived there?
And maybe that is why he said what he said.
http://www.hometoharlem.com/HARlem/hthcult.nsf/notables/a6a39044c4749b7a852565cf001dbcaa
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Perhaps unfortunate but definitely forgiveable, Rangel's comments provide nothing more than a soapbox for Katrina victims to complain about lack of federal attention, and a wedge issue for our lesser lights to call "politics" and try to exploit.
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(http://www.mississippipolitics.com/images/halp_us_charlie_raingull.jpg)
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http://www.crmvet.org/info/grenada.htm
The people in your photos didn't grow up in the Mississippi of the 1930s (when Congressman Rangel was born) or the 1960s when these events took place:
Grenada Mississippi, 1966
Chronology of a Movement
Images of the Grenada Movement
[Note on terminology — This was originally written in 1966 when the preferred term for African-Americans was "Negro."]
Grenada County, population-18,400. The western portion of the county dips down into the rich cotton country of the Delta, the eastern portion is partially flooded by Grenada Lake. Nine out of every ten people in Grenada County were born and raised in Mississippi (not many "foreigners" move to Grenada, at least not to stay). More than half of the county's population live in the Rural areas. Half the population have a year-round steady job, the other half do not.
Grenada is small, but like all Mississippi counties, it is big enough to contain two separate — but unequal — worlds. Half the population of both county and town are Negro (9,061 Negroes in the county). The median number of school years completed for Negroes is 5.1 (for whites it is 12.1). At least 300 Negro adults have never attended any school at all, only 82 are college graduates. The median income for Negro families is $1401, for whites it is approximately $4300. (In 1966 the U.S. Government defined "poverty" for a family of four as an annual total income under $3300.)
Most of the population of Grenada county is supported by Agriculture. The traditional cotton is slowly being replaced by corn, peanuts, and sorghum. The traditional Negro field hand is swiftly being replaced by machines. By 1966 almost all of the Negro sharecroppers have lost their land, their farms turned over to the machines. The former sharecroppers have either left the county or are subsisting on day labor.
Grenada (Town): population-8,000, county seat of Grenada County. The town of Grenada sits halfway between Memphis and Jackson on the main North-South road (Highway 51). Perched on the hills that border the eastern edge of the Mississippi Delta, the Yalabusha river flows past the north side of town. There is little industry: a few lumber mills, a hosiery factory, an air-conditioner workshop, and some other light industries. Only a few Negroes work in these plants.
As you drive through Grenada's tree-shaded, paved streets past red-brick homes on wide green lawns you know you are in Grenada's white world. Grenada's Negro world exists on dusty dirt roads, with small, weather- beaten "shotgun" shacks crammed side by side into every available inch of land. Negroes still sit in the rear of the four Greyhound busses that briefly pause each day at the bus depot. Negroes are not permitted to enter the library. White women work behind the desks and cash registers of downtown Grenada, Negro women push the mops and scrub the floors.
Grenada county has always been a segregation stronghold. Over the previous century there have been a number of lynchings — four in one day in 1885. Few Negroes are registered to vote, and fewer still dare cast ballots. None get "uppity," not if they want to stay. There has never been any significant Civil Rights Movement activity in the County, it was considered too tough a nut to crack. In May of 1966, Grenada still lived as if it were 1886.
Wednesday, June 15. The Meredith Mississippi March Against Fear (and with it, the 20th Century) comes striding down Hiway 51 to arrive in Grenada at 3 o'clock in the afternoon.
The white power structure has a plan to handle this emergency — make promises, and provide no pretext or reason for continued protest. See to it that these "outside" marchers have no issues to demonstrate about, and assume that the local Negroes will "stay in their place." As City Manager John McEachin explained it to a reporter, "All we want is to get these people through town and out of here. Good niggers don't want anything to do with this march. And there are more good niggers than sorry niggers."
McEachin's plan fails. The response of the Negro community is greater than in any other town along the route (except for Canton, some days later). A voter rally is held on the town square. Doctor Green of SCLC places a small American flag on the Confederate War Memorial Statue. To the local whites, this is a "desecration" and the flag is torn down by enraged onlookers as soon as the March leaves.
