Author Topic: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."  (Read 9936 times)

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Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #45 on: March 19, 2010, 10:15:10 AM »
And we still don't know what the guy said or did to earn the description "very disgruntled."  But of course the police did.

The police know what the boss told them he said. That does not necessarily mean that the police know what he actually said.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #46 on: March 19, 2010, 10:26:25 AM »
I still don't buy the idea that the guy didn't become a more efficient killing machine with his new acquisitions.  He tripled his handgun arsenal.  He doubled his long-gun arsenal.  As far as I can see, the semi-automatic rifle probably fires more rounds without re-loading than the shotgun, although we don't seem to have any relevant specs for either one of them, and the semi-automatic hand-gun magazines carry more rounds than the speed-loaders if the guy's old revolver was a typical 6-rounds capacity.

I love how you use words in an attempt to make the guy look more dangerous. Here's another way to describe his acquisitions, especially since he lived in an area famed for hunting.

While he had a shotgun for birding and a revolver for plinking, he wanted to acquire a rifle for deer rifle season, varmint control and small game hunting, and a handgun for deer handgun season. He also purchased a small, concealable semi-automatic handgun (the PPK/S, aka "James Bond's gun") for self defense for those times when he had to go into the city.

Only hoplophobes automatically think that firearms are for threatening other people.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #47 on: March 19, 2010, 10:27:58 AM »
come on AMI...sure it's possible a revolver could be reloaded almost as fast
BUT
pretty much all semi-autos fire fast...no extra stuff needed
typical semi-auto vs typical revolver
in most cases the semi will be better at firing more and faster
thats pretty much why certain people like semi-autos
they hold more bullets and fire quicker
the reason i dont like semi-autos is they can jam
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #48 on: March 19, 2010, 11:03:58 AM »
come on AMI...sure it's possible a revolver could be reloaded almost as fast
BUT
pretty much all semi-autos fire fast...no extra stuff needed
typical semi-auto vs typical revolver
in most cases the semi will be better at firing more and faster

Watch this, then tell me that again with a straight face.

Fast Revolver Shooting
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #49 on: March 19, 2010, 11:16:13 AM »
well of course some kind of world champion might be able to do it

the exception is not the rule

you pull in some random woman out of walmart

give her a 5 minute instruction

hand her the guns ready to fire

and let her fire a semi and then a revolver

it's not gonna be even close....the speed and the amount of bullets

plus when you reload a semi...you also almost always reload with more total bullets
« Last Edit: March 19, 2010, 11:24:00 AM by ChristiansUnited4LessGvt »
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

sirs

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #50 on: March 19, 2010, 11:33:05 AM »
I think Ami already broached this area....PRACTICE.  Point being, with practice, one can be just as fast, & just as "deadly" with a highcapacity revolver, as they could with a semi-auto.
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #51 on: March 19, 2010, 11:38:09 AM »
maybe SIRS....but I am talking about 90% of the population

that guy in the video is some freak.....

to me it's like saying "you can get a great body doing push-ups and pull-ups"

well yeah...maybe...if your are some freak that does push-ups and pull-ups every second

and as far as reloading.....a typical semi reloaded holds more
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #52 on: March 19, 2010, 11:40:41 AM »
you pull in some random woman out of walmart

give her a 5 minute instruction

hand her the guns ready to fire

and let her fire a semi and then a revolver

it's not gonna be even close....the speed and the amount of bullets

Semi-autos are more complicated to load and use; there are many more steps. With a 5 minute instruction? She would probably be more effective with the revolver than with the semi-auto.

Anyone, with practice, can be as fast with a revolver as with a semi-auto. Virtually all PPC competitors (the ones who win or score decently, anyway) prefer the revolver because it doesn't jam.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #53 on: March 19, 2010, 11:43:02 AM »
that guy in the video is some freak.....

He's a champion for sure. However, I know a couple dozen guys that are close to his speed. Go to any PPC competition and you'll meet dozens like that, too.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #54 on: March 19, 2010, 01:17:47 PM »
"prefer the revolver because it doesn't jam"
 
well at least we can agree on one thing....the jamming

but I do not agree that the average joe public
can shoot a revolver nearly as fast as a semi-automatic

i have revolvers because if you got some whack job
chasing you or breaking down your front door the one
thing you don't want is the gun to jam
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #55 on: March 19, 2010, 02:23:51 PM »
but I do not agree that the average joe public
can shoot a revolver nearly as fast as a semi-automatic

We're not talking about "Joe Public" - we're talking about someone who wants to commit mass deaths. That someone would have practiced.

As I have said many times - WITH PRACTICE a person can shoot and reload a revolver as fast as a semi-automatic. "Joe Public" doesn't typically practice.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Michael Tee

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #56 on: March 19, 2010, 04:34:41 PM »
<<We're not talking about "Joe Public" - we're talking about someone who wants to commit mass deaths. That someone would have practiced.>>

You're assuming the guy would have the same appreciation of the value of practice as you do.  It's an invalid assumption, considering that if he were inclined to commit mass murder, he would not necessarily be functioning with a full deck and might figure all he needs to do is to upgrade the arsenal.  You're entitled to make whatever assumptions you like, but don't expect the police, whose lives are on the line, to follow you through all your twistings and rationalizations.  For the police, what the guy's boss told them (and I'm reasonably sure that they don't just lap up and swallow whatever their informants or complainants tell them, with zero witness evaluation skill) including or with the addition of: the weapons upgrades, the recent lay-off, the "very disgruntled" comments all added up to:  "Let's not just walk up the front walk and ring the doorbell."

You and Prince can second-guess them with your silly nit-picking till the cows come home, but I'm reasonably certain they did the right thing and there's a reasonably good possibility that they are all (including the subject of the investigation) alive today because of it.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #57 on: March 19, 2010, 04:47:51 PM »
We're not talking about "Joe Public" - we're talking about someone who wants to commit
mass deaths. That someone would have practiced.

We are?

I would think things like road rage and/or someone losing their temper and killing people
at work....or catching their wife cheating and killing the whole family...ect are not always
long planned out affairs......I do know that if I had to choose which gun to face if
someone ran into our office shooting....I would much prefer to face a revolver than
a semi-auto holding more bullets....without the jamming I think semi's have
greater potential in most situations to be more lethal to more people. The people
that probably practice the most...the military & the police...mainly switched to
semi-autos many years ago.




"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

sirs

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #58 on: March 19, 2010, 04:54:38 PM »
Because the military and police are legally allowed to purchase and carry pistols with high capacity magazines.  Not to mention the automatic weapons they're also outfitted to carry
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Amianthus

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Re: "Instead of being reactive, we took a proactive approach."
« Reply #59 on: March 19, 2010, 05:12:26 PM »
We are?

I would think things like road rage and/or someone losing their temper and killing people
at work

Yes, we are. We're talking about someone who went home, then later on bought guns, and still later on was arrested. They obviously thought he was planning something, not acting out of rage or loss of temper.

We're also talking about a civil engineer, which usually have "planning obsessive" personalities.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)