Author Topic: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site  (Read 2880 times)

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Amianthus

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Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« on: October 26, 2007, 11:39:34 AM »
International Herald Tribune
By William J. Broad and Mark Mazzetti
Thursday, October 25, 2007


Satellite imagery of a facility in Syria collected on August 10, 2007, left, and October 24. (DigitalGlobe)

New commercial satellite photos show that a Syrian site believed to have been attacked by Israel last month no longer bears any obvious traces of what some analysts said appeared to have been a partly built nuclear reactor.

Two photos, taken Wednesday from space by rival companies, show the site near the Euphrates River to have been wiped clean since August, when imagery showed a tall square building there measuring about 150 feet on a side.

The Syrians reported an attack by Israel in early September; the Israelis have not confirmed that. Senior Syrian officials continue to deny that a nuclear reactor was under construction, insisting that Israel hit a largely empty military warehouse.

But the images, federal and private analysts say, suggest that the Syrian authorities rushed to dismantle the facility after the strike, calling it a tacit admission of guilt.

"It's a magic act ? here today, gone tomorrow," a senior intelligence official said. "It doesn't lower suspicions; it raises them. This was not a long-term decommissioning of a building, which can take a year. It was speedy. It's incredible that they could have gone to that effort to make something go away."

Any attempt by Syrian authorities to clean up the site would make it difficult, if not impossible, for international weapons inspectors to determine the exact nature of the activity there. Officials from the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna have said they hoped to analyze the satellite images and ultimately inspect the site in person. David Albright, president of the Institute for Science and International Security, a private group in Washington that released a report on the Syrian site earlier this week, said the expurgation of the building was inherently suspicious.

"It looks like Syria is trying to hide something and destroy the evidence of some activity," Albright said in an interview. "But it won't work. Syria has got to answer questions about what it was doing."

The striking difference in the satellite photos surprised even some outside experts who were skeptical that Syria might be developing a nuclear program.

"It's clearly very suspicious," said Joseph Cirincione, an expert on nuclear proliferation at the Center for American Progress in Washington. "The Syrians were up to something that they clearly didn't want the world to know about."

Cirincione said the photographic evidence "tilts toward a nuclear program" but does not prove that Syria was building a reactor. Besides, he said, even if it was developing a nuclear program, Syria would be years away from being operational, and thus not an imminent threat.

Gordon Johndroe, a White House spokesman, declined to comment on the satellite pictures.

The new satellite images of the Syrian site were taken by DigitalGlobe, in Longmont, Colorado, and SPOT Image Corporation, in Chantilly, Virginia. They show just a smooth, unfurrowed area where the large building once stood.

The desolate Syrian site is located on the eastern bank of the Euphrates River some 90 miles north of the Iraqi border and 7 miles north of the desert village of At Tibnah. An airfield lies nearby. The new images reveal that the tall building is gone but still show a secondary structure and a pumping station on the Euphrates. Reactors need water for cooling.

The purported reactor at the site is believed to be modeled on a North Korean model, which uses buildings a few feet longer on each side than the Syrian building that vanished.

Albright called the Syrian site "consistent with being a North Korean reactor design." Imad Moustapha, the Syrian ambassador to the United States, denied in an interview last week with The Dallas Morning News that his country was trying to build a reactor.

"There is no Syrian nuclear program whatsoever," he said. "It's an absolutely blatant lie."

Later in the interview, he said, "We understand that if Syria even contemplated nuclear technology, then the gates of hell would open on us."

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/10/26/africa/26syria.php
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Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2007, 11:56:28 AM »
Yep, that's very suspicious.  There was a tall, square building there then it was bombed and then they cleaned up the rubble.  Sure looks like they were building a nuclear reactor to me.

<<The desolate Syrian site is located on the eastern bank of the Euphrates River some 90 miles north of the Iraqi border and 7 miles north of the desert village of At Tibnah. An airfield lies nearby. The new images reveal that the tall building is gone but still show a secondary structure and a pumping station on the Euphrates. Reactors need water for cooling.>>

Absolutely that's how we know it's a nuclear reactor.  It needs water.  Tall square buildings in "desolate sites" near desert villages don't need water.  Only nuclear reactors need water.