After the rally, Negro Grenadans line up at the courthouse to be registered by the four Negro registrars who have been hired by the county to co-opt the march. That night the mass meeting is addressed by Dr. King. After the meeting more than 200 people march from the church up to the square to register. 160 Negroes are registered in Grenada that day.
[..................]
Saturday, October 29. All those still in jail are bailed out. J.T. Johnson is shot at after mass meeting that night.
GRENADA MARCH #107
Echoing songs on the square
White breath in cold night air
Black shadows, two by two
Marching strong, me and you.
"Ohhh freedom, ohhhh freedom
ohhhh freedom over me...."
Beneath a lonely street light
Children singing out at night.
The mobs are gone, for this time
And tension eases down the line.
"...and before I'll be a slave
I'll be buried in my grave
and go home to my Lord
and be free-oh and be free..."
Standing silent round the square
Troopers watch with hard, cold stare.
"Niggers on the march again.
Damn! Will they never end?"
"...No more gassings, no more beatings
no more jailings, over me..."
Around, around, the square we stride
Cold air filled with freedom's pride.
We'll keep marching side by side
'till freedom gates are opened wide.
"...and before I'll be a slave
I'll be buried in my grave
and go home to my Lord
and be free-oh and be free."
It's quite on the square again
As one-oh-seven comes to end.
Proud, we march down Pearl Street
Back to church where we meet.
Monday, October 31. Court hearing begins in Oxford before Judge Clayton about the school situation. Grenada school superintendent admits the boycott numbers of the Negro schools:
Friday (the original walkout) — 235
Monday — 1250
Tuesday — 1500
Wednesday — 1850
Thursday — 1900
Friday — 2200.
We agree to call off the school boycott on the promise of a resolution of the issues.
There is no night march because it's Halloween (too dangerous).
Tuesday, November 1. Court hearing resumes in Oxford. All kids return to school. The practice of a march every night is discontinued in favor of marches as needed.
Wednesday, November 2. Hearing begins in Grenada court on the Pak n Sak lawsuit against the movement. The guy who is supposedly suing testifies that he knows none of the people he is suing, has never read the suit, does not know who wrote it, and knows of none of the incidents alleged in it. Clearly, he is just being used by the white power structure in an attempt to destroy the movement.
Court in Oxford on the school case continues throughout the week.
Lester Hankerson one of the SCLC staff who was beaten by troopers while in jail is taken to the hospital with internal bleeding.
Monday, November 7. Judge Clayton issues his order. Parents and students are prohibited from demonstrating at the schools or organizing boycotts. The school system is ordered to treat everyone equal regardless of race. Superintendent is ordered to set up meetings between parents and teachers. A complaint system is put into place to handle disputes. While this is not a total triumph, it is seen as a victory for the movement.
Tuesday, November 8. Election day. There are 1300 votes for Negro candidate Clifton Whitley, 3000 for white candidate James Eastland. For a county that had only a small number of Negroes registered before the Meredith March a few months earlier, this is a big step forward. Over the months and years to follow, Negro voter registration and turnout will rise steadily.
Sunday, November 13. Coretta Scott King gives fundraising "Freedom Concert." Over 1,000 attend.
Thursday, November 17. Juvenile court for those under 13 who had been arrested. Charges dropped. Those over 13 plead "Not Guilty," no date set for trial.
Over the following weeks and months, there are few demonstrations but the Grenada County Freedom Movement digs in for the long haul — organizing, mounting legal defense for those arrested, and continuing voter registration and political organization. Harassment of the Negro students in the white schools continues, but at a lower and more subtle level. By the end of the school year additional Negro students had been forced out, but Grenada still had the more Negroes attending formerly white schools than any other rural Mississippi county.
--Bruce Hartford © 1967, 2003
Copyright © 2003-2004
Last Modified: October 24, 2004.
Webspinner: webmaster@crmvet.org
(Labor donated)
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Perhaps Charlie should practice what he preaches:
I want President Chavez to please understand that even though many people in the United States are critical of our president that we resent the fact that he would come to the United States and criticize President Bush... you don't come into my country, you don't come into my congressional district and you don't condemn my president."
If he resented a foreigner for slamming his president, surely he must understand how Mississipians feel about his remarks.
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The people in your photos didn't grow up in the Mississippi of the 1930s (when Congressman Rangel was born) or the 1960s when these events took place:
Then when did Sela Ward (as one example) grow up? She was born in the '50s in Mississippi. Still lives there, IIRC. Did she somehow "skip over" the '60s?
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I'm sorry, I should have said, "Grew up BLACK in Mississippi in the 1960s."
And I don't know who any of the people in the photos are.
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This discussion is silly beyond belief. I find it amusing that anyone actually cares about what Rangel thinks of Mississippi or vice versa.
If I were a Mississippian, I don't think I would waste the energy to be offended.
It was just a dumbassed offhand remark. Jeez.
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I'm sorry, I should have said, "Grew up BLACK in Mississippi in the 1960s."
And I don't know who any of the people in the photos are.
You mean Jerry Rice (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?statsId=126), who is a black football player that was born and grew up in Mississippi in the '60s, didn't somehow manage that? (He's the one with the San Francisco 49ers #80 jersey in the photo.)
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It was just a dumbassed offhand remark. Jeez.
He makes a lot of them. He called Bill Clinton a redneck.
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Though I do often wonder why the people of Mississippi elect a man who spoke before the Council of Conservative Citizens to be their Governor. It isn't exactly projecting a forward-looking image for the state.
And Mississippi does have a hell of a lot of problems, it is looked down upon by most of the other Southern states per the phrase "Thank God for Mississippi (sometimes substituted with Louisiana)."
I'm not defending the dumbass comment, which should never have been made. Yet, to say Mississippi is the zenith of the fifty states is rather far from the truth. Though I recognize that people from Mississippi and some that move there love the state as their home and there is nothing wrong with that.
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Ami, without knowing who the person was, how could I tell when they grew up in Mississippi? They look young, except for the guy on the far left.
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Ami, without knowing who the person was, how could I tell when they grew up in Mississippi? They look young, except for the guy on the far left.
http://www.olemiss.edu/mwp/dir/faulkner_william/index.html
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Ami, without knowing who the person was, how could I tell when they grew up in Mississippi?
Perhaps you should have checked before making blanket statements?
They are all famous people.
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I went to mississippipolitics.com. No photo of them I could find, no names. Not my problem for not recognizing them.
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Not my problem for not recognizing them.
That's ok. Feel free to continue to make comments without bothering to get the whole story.
Republicans still want all women to get cancer, right?
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That's ok. Feel free to continue to make comments without bothering to get the whole story.
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What is the whole story, O great wise one?
Who are the Unknown Mississippians?
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The main problem with Mississippi is that the two largest cities that serve as commercial hubs for Mississippi, Memphis and New Orleans, are not actually in Mississippi. This means that the economic data of the state is rather skewed towards the rural aspects rather than the urban ones.
O Brother Where Art Thou? , one of the funniest films I have ever seen, is a retelling of Homer's Odessey set entirely within Mississippi.
Faulkner was one of our greatest novelists, and he wrote about Mississippi.
Mississippi is less boring than many other states. Nebraska, Iowa or perhaps even Indiana.
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What is the whole story, O great wise one?
In this case, that she would claim that none of them grew up in Mississippi in the '60s (later amended to "grew up BLACK in the '60s") - yet she didn't know that many of them did grow up in Mississippi in the '60s, and one of them even grew up black in the '60s in Mississippi. If you don't know who you're talking about, perhaps you should get informed before putting your foot in your mouth.
So much for blanket statements and "obvious" claims.
And the argument that she didn't know who they are is rather flat, IMO, since they're all famous. I can believe not recognizing all of them, but none of them?
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I don't recognize any of them. The guy on the left---Faulkner---what a handsome man.
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I don't recognize any of them.
Then why did you say with such authority that none of them grew up in Mississippi in the '60s?