Author Topic: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"  (Read 2104 times)

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sirs

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"Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« on: September 07, 2010, 07:03:57 PM »
President Barack Obama boldly proclaims, "The buck stops here!" But, whenever his policies are criticized, he acts as if the buck stopped with George W. Bush.

The party line that we are likely to be hearing from now until the November elections is that Obama "inherited" the big federal budget deficits and that he has to "clean up the mess" left in the economy by the Republicans. This may convince those who want to be convinced, but it will not stand up under scrutiny.

No President of the United States can create either a budget deficit or a budget surplus. All spending bills originate in the House of Representatives and all taxes are voted into law by Congress.

Democrats controlled both houses of Congress before Barack Obama became president. The deficit he inherited was created by the Congressional Democrats, including Senator Barack Obama, who did absolutely nothing to oppose the runaway spending. He was one of the biggest of the big spenders.

The last time the federal government had a budget surplus, Bill Clinton was president, so it was called "the Clinton surplus." But Republicans controlled the House of Representatives, where all spending bills originate, for the first time in 40 years. It was also the first budget surplus in more than a quarter of a century.

The only direct power that any president has that can affect deficits and surpluses is the power to veto spending bills. President Bush did not veto enough spending bills but Senator Obama and his fellow Democrats in control of Congress were the ones who passed the spending bills.

Today, with Barack Obama in the White House, allied with Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi in charge in Congress, the national debt is a bigger share of the national output than it has been in more than half a century. And its share is projected to continue going up for years to come, becoming larger than national output in 2012.

Having created this scary situation, President Obama now says, "Don't give in to fear. Let's reach for hope." The voters reached for hope when they elected Obama. The fear comes from what he has done since taking office.

"The worst thing we could do is to go back to the very same policies that created this mess in the first place," he said recently. "In November, you're going to have that choice."

Another political fable is that the current economic downturn is due to not enough government regulation of the housing and financial markets. But it was precisely the government regulators, under pressure from politicians, who forced banks and other lending institutions to lower their standards for making mortgage loans.

These risky loans, and the defaults that followed, were what set off a chain reaction of massive financial losses that brought down the whole economy.

Was this due to George W. Bush and the Republicans? Only partly. Most of those who pushed the lowering of mortgage lending standards were Democrats-- notably Congressman Barney Frank and Senator Christopher Dodd, though too many Republicans went along.

At the heart of these policies were Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, who bought huge amounts of risky mortgages, passing the risk on from the banks that lent the money (and made the profits) to the taxpayers who were not even aware that they would end up paying in the end.

When President Bush said in 2004 that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac should be reined in, 76 members of the House of Representatives issued a statement to the contrary. These included Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi, Maxine Waters and Charles Rangel.

If we are going to talk about "the policies that created this mess in the first place," let's at least get the facts straight and the names right.

The current policies of the Obama administration are a continuation of the same reckless policies that brought on the current economic problems-- all in the name of "change." Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are still sacred cows in Washington, even though they have already required the biggest bailouts of all.

Why? Because they allow politicians to direct vast sums of money where it will do politicians the most good, either personally or in terms of buying votes in the next election.


Political fables
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2010, 08:39:22 PM »
horrible message and just won't sell
it comes off as whining
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

BT

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2010, 09:30:53 PM »
horrible message and just won't sell
it comes off as whining


What's that?

Obama is a bad man because he blames Bush, or that the GOP has not articulated an alternative to present policy?

sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2010, 01:07:50 AM »
The GOP has consistently articulated plans, which largely includes re-establishment of the Bush tax cuts, and a return to fiscal discipline, though they could be doing more in that regards.  Specific plans to defund various policies put in place by the Dems & Obama will go a long ways towards that endeavor
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2010, 01:23:15 AM »
Quote
The GOP has consistently articulated plans, which largely includes re-establishment of the Bush tax cuts, and a return to fiscal discipline, though they could be doing more in that regards.

