Author Topic: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories  (Read 7681 times)

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sirs

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I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« on: May 03, 2011, 08:17:56 PM »
Although I'm on record as saying the bastard, OBL, is dead, courtesy of some 9MM and/or 5.56 rounds, by U.S. Special Forces, how are these for competing theories, in trying to explain the hasty "burial at sea" and length of time to release any death photos?:

1) He was unarmed, and shot in the back.  Now Hollywood is being employed to create a really cool Terminator-like killed death of an OBL manikin, for the appropriate photos to be taken of, so as not to offend the Muslim world

2) He's alive, and in perfect health, in the bowels of some CIA "interrogation" room, while Hollywood continues on the creation of the above noted Terminator-killed OBL lookalike, for photographic purposes

What do ya think?
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Kramer

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2011, 08:34:55 PM »
Although I'm on record as saying the bastard, OBL, is dead, courtesy of some 9MM and/or 5.56 rounds, by U.S. Special Forces, how are these for competing theories, in trying to explain the hasty "burial at sea" and length of time to release any death photos?:

1) He was unarmed, and shot in the back.  Now Hollywood is being employed to create a really cool Terminator-like killed death of an OBL manikin, for the appropriate photos to be taken of, so as not to offend the Muslim world

2) He's alive, and in perfect health, in the bowels of some CIA "interrogation" room, while Hollywood continues on the creation of the above noted Terminator-killed OBL lookalike, for photographic purposes

What do ya think?

Either way that makes Obama a liar!

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2011, 08:44:03 PM »
1) not so much, as he still died, at the hands of the SEALs.  And the Administration is now on record as referencing he was unarmed, merely "resisting".  (boy, isn't that going to open up a whole other can of worms, with the now on record reference that you don't have to be armed to resist arrest and have your head shot off)

2) definitely, but quite an interesting concept of Obama having given clearance for some "enhanced interrogation" techniques.  And I doubt water-boarding would be on that menu
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Kramer

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2011, 09:22:47 PM »
That could put his Nobel Peace Prize in jeopardy.

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2011, 11:30:21 PM »
Definitely
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Kramer

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2011, 12:08:56 AM »
Definitely

Although I find the LEFT to be much more tolerant of their own when it come to manslaughter (Kennedy), Rape (Kennedy & Clinton), Lying (Kerry & Edwards), Racism (Robert Byrd), War, torture, the economy, jobs & national security (Obama).

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2011, 12:34:42 AM »
Definitely

Although I find the LEFT

....and the MSM....

to be much more tolerant of their own when it come to manslaughter (Kennedy), Rape (Kennedy & Clinton), Lying (Kerry & Edwards), Racism (Robert Byrd), War, torture, the economy, jobs & national security (Obama).
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2011, 10:32:18 AM »
White House fumbles getting its Osama bin Laden story straight

DEBKAfile Special Report

May 4, 2011, 3:20 PM (GMT+02:00)

The Abbottabad villa does not support US account of a fortress with few windowsTwo days after the US President Barack Obama's triumphal announcement that Osama bin Laden was dead, the White House was grappling with a serious credibility problem: Questions and contradictions are mounting about the how and why US elite SEALs killed the most wanted man in the world at his mansion in Abbottabad, Pakistan on May 2. New information proving the first stories wrong comes not just from a defensive Pakistan government but also from US officials.

Dismissing the conflicting disclosures as "artificial stories" and "conspiracy theories" won't wash ? not just in the US but in Arab and Muslim countries after Washington was forced to retract data the president's adviser on terrorism John Brennan put before the media on Tuesday.  It was admitted tardily that bin Laden was not armed when he was killed, there was no firefight in the Abbottabad villa and his wife was not used as a human shield.

Pakistani sources challenged other parts of the original narrative and Wednesday, May 4, the dead terrorist's daughter told Al Arabiya TV most damagingly that her father was captured alive and then shot by US forces.

Even before that, amid rising demands for evidence that Osama bin Laden was dead, White House spokesman Jay Carney confessed Tuesday night: "Even I'm getting confused."

And no wonder. Monday, in his first statement on the operation, Obama stated: "And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice." Was he talking about a targeted assassination? Brennan later said that in the firefight in the terrorist's bedroom he had been asked to surrender and was shot dead when he did not answer. Another US spokesman said the SEALs were ready to take him alive.

Other US sources described the shooting as happening quickly - "in the blink of an eye," said one. The Republican leader Mitt Romney remarked: "Osama bin Laden took one in the eye."
His daughter's evidence contradicted this jumble of American versions. Even though she must have had a Pakistani green light for the Al Arabiya interview, her testimony cannot be lightly dismissed because she was present and shot in the leg before being taken into Pakistani custody. Her version makes it look as though US troops executed her father in cold blood.

The backlash from her testimony will not do much good to the delicate relations between the Obama administration and Muslim rulers like Saudi King Abdullah which are already tested to the limit over US involvement in the Egyptian uprising and Libyan war.

 Pakistani leaders are caught awkwardly between an effort to clear their intelligence service ISI of American accusations of collusion in concealing the al Qaeda leader's presence in its midst, and domestic opinion, which is outraged by their government's suspected connivance with Washington to betray a Muslim figure and permit American forces to violate sovereign territory.
Reporters in Islamabad heard from the Pakistani foreign secretary Salman Bashir Wednesday, May 4: "We had indicated this complex (in Abbottabad) as far back as 2009 as a possible place," after sighting suspected terrorist movements on the property. It was not known at the time that bin Laden was hiding there and there were millions of other suspect locations, he said.
Bashir also hit out at former CIA Director Leon Panetta's comments that informing Islamabad in advance about the raid had been ruled out as "worrying."

