Author Topic: Solicitor General Elena Kagan  (Read 12408 times)

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BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2010, 09:18:39 PM »
Bush nominated 3 people for the court.

Harriet Miers didn't make the cut as much because of dissent from conservatives as there was from the dems.


sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2010, 09:53:11 PM »
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And you can hide behind the "no one was denied access" BS
Kind of like Blacks weren't denied water with "black only" fountains.

I'm not hiding behind anything. You don't like her, i get that.  The fact is that her role in banning military recruiters on campus has been exaggerated

How is it being exaggerated?  If it wasn't for a unanimous court ruling, she would have had the recruiters eliminated from campus
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #17 on: May 10, 2010, 09:59:49 PM »
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If it wasn't for a unanimous court ruling, she would have had the recruiters eliminated from campus

She limited access when the Circuit courts ruled that colleges could do that, she allowed full access when Scotus overruled the Circuit court.

Is your problem with her or the circuit courts that ruled wrongly?



sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #18 on: May 10, 2010, 11:02:01 PM »
My problem is without the court's ruling(s), Military recruiters would have been completely eliminated
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #19 on: May 10, 2010, 11:11:29 PM »
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My problem is without the court's ruling(s), Military recruiters would have been completely eliminated

You are misinformed.

She acted based on the 3rd Circuits opinion , Scotus said no. She didn't restrict recruiters until the 3rd said she could and she stopped once Scotus ruled. The courts are at the base of both actions.


sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2010, 11:16:51 PM »
No, I don't believe so.  She made a decision to ban recruiters, period, law be damned.  That lead to the Appealate court ruling unanimously 8-0 that she was wrong, and acted unlawfully, if not unconstitutionally.  SCOTUS simply put the icing on the cake, with their no
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #21 on: May 11, 2010, 12:51:05 AM »
 I have been listening to NPR.

Many times today I heard said that this appointment will not change the balance of a right leaning court.


Who are they kidding?

She is quite young for a Justice , her appointment would establish, confirm ,  and ossify a leftist leaning core that the public will have to put up with for fifty years.

There isn't much chance that President Obama will appoint a moderate or anything less than a socialist really , but may we insist that the canadates be quite well experienced? In other words ; Old?

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2010, 01:00:43 AM »
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No, I don't believe so.

I suggest you recheck your timeline.


sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2010, 02:36:58 AM »
I suggest we recheck the facts, and more importantly, her intentions
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2010, 02:52:02 AM »
I suggest we recheck the facts, and more importantly, her intentions

Perhaps this will help:

Two laws at issue

The dispute involved two laws: the 1993 "don't ask, don't tell" statute, which excluded openly gay or lesbian soldiers, and the 1996 Solomon Amendment, which barred federal funding to any institution that denied equal access to military recruiters.

The amendment was seldom enforced until 2001, when the Bush administration threatened to cut off funds to any college whose law school restricted military recruitment.

Harvard, which stood to lose $328 million in federal aid, opened its doors to armed forces recruiters the following year. It had previously barred them under a 1979 university policy denying access to employers who discriminated based on sexual orientation. The Association of American Law Schools adopted a similar policy in 1990.
Free-speech question

Kagan became dean in 2003, and at first maintained military recruiters' access to the law school. But she barred them after a federal appeals court declared in 2004 that the Solomon Amendment appeared to violate law schools' freedom of speech by forcing them to spread an anti-gay message they opposed.

The Bush administration appealed to the Supreme Court while renewing its warning of a funding cutoff. Kagan, whose school was not involved in the court case, readmitted military recruiters before the high court issued a ruling, an action she told Harvard students she regretted.


"I believe the military's discriminatory employment policy is deeply wrong - both unwise and unjust," she said in a message to the student body. "And this wrong tears at the fabric of our own community by denying an opportunity to some of our students that others of our students have."
Court unanimous

Kagan and other law school deans signed a brief urging the Supreme Court to overturn the Solomon Amendment, but the court unanimously upheld the law in March 2006. Military recruiters don't impose their message on law schools, which remain free to criticize government policy, Chief Justice John Roberts said in the court ruling.

Kagan has taken pains since then to stress her support for the armed forces while opposing its policy on gays and lesbians. In a recent speech at West Point, she expressed awe at the cadets' courage and dedication while lamenting the continuing conflict between the military and law schools.

Meanwhile, the Justice Department is defending "don't ask, don't tell" in a federal court in Riverside, despite Obama's opposition to the policy.

Kagan - who promised senators last year to defend the law if it was challenged - does not handle lower-court proceedings such as the Riverside case. But it is likely to come up at her confirmation hearing.

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/05/10/BANF1DCC84.DTL#ixzz0nb5liLg1

sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #25 on: May 11, 2010, 03:19:34 AM »
Thanks for the heads up, Bt
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2010, 08:03:34 AM »
"Kagan became dean in 2003, and at first maintained military recruiters' access to the law school.
But she barred them after a federal appeals court declared in 2004 that the Solomon Amendment
appeared to violate law schools' freedom of speech by forcing them to spread an anti-gay message
they opposed"...The Bush administration appealed to the Supreme Court while renewing its warning
of a funding cutoff. Kagan, whose school was not involved in the court case, readmitted military
recruiters before the high court issued a ruling, an action she told Harvard students she regretted.
Kagan and other law school deans signed a brief urging the Supreme Court to overturn the Solomon
Amendment, but the court unanimously upheld the law in March 2006.


In other words...she would ban them if she could.





« Last Edit: May 11, 2010, 09:50:03 AM by ChristiansUnited4LessGvt »
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BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2010, 10:48:24 AM »
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In other words...she would ban them if she could.

In other words the rule of law means more to her than her personal feelings towards the Don't Ask Don't Tell Policy.

In other words, maintaining federal funding to an institution she is in charge of is more important than her personal feelings towards Don't Ask Don't Tell Policy.

In other words she is more a pragmatist than an idealist.

In other words, the left has more reason for disappointment than the right has for fear.



sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #28 on: May 11, 2010, 10:58:43 AM »
Except of course when she's in a position to make ultimate decisions based on her idealism.  I remeber as a tennis player for my University, the decisions I felt were "bad" being made by my coach.  But they were the coach's, and I had to deal with it.  Then I became coach.  My word became the law.  I see a similar dynamic here, but on a much grander and repercussive scale
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #29 on: May 11, 2010, 11:08:27 AM »
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My word became the law.  I see a similar dynamic here, but on a much grander and repercussive scale

She was more autonomous as President of the Harvard Law School than she will be as a sitting justice (1 of 9) on the Supreme Court.