Considering that the Bush budgets all contained deficit spending I'm not sure just rolling back Dem spending will do the trick. And since at this moment the Bush tax cuts haven't expired, the only effect renewing them would have is psychological. They need more specific proposals to right the economic ship, including a payroll tax holiday and tax credits for R&D and new hires. What they really need is an Economic Contract with America that emphasizes domestic manufacturing of quality goods at affordable prices. We can't just be a nation of sales clerks selling goods for China. We need to be involved in the product cycle from concept to end user.



sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2010, 02:09:56 AM »
Not referring to the Budgets...which originate in the House of Representatives.  The question was policies, that the GOP should be articulating.  I don't think you're going to find any Republican advocating the need to go back to the Bush budgets

But you and I are in agreement, that the GOP can and should be doing a better job at articulating specific initiatives, they'd enact if they became a majority power.  Just running on "We're not Democrats" is not enough to give them that status
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2010, 02:43:10 AM »
Yeah it reminds of the whole Anybody But Bush mantra of a scant few years ago.

It would be nice if the country had a chance to vote for someone and more importantly something, than to settle for just voting against someone and something.


sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2010, 04:13:26 AM »
Yeah it reminds of the whole Anybody But Bush mantra of a scant few years ago.

Exactly.  It was a garbage campaign then, and it'd be a similar load of dren, this go around as well
 

It would be nice if the country had a chance to vote for someone and more importantly something, than to settle for just voting against someone and something.

Won't get any argument from me, on that one
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2010, 05:29:46 AM »
What's that?

See the polls if you dont understand...his message is not selling.
The Taxocrats control the House, the Senate, and the Presidency.
If you control everything blaming others is a tough sell.
Conditions have deteriorated badly for the Democrats over the summer.
The economy appears rotten...with little chance of a real comeback by Nov
Unemployment is very high...people are pissed off.
The Democrats self-proclaimed "Recovery Summer" is a running JOKE!
President Obama is in over his head...and he'll have to have a miracle to not be in worse shape next year.

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2010, 10:44:44 AM »
The GOP concept of "Let's be more fiscally responsible by LOWERING TAXES" is rather unconvincing.

The Juniorbush tax rates have been in place now for years, and the recession continues. The Republicans have no plan, and do not appear to have any plan to have a plan.

They might as well say "Let's put someone orange in charge of the house, and someone with a puffy face in charge of the Senate: that way, we can give our country a severe case of gridlock".


"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2010, 11:38:56 AM »
The GOP concept of "Let's be more fiscally responsible by LOWERING TAXES" is rather unconvincing.

Except for the teensy little FACT that the Fed generated more revenue under such a supposed unconvincing tactic.  It was a fact under Kennedy, it was a fact under Reagan, and it was a fact under Bush II


The Juniorbush tax rates have been in place now for years, and the recession continues.

Hello.....Buellor?......SPENDING.  I realize that you're a language professor, and perhaps skipped mathematics.  No matter how much more revenue you take in, if you spend like a drunken democrat, outspending what you take in, you'll have deficits.  And if you don't fix the source of the recession, such as Fannie & Freddie, and their regulative bureacracies, and just keep spending, the Obama recession will continue, not to mention WORSEN


The Republicans have no plan

Wrong again (but what else is new).  A large part of their plan is to repeal the garbage Obama has tried to ram down our throats, while pushing to extend one of the few things that actually was helping this country....tax cuts to EVERYONE who pays taxes


They might as well say "Let's put someone orange in charge of the house, and someone with a puffy face in charge of the Senate: that way, we can give our country a severe case of gridlock".