These comments are just the start of the war of words building up between the Zardari-Ghilani government and the Obama administration. Islamabad has one major advantage: The inmates of the Abbottabad villa and the injured persons present when bin Laden was killed are in Pakistani custody, some in military hospitals. They can be produced whenever necessary to rebut Arab and Muslim criticism of Pakistan's conduct and fend off any attempts to undermine its ties with the Taliban, which has already vowed to avenge Osama bin Laden's death in Pakistan and Afghanistan and outside those countries.

This verbal war will make further inroads on the Obama White House's credibility.
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Kramer

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2011, 11:32:20 AM »
White House fumbles getting its Osama bin Laden story straight

DEBKAfile Special Report

May 4, 2011, 3:20 PM (GMT+02:00)

The Abbottabad villa does not support US account of a fortress with few windowsTwo days after the US President Barack Obama's triumphal announcement that Osama bin Laden was dead, the White House was grappling with a serious credibility problem: Questions and contradictions are mounting about the how and why US elite SEALs killed the most wanted man in the world at his mansion in Abbottabad, Pakistan on May 2. New information proving the first stories wrong comes not just from a defensive Pakistan government but also from US officials.

Dismissing the conflicting disclosures as "artificial stories" and "conspiracy theories" won't wash ? not just in the US but in Arab and Muslim countries after Washington was forced to retract data the president's adviser on terrorism John Brennan put before the media on Tuesday.  It was admitted tardily that bin Laden was not armed when he was killed, there was no firefight in the Abbottabad villa and his wife was not used as a human shield.

Pakistani sources challenged other parts of the original narrative and Wednesday, May 4, the dead terrorist's daughter told Al Arabiya TV most damagingly that her father was captured alive and then shot by US forces.

Even before that, amid rising demands for evidence that Osama bin Laden was dead, White House spokesman Jay Carney confessed Tuesday night: "Even I'm getting confused."

And no wonder. Monday, in his first statement on the operation, Obama stated: "And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice." Was he talking about a targeted assassination? Brennan later said that in the firefight in the terrorist's bedroom he had been asked to surrender and was shot dead when he did not answer. Another US spokesman said the SEALs were ready to take him alive.

Other US sources described the shooting as happening quickly - "in the blink of an eye," said one. The Republican leader Mitt Romney remarked: "Osama bin Laden took one in the eye."
His daughter's evidence contradicted this jumble of American versions. Even though she must have had a Pakistani green light for the Al Arabiya interview, her testimony cannot be lightly dismissed because she was present and shot in the leg before being taken into Pakistani custody. Her version makes it look as though US troops executed her father in cold blood.

The backlash from her testimony will not do much good to the delicate relations between the Obama administration and Muslim rulers like Saudi King Abdullah which are already tested to the limit over US involvement in the Egyptian uprising and Libyan war.

 Pakistani leaders are caught awkwardly between an effort to clear their intelligence service ISI of American accusations of collusion in concealing the al Qaeda leader's presence in its midst, and domestic opinion, which is outraged by their government's suspected connivance with Washington to betray a Muslim figure and permit American forces to violate sovereign territory.
Reporters in Islamabad heard from the Pakistani foreign secretary Salman Bashir Wednesday, May 4: "We had indicated this complex (in Abbottabad) as far back as 2009 as a possible place," after sighting suspected terrorist movements on the property. It was not known at the time that bin Laden was hiding there and there were millions of other suspect locations, he said.
Bashir also hit out at former CIA Director Leon Panetta's comments that informing Islamabad in advance about the raid had been ruled out as "worrying."

These comments are just the start of the war of words building up between the Zardari-Ghilani government and the Obama administration. Islamabad has one major advantage: The inmates of the Abbottabad villa and the injured persons present when bin Laden was killed are in Pakistani custody, some in military hospitals. They can be produced whenever necessary to rebut Arab and Muslim criticism of Pakistan's conduct and fend off any attempts to undermine its ties with the Taliban, which has already vowed to avenge Osama bin Laden's death in Pakistan and Afghanistan and outside those countries.

This verbal war will make further inroads on the Obama White House's credibility.

The Seals did their job and pulled it off flawlessly!

AS USUAL Obama wasted another opportunity because everything he touches turns to shit!

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2011, 01:02:08 PM »
THIS should put things to rest now, as it relates to any conspiracy theories regarding death or not. 
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2011, 01:20:45 PM »
I don't think you can say they pulled it off completely flawlessly.

I am pretty sure that crashing that helicopter was unplanned. I donlt think the Army insures against this sort of things, and stealthy helicopters are bound to be rather pricey. And no, President Obama was NOT the pilot, so you cannot blame him.

Still, it was effective and well done. Just not flawless.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2011, 01:24:30 PM »
It depends........IF the goal was to merelu capture or kill bin Laden and not lose any U.S lives in the process, that problably translates into a flawless operation
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2011, 02:01:50 PM »
A successfgul operation achieves its stated goal and comes within budget.
XO's point about the lost helicopter is well made.

sirs

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2011, 02:31:32 PM »
I never claimed otherwise.  I merely referenced the notion of flawless frequently is connected with the achievement of the goals set.  I realize this need to try and argue with me, try to catch me in something I never said or even implied.  Best keep tabs on when that becomes your goal, vs debating issues
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: I have 2 competing conspiracy theories
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2011, 02:44:15 PM »
I never claimed otherwise.  I merely referenced the notion of flawless frequently is connected with the achievement of the goals set.  I realize this need to try and argue with me, try to catch me in something I never said or even implied.  Best keep tabs on when that becomes your goal, vs debating issues

That post was not aimed at you. It was directed to the forum as a whole. It was a simple statement of fact. Get over yourself.