_JS

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2007, 12:16:38 PM »
I have to be honest, the first thing that came to mind were the photos and satellite evidence that absolutely proved that Iraq had WMD beyond a shadow of a doubt. I remember seeing Powell at the U.N. running his little slide show.

I'm not impressed.

Besides, you don't throw up a shack and produce U-235 like it is a meth lab. It requires a number of very specially crafted and well-machined centrifuges all working in extremely well-controlled conditions. Simply having water for cooling is proof of nothing.

If Israel has real evidence then let them present it to the United Nations.
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Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2007, 03:18:58 PM »
<<I have to be honest, the first thing that came to mind were the photos and satellite evidence that absolutely proved that Iraq had WMD beyond a shadow of a doubt. I remember seeing Powell at the U.N. running his little slide show.>>

Some of us can remember Powell showing the UN faked satellite photos of Iraqi troops "massing" on the "Saudi border" before the first Gulf War.

The American people have a saying:  Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice, shame on you.  Fool me three times, shame on you.  Fool me four times, shame on you.  Fool me five times, . . .  etc.  They're absolutely amazing.  They are ASKING to be lied to, suckered and conned.  So in a way, they deserve whatever they get.

Amianthus

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2007, 03:45:49 PM »
Some of us can remember Powell showing the UN faked satellite photos of Iraqi troops "massing" on the "Saudi border" before the first Gulf War.

Really? I thought they were never shown to anyone (except the Saudis), because they're still classified?
« Last Edit: October 26, 2007, 03:57:22 PM by Amianthus »
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Plane

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2007, 04:05:53 PM »
<<I have to be honest, the first thing that came to mind were the photos and satellite evidence that absolutely proved that Iraq had WMD beyond a shadow of a doubt. I remember seeing Powell at the U.N. running his little slide show.>>

Some of us can remember Powell showing the UN faked satellite photos of Iraqi troops "massing" on the "Saudi border" before the first Gulf War.

The American people have a saying:  Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice, shame on you.  Fool me three times, shame on you.  Fool me four times, shame on you.  Fool me five times, . . .  etc.  They're absolutely amazing.  They are ASKING to be lied to, suckered and conned.  So in a way, they deserve whatever they get.


What a relief,I thought that that mass of troops suffered enourmously , glad to know no one was there.

Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2007, 04:08:44 PM »
<<What a relief,I thought that that mass of troops suffered enourmously , glad to know no one was there.>>

Powell was using faked satellite photos.  The fraud was exposed by the St. Petersburg (Florida) Times, which paid $5,000 for satellite photos from a commercial source, taken of the same place at the same time, showing no troops at all.

Plane

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2007, 04:17:45 PM »
<<What a relief,I thought that that mass of troops suffered enourmously , glad to know no one was there.>>

Powell was using faked satellite photos.  The fraud was exposed by the St. Petersburg (Florida) Times, which paid $5,000 for satellite photos from a commercial source, taken of the same place at the same time, showing no troops at all.


Call up google earth and look it over , it is amazeing , but you can't see a person on it anywhere , the scale is too gross with the comercially availible pictures. You might see something the size of a car and recognise it as a car but that is about as well as you can do.

So what does a man in a foxhole look like in a comercial satalite photo?

Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2007, 06:43:50 PM »
Call up google earth and look it over , it is amazeing , but you can't see a person on it anywhere , the scale is too gross with the comercially availible pictures. You might see something the size of a car and recognise it as a car but that is about as well as you can do.

So what does a man in a foxhole look like in a comercial satalite photo?