Which it severely needs right now.  At least until Obama is voted out of office
« Last Edit: September 08, 2010, 01:26:49 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2010, 12:21:28 PM »
Quote
Hello.....Buellor?......SPENDING.  I realize that yourt a language professor, and perhaps skipped mathematics.  No matter how much more revenue you take in, if you spend like a drunken democrat, outspending what you take in, you'll have deficits.  And if you don't fix the source of the recession, such as Fannie & Freddie, and their regulative bureacracies, and just keep spending, the Obama recession will continue, not to mention WORSEN

The immediate cause of this recession is directly related to the housing bubble that burst. It has little to do with Obamacare. Yes easy mortgage money and the toxic assets it produced via Fannie and Freddie guarantees, needs to end but that is just one of many corrections needed.

Which leading GOP spokesperson is advocating fiscal restraint like what Merkel imposed in Germany?

There is a much bigger problem going on here and it is simply this. The power to legislate via tax break and concessions should not be sold to the highest bidder. And really that is what is going on. It should not costs millions to run for Congress or billions to run for President.




sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2010, 12:43:42 PM »
The immediate cause of this recession is directly related to the housing bubble that burst. It has little to do with Obamacare.

Yes, never said otherwise.


Yes easy mortgage money and the toxic assets it produced via Fannie and Freddie guarantees, needs to end but that is just one of many corrections needed.

It was, by and large, the source of the meltdown.  It is what facilitated so many loans to so many folks, that in no way were in a position to own a home.  No down payments?  Balloon rates?  True, no one put a gun to their heads to sign on the dotted line, but it was Fannie & Freddie, at the behest of the Government, which started under Bush, but made toxic with Frank & Dodd, that facilitated the meltdown

Yes, many corrections are needed, but the latest "Wall Street reform" pretty much did nothing to address the fundamental mutation, that brought about the housing collapse --> economic collapse

Obamacare is merely a socialist's fantasy, and Obama took advantage of the situation, to ram it down our throats, regardless of the egregious repercussions to the already screwed economy


Which leading GOP spokesperson is advocating fiscal restraint like what Merkel imposed in Germany?

I've heard many, including Boehner






"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2010, 01:30:14 PM »
There is a much bigger problem going on here and it is simply this. The power to legislate via tax break and concessions should not be sold to the highest bidder. And really that is what is going on. It should not costs millions to run for Congress or billions to run for President.


==========================
I agree entirely with that.

Here in FL, a healthcare fraudmeister named Rick Scott got the GOP nomination and claims that he is going to make it all better by "lowering taxes" and "creating jobs".

But there is just a sales tax. Property taxes are determined by the counties. He has a slogan, not a plan. And the chief success of how "business experience" seems to be not being behind bars. His opponent is Alex Sink, an experienced banker who is not very well known to the point that many people are not aware that she is a woman. Scott has millions more of his ill-gotten gains to piss away on advertising.

Jeff Green the yacht-cruising even richer phony Democrat who outspent Scott, but was running for for a Senate nomination lost to Kendrick Meek, and is suing the Miami Herald for defaming his character

It is sheer CRAP to say that all you have to do to raise revenues is to lower taxes.Insulting me will not make it so, just as it will not make faeries appear and dance to the happy sounds of Joe Czrsk and his Polka Kings.
If taxes are at 0% you have no government.
If taxes are at 100%, no one has any reason to work, at least legally.
Somewhere between the two is a point that is going to shift depending on inflation and other things, such as tax shelters that are available, and several other things. that will provide maximum revenue. If the rates go up, you get less, and if the rates go down, you get less. The GOP seems clueless as to where that point is, however.

The orange person has nothing to say about this, and neither does the puffy-faced person.

The fact is that the stimulus was insufficient to pull the economy out of the mess. Puffyperson and Orangeguy will not address the issue of how their "plan" is supposed to work, so screw 'em, I say.


"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: "Let me be clear. The Buck stops.....with Bush"
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2010, 01:36:38 PM »
News Flash Xo, 99% of politicians have a slogan and not a cogent plan.  And what socialist plan Obama may have, is nothing more than a recipe for not just an Obama recession, but an Obama Depression.  More debt, more deficit spending of billions the country doesn't have, isn't the fix.  Not even in the short run
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle