The Chub n Chief

[sirs]

If you can't answer that, when it's already been answered adnauseum for you, can't help you Bt.  Suffice to say, it isn't about religious intolerance aimed at Muslims, nor trying to replace the above issue of American intolerance by muslims behind the building of this mosque with "all muslims are radicals" BS

Actually that is exactly what it is.

Actually it's not....which is why you keep being debunked when you try to insert that which it is not

IF it were about religious intolerance about muslims or some implied all Muslims are radicals BS, then the rhetoric would be along the lines of
- Muslims should not be allowed to practice their religion here in the U.S.
- Muslims should be required to go thru some form of legislative loophole in order to build a mosque, anywhere they wish, within the borders of this country
- Muslims should be made to indentify themselves as Muslims (I mean if they have nothing to hide, why shouldn't they, right?)
- All Mosques should be placed under "protective" surveillance, by law enforcement

And other garbage like that...IF this were about such non-presented BS of religious intolerance aimed at Muslims

This whole nonsense about insensitivity on the part of the Park51 Muslims is nonsense

Actually that is exactly what it is

why should they be sensitive to folks who lump them in with a sub group of Islam that they have no link with.

Asked and answered already.  Having the right to build does not equate to being the right thing to build it in the shadow of where thousands were murdered in the name of their religion...link or no link.

[BT]

So because some reparations fool says you as a white man owe him money, you had best pay up because it's his perception that counts and not the reality of the situation.

Gotcha.

[sirs]

Nice try.  That's referred to as apples and orangutans, as no one I'm aware of is demanding that Muslims owe anything to anyone, which is what the deflection on reparations would be all about.  You're not trying to put a monetary amount on "sensitivity and tolerance" are you??  That would indeed be quite ridiculous...on far too many levels I could respond to.  

I'll look forward to when you can actually provide some rhetoric that backs up your continuned non-existant conclusion

[BT]

You are the one who is arguing that the perception of the opposition to Park51 trumps the reality of whether complicity exists amongst the builders of Park51 to the 9-11 attack.

I simply asked whether perception trumping reality was a universal truism. Money need not change hands.

[sirs]

LOL...you're the one trying to argue that demanding that people pay into some general African American fund equates to not supporting the notion of an Islamic Mosque being built so near where thousands of Americans were murdered in the name of Islam.  Do you see how ridiculous that is??

You're also the one that has yet to present anything remotely resembling rhetoric or actions that could even possibly be construed as being intolerant to Islam or Muslims in general.  And as such, we don't even meander into the all muslims are radicals nonsense

[BT]

You are the one who is arguing that the perception of the opposition to Park51 trumps the reality of whether complicity exists amongst the builders of Park51 to the 9-11 attack.

I simply asked whether perception trumping reality was a universal truism.

Please answer whether that is your position.

A simple yes or no will do.

[sirs]

I'm asking for a demonstration of where this supposed rhetorical and/or actionable muslim intolerance is, that you claim is "exactly what it is", and have yet to see such.  Get back to me when you have some, then we can entertain some of your hypotheticals.

A simple example will do

[BT]

What they are is grossly insensitive and intolerant to America and those thousands of families who lost loved ones, at the hands of radicals/terrorists that murdered them in the name of their religion.

[sirs]

You understand who the "they" is right?  Lemme give you a hint, it's NOT all Muslims, or even "most Muslims".  It is specific to those muslims AND non-muslims who demand that this Mosque be built right where the proposed sight is, and the rest of America can go pound sand

Next "example" to be shot down, please

[BT]

You don't get it, do you.

Why should anyone bow down to FALSE associations? Why should anyone cave in to any group that has an axe to grind. Especially an American of any religion.

[sirs]

And you don't get it...no one's asking anyone to bow down.  Merely asking for a little tolerance to what happened to America, and move the mosque just a tad further away, given the events of 911.  Nothing more, and no reference what-so-ever to "all muslims are radicals", or even most.  Is that too hard to ask?  Or is it your position that most, if not all Muslims want this Mosque built right there at the proposed site, and everyone else can go pound sand? 

Is asking for a little sensitivity to those thousands murdered in the name of their religion, and their families still living with the grief & sorrow, and moving the mosque a mere few more blocks away, just too damn radical a concept??

Figuring out yet how this has nothing to do with intolerance aimed at Muslims, yet??  Quite the contrary, ironically, as it's far more intolerance aimed at Americans.  Oh sure, they have the right to such intolerance.  Doesn't make it right though

[BT]

And you don't get it...no one's asking anyone to bow down.  Merely asking for a little tolerance to what happened to America, and move the mosque just a tad further away, given the events of 911.  Nothing more, and no reference what-so-ever to "all muslims are radicals", or even most.  Is that too hard to ask?  Or is it your position that most, if not all Muslims want this Mosque built right there at the proposed site, and everyone else can go pound sand?   

Sure they are. The opposition to the center are in effect saying that because followers of Islam flew into the buildings that the mere sight of followers of Islam within walking distance of Ground Zero is just too painful a reminder of their loss.  And any Muslim with an ounce of sensitivity should respect that.

 

[Plane]

You don't get it, do you.

Why should anyone bow down to FALSE associations? Why should anyone cave in to any group that has an axe to grind. Especially an American of any religion.

I think that people who beleive  reparations are appropriate have a right to say so.

People who beleive reparations are a bad idea have a right to say so.

From your position which of these sets of people should be shutting up?

Should shutting them up have the force of law?

I think we have repeated often enough (that you should have noticed) that the folks who want to build the GZ mosque have a right to do so.

Much as we have a right to point out that this is perceived as crass , insinsitive and counterproductive and self defeating to any good purpose.

Now if radical Islamists like actual members of Al Queida were wanting to build any sort of gathering place in New York , they would have no right to do so. Anything that the Al Quieda owns  in US territory ought to be confiscated , if not burnt down along with occupants.
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Supertangent !
http://www.thekingcenter.org/

http://www.nps.gov/malu/index.htm

Atlanta has a lovely park dedicated to the memory of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

Hypotheticly , the Sons of the Confederacy has the right to build on the next block a large showy tribute to the valorous Confederate Navy, life size replicas of the CSS Alabama , the Hunley, CSS Virginia and exibits of intrest concerning the Confederacy and its Navy.

Hey , we have the right to build it , and we ourselves are not guilty of anything at all , we ought to go on an build it because perception counts for nothing.

[sirs]

touche', Plane

[Xavier_Onassis]

Hypotheticly , the Sons of the Confederacy has the right to build on the next block a large showy tribute to the valorous Confederate Navy, life size replicas of the CSS Alabama , the Hunley, CSS Virginia and exibits of intrest concerning the Confederacy and its Navy.

Hey , we have the right to build it , and we ourselves are not guilty of anything at all , we ought to go on an build it because perception counts for nothing.
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 Yes, of course, by all means build it.

The problem would be getting someone to pay for it. I agree that it is entirely legal. And hardly anything deserves more adulation and respect for a job well done than the Confederate Navy.

When can we get funding for a Mormon War Monument in Salt Lake City?