===========================================================================

When you pay $5,000 for sat photos, you are not "calling up Google Earth."  I'm told there are satellite pictures from which one can read the licence plate numbers on cars.  Be that as it may, it seemed that Powell had no credibility problem when he showed the fake photos.  He wasn't using Google Earth in his presentation, and I guess the St. Petersburg Times wasn't using it in theirs either.  It seemed to be pretty well accepted fact that troops would show in satellite photos taken for the U.S. military or even for a good commercial service.

Plane

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2007, 10:20:59 PM »
Call up google earth and look it over , it is amazeing , but you can't see a person on it anywhere , the scale is too gross with the comercially availible pictures. You might see something the size of a car and recognise it as a car but that is about as well as you can do.

So what does a man in a foxhole look like in a comercial satalite photo?

===========================================================================

When you pay $5,000 for sat photos, you are not "calling up Google Earth."  I'm told there are satellite pictures from which one can read the licence plate numbers on cars.  Be that as it may, it seemed that Powell had no credibility problem when he showed the fake photos.  He wasn't using Google Earth in his presentation, and I guess the St. Petersburg Times wasn't using it in theirs either.  It seemed to be pretty well accepted fact that troops would show in satellite photos taken for the U.S. military or even for a good commercial service.


So again I say what a relief , I thought those guys died in droves, if they wern't there they weren't killed.

Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2007, 11:29:22 PM »
<<So again I say what a relief , I thought those guys died in droves, if they wern't there they weren't killed.>>

You're a riot, plane.  I bet that's what you said when there were no WMD found in Iraq, what a relief, if he had 'em, he woulda used 'em and we all woulda died in droves.

Plane

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2007, 05:50:01 PM »
<<So again I say what a relief , I thought those guys died in droves, if they wern't there they weren't killed.>>

You're a riot, plane.  I bet that's what you said when there were no WMD found in Iraq, what a relief, if he had 'em, he woulda used 'em and we all woulda died in droves.


He did have them , but neither you nor I know where they went , or even when they went.

Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2007, 05:57:30 PM »
<<He did have them [WMD], but neither you nor I know where they went , or even when they went.>>

LOL.  So, without arguing the point - - because it's been beaten to death, and we are never going to agree on it - - except to note how ridiculous it is - - I guess you found it "quite a relief" that none of those "WMD" were used on you or you family.  All's well that ends well, eh plane?

Plane

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2007, 02:00:55 AM »
<<He did have them [WMD], but neither you nor I know where they went , or even when they went.>>

LOL.  So, without arguing the point - - because it's been beaten to death, and we are never going to agree on it - - except to note how ridiculous it is - - I guess you found it "quite a relief" that none of those "WMD" were used on you or you family.  All's well that ends well, eh plane?


How do you know the WMD question is settled?

We know Saddams regime had the ability to make WMD in the late eightys , and we know he used them.

We also know he had bought a lot more tonns of precursors than we have ever found .

We just do not know if they were disposed of harmlessly or not.

Michael Tee

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Re: Photos show cleansing of suspect Syrian site
« Reply #14 on: October 28, 2007, 02:11:32 AM »
How do you know the WMD question is settled?

We know Saddams regime had the ability to make WMD in the late eightys , and we know he used them.

We also know he had bought a lot more tonns of precursors than we have ever found .

We just do not know if they were disposed of harmlessly or not.
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We know that Saddam presented a massive accounting of his WMD as requested by the UN wherein relatively few items were unaccounted for.  The number of items unaccounted for, by all reputable accounts published, was consistent with the length of time over which the WMD programs were operating, the number of WMD involved, the number of the various storage and operational sites through which the weapons had to be tracked, and systemic failures and human error.  We know further that no significant stores of WMD were ever found, despite intensive searches for them.


<<We also know he had bought a lot more tonns of precursors than we have ever found .>>

That is just more rambling bullshit.  "a lot more tons" is meaningless.  "Precursors" is meaningless.  Chlorine is a precursor.  Probably white bread could be a precursor if you have an ingenious enough chemist.  If the accounting demanded by the UN included precursors, he has accounted satisfactorily for precursors.  If the UN did not ask him to account for precursors, the whole issue is irrelevant.