DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: kimba1 on December 21, 2014, 11:47:17 PM
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http://nypost.com/2014/12/20/2-nypd-cops-shot-execution-style-in-brooklyn/
thiers a line and it has been crossed. I`ve tried very hard to understand both sides and before this I was thinking that police chief was acting like a douche. but now all bets are off. everything is screwed up . fuck this shit..
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When you have folks that will consistently disregards the facts of a situation, such as tragic accidents where the victim happened to be black, and push a racist agenda, literally declaring how blacks are being targeted by law enforcement, and you combine that with an ever growing culture of disrespecting authority, this is exactly what's going to happen. I so agree with you Kimba, yet, until we get a leader, who can rightly reference what's actually happening, vs what certain folks want it to be, not sure what else we can do, outside of better defend ourselves
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a week earlier the protesters we`re chanting kill cops
after the verdict the father said burn this muther or something similar.
all I gotta say to the protesters good luck whatever the fuck your point is.
I made an observation that was quite sympathetic to them but this totally screwed it. it did not counter what I observed but it overwhelmed any justification. meaning good luck on the next protest.
funny the people of ferguson is now asking for peace .
but hey I could be totally wrong and by Tuesday we all say bygones. it could happen.......
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http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/protest-leaders-hurry-to-disavow-nypd-slayings/ar-BBh5nHi
Is it time to stop playing this music and get off this bandwagon?
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not confirm but possible another cop killing happened if it`s tied to this .... things are getting tensed right now. of course now I see articles we need to stop blaming and focus on the original killings.
ha
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this just popped in my head
not saying it`s what`s happening but thiers a vague precedence.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Brown_(abolitionist)
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Gun nuts who decide to execute a bunch of kids are said toe just unbalanced and crazy, but somehow, this guy who was obviously crazy as a loon, somehow needed the Mayor of NY to set him off.
If he was actually after revenge for the choking death of the cigarette seller, he would have sought out the specific cop and killed him. This guy was just nuts.
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Gun nuts who decide to execute a bunch of kids are said toe just unbalanced and crazy, but somehow, this guy who was obviously crazy as a loon, somehow needed the Mayor of NY to set him off.
If he was actually after revenge for the choking death of the cigarette seller, he would have sought out the specific cop and killed him. This guy was just nuts.
He was more than nuts, he was primed, and just needed someone to light the fuse. No, as much as he might have wanted to find that specific person he would have not sought out the specific person, since that would require some form of detective work, which rarely does some nut possess. He likely crew up hating the police and any other authority figure. I bet he didn't have a father to raise him. all he needed was a rationalized excuse to cross the line. And following the rhetoric that Kimba highlighted, he got the necessary fuse to be lit, by the likes of those who are erroneously proclaiming how the Police don't care about black lives.
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it`s abit late on why this happens , people should be now acknowledging this is bad and try not to increase the body count on both sides. any bets we`re gonna hear another shooting before x-mas?
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I bet we will as well. The fuse has been lit, and the "environment" is just right. I'm guessing that the phrase "burn this muther down" is going on in several twisted minds, who have been told that black lives down't matter, and that the police are targeting them
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don`t like saying this but some of the police are acting more douchier because of this. but that`s what I`m saying about a line that shouldn`t be crossed. this may get real bad.
now I`m talking real gloomy right now but that doesn`t mean I want to be right and totally love been wrong and they all can just say" whoa lets think about what we`re doing now before it gets worst. " I don`t really see bothsides thinking this
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I misspoke
Michael brown`s father actually said" burn this bitch down'
I was thinking of a phrase from one of my favorite movie instead
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thiers a line and it has been crossed.
I agree....
Obama, DeBlasio, and the other racebaiters have blood on their hands.
DeBlasio should resign immediately!
I loved it when the NY Cops turned their back on this slimeball as he walked past.
(http://s3.postimg.org/5wk4ifssz/support_bumper_sticker.jpg)
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DeBlasio did not tell anyone to shoot any cops, and he won't be resigning, either.
To suggest that perhaps choking an unarmed man for selling single cigarettes is anti-cop is simply absurd.
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DeBlasio did not tell anyone to shoot any cops, and he won't be resigning, either.
To suggest that perhaps choking an unarmed man for selling single cigarettes is anti-cop is simply absurd.
DeBlasio accused the police in general of being racists and said he warned his son against them, I don't think he ever mentioned making the tax on cigarettes more reasonable he shares the blame with a lot of more anonymous people who have been having fun chanting threats at the police recently.
The authorities in Georgia have a bit of blame to accept also, the shooter was arrested fifteen times for petty crimes while he lived in Georgia. But he was only locked up for two years. Was it impossible to tell how dangerous this guy was? Was there too much reluctance to prosecute ? Was there too little resource for diagnosis and treatment?
I think this guys family tried hard to get him away from the toxic urban environment , but Georgia was not enough, and he went back to the big city to kill and die.
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And yet, with all the gun laws we have, and the extensive restrictions they have in the north east, this fella managed to be carrying a full sized Taurus 9MM, (Beretta look-alike) with 17round magazine capacity. Now, folks who press that these weapons carry no more than 10, will ignore the fact that this thug not only was illegally carrying the weapon, he only fired 4 rounds at the officers.
In other words, NOTHING that the left had been pushing as it relates to push for added gun control measures, would have stopped this assassination. of these 2 officers.
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not really sure the word race baiter should be used it might get used in case real racism happen and it`ll get ignored as trivial. you really can`t say it`s not a serious matter . just that the term racist has been incredibly co-oped . somebody recently stated that racisim can only apllied to somebody in power but then I got doubts if I were to do something negative to someone of color I`ll not be called racist. I`m definitely not somebody of power so how about that factor.
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................ somebody recently stated that racisim can only apllied to somebody in power......................
I have heard that before , I always thought it silly.
A person out of power today might be in power tomorrow and out of power next week.
Does his racism appear and disappear with his level of clout?
Adolf Hitler was a nationalist and a racist and several other things, that he used to ride from a position of little power to a position of great power.
The KKK rose rapidly , fell and rose again and have fallen even further into ineffectiveness presently, does their present ridiculous level of influence relive them of their racism? If they manage to rise into major power again it will be because the nation wants some more racism in the future as it wants less presently.
I just would not define racism that way.
If a person uses the categorization of race as a primary means of evaluating people and situation then that person is exhibiting strong racism.
If a person uses race as a secondary or tertiary means of separating and evaluating people and situations then he is exhibiting a weaker form of racism.
The difference is a matter of degree, I think the number of persons that are descendants of Gingus Khan is interesting , but I would consider this information less important than the personal history of an individual that I was going to accept as a customer or supplier or employee or employer.
Someone who thought this ancestry more important to know than anything specific to the individual would be exhibiting a strong , unreasoned and I think harmful racism.
Just as unhelpful for an employer as an employee? Perhaps not , the amount of power does influence the outward expression and effect of the racism , all else being (ironically) equal.
This time we are talking about the people of the public and the persons of the police, who is whose servant? On which side would a racist attitude be harmless?
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http://www.goblinscomic.org/10142005/
I have liked this definition of racism for a few years now.
"The category you place this creature in holds more importance to you than the individual creature..."
The reason to call "race-baiting" is that police brutality or police err or poorly trained police is a problem that does not require racism .
Have you heard about the guy in Atlanta who was woken by the police and shot to death in his home? Same race shooting so it is less in the news. That is a media bias.
http://the7thpwr.wordpress.com/accidental-police-shootings/
This is a lot more complex than "us vs them" the police are mostly good guys with an unreasonably tough job. The public is mostly harmless to the police. Most of us are glad that the police are on the job .
But if one in an hundred policemen are stupid , this is a pretty good ratio for human beings , but enough to be a problem because of the authority invested.
If one in ten of the regular public is pretty dim I would not be surprised , but less than three in an hundred of us really needs to be locked up , but who is going to do that if not the police? Can we tolerate having a lot less police working? That small percentage of people who are serious criminals are an impediment and a danger to us all.
Since the nature of a policeman's job is to respond to trouble , he meets the worst of the public constantly and has to be on guard against us all as he should be against the few who are the worst , because the worst are hidden among the rest of us.
The problem has a demographic aspect, hm?
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Anyone with a Black son would do well to warn him not to wise off to the cops. It is good advice to any son, but especially one who is likely to be stereotyped.
DeBlasio said nothing to encourage the nutcase shooter. The shooter had a fight with his girlfriend and shot her in the stomach. At this point, he realized that his life as a free man was over, and he might as well avoid punishment by killing himself. But then, he thought, why go out as just an ordinary woman killer, when he could achieve infamy by taking out a couple of cops and be as well known as Jack the Ripper, Son of Sam, the Zodiac Murderer or some sort of evil legend?
DeBlasio had nothing to do with this gun nut going ape. It is what crazy people do when they arm themselves with guns.
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Wow....could a post be more racist and arrogant, all at the same time :o
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REPORT:
PROTESTERS YELL AT NYPD AT SLAIN OFFICER MEMORIAL
http://www.breitbart.com/video/2014/12/22/report-protesters-yell-at-nypd-at-slain-officer-memorial/
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People can yell legally. It is a free country.
Not that I would ever yell at anyone's funeral.
It is bad manners. Cops shunning the mayor are also bad manners, just less bad.
NYC is not a place noted for good manners.
Breitbart is not a website noted for rational comments. It is the Tawanda Brawley era version of Al Sharpton for rednecks.
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Point being made
Xo's head
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Wow
We're now getting into westbroro baptist reality. Not smart. Note due to the medium we're getting our data we are not allowed to assume it's a major portion of either crowds. But sadly thats hardly what effect this progression we're seeing.
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Breitbart is not a website noted for rational comments.
The reporter was and interview was from CNN.....
demonization of messenger does not work in this case.
Next?
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Next will be more deflection efforts, like proclaiming how the mayor never called on anyone to shoot police officers.....as if that was ever claimed to begin with. And that there's nothing really behind such funeral protests outside of simply exercising one's free speech
Here's a hint why the officers turned their back on the mayor...he publically implied that police officers are racist. What street officer and detective is going to be ok with that?? As Thomas Sowell accurately opined, no politician in the country has done more to play the race card against the police and spread the notion that cops are the big problem in minority communities, then the NYC Mayor. Bad manners my ass
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Wow
We're now getting into westbroro baptist reality. Not smart. Note due to the medium we're getting our data we are not allowed to assume it's a major portion of either crowds. But sadly thats hardly what effect this progression we're seeing.
I agree.
Reports of "crowds" that don't define the size very well make me suspicious too.
In a very large city a small crowd means little.
I would have to guess that most of the people of NYNY don't want to do without their police.
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I would have to guess that most of the people of NYNY don't want to do without their police.
Agreed....
and most of these racebaiters, protesters, and complainers....
if they get into trouble
the first phone call they will make is to the police to come save their ass!
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No one wants to abolish the police in NYC.
There, however, a consensus that strangling a guy for selling single cigarettes is not the appropriate punishment. Most people also understand why a father might tell his son to not wise to the cops. I cannot imagine why this is a negative thing.
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No one was being punished. He resisted arrest, and because of his size, required a number of officers for him to comply. A tragic accident then ensued. He wasn't "punished" for selling illegal cigs, or for being big, of for being black. He wasn't punished at all. He died as a result of an unforeseen accident.
And its garbage like that, proclaiming how he was "punished" by the police that leads to assassinations of police officers, by sick & twisted loons
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The guy was doing something inconsequential and nonthreatening to anyone. He was killed by the incompetent cop and is now dead.
I find it amazing that you see this as proper justice.
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Regardless of what he was doing, what he didn't do was comply with the officers instructions. His non-compliance is what brought about the added force. No one was incompotent, outside of Martin who decided, on his own, that he apparently was above the law in complying with an officers instructions. He's dead because a tragic accident ensued following his noncompliance....period
And the garbage that he was "punished" for it, is exactly the mindset that created the path the assassin took on the 2 unsuspecting officers. I hope you and the mayor are proud with yourselves >:(
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....and before Professor literal tries pulling that card out, NO, that does not translate that I'm claiming you told anyone to do anything. It has to do with the mindset that's being pushed...the idea that the police are racists, that they don't care about black lives, and in fact, target blacks. Couldn't be further from the truth, but to folks like the NYC Mayor, and yourself, truth is irrelevent. Facts mean nothing, unless they can be manipulated to push a specific agenda. And any/all evidence that is contrary to that already made up mind of what had to have happened, must be ignored at all cost
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The policeman was singularly incompetent for using a choke hold and ignoring the guy telling him that he could not breathe,
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Your non-legal, non-law enforcement experience opinion on what was and wasn't necessary to restrain a non-compliant massively large suspect is duly noted
And FYI, not only did the officer remove the choke hold when "the guy" was telling him he couldn't breath, anatomy wise, if someoe can say "they can't breathe", demonstrates that they can in fact breathe. Not that such facts matter to you
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If he could have been able to breathe, he would not have died, dummy.
I suppose you will now claim that he is simply sleeping. It was a "sleeper hold".
The cop killed the guy. Why this delights you is another matter.
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If he could have been able to breathe, he would not have died, dummy.
He didn't die of asphyxiation, moron. If he could talk, he can breathe. Maybe not well, but the biological fact is that he could
The cop killed the guy. Why this delights you is another matter.
And there's the money deflection.....as if I was delighted to see a tragic accident. You can be such an ass. Kill denotes an end goal of trying to end the life of someone/something. And its THAT kind of rhetoric that fuels those who attempt to kill others, such as other innocent police officers. The officer was directly involved in his accidental death. That's the best you're going to be able to accomplish. Using your deflection parameters, apparently the assassination of those 2 officers were completely justified, and even gave you a smile. You need help
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Kill means, "to cause the death of", an entirely accurate description.
Breathe, in the event you have not noticed, involved taking air IN, while speaking involves pushing air OUT.
Try it and you will see. Or try not breathing, and you will also see.
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To talk, requires that you inhale before speaking. That's a biological requirement.
Kill means an INTENT to cause death of. An entirely inaccurate description of what took place in N.Y., but perfectly appropriate to incite nut jobs to retaliate and kill police officers as a supposed justifiable response. You need help
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Kill means, "to cause the death of", an entirely accurate description.
Breathe, in the event you have not noticed, involved taking air IN, while speaking involves pushing air OUT.
Try it and you will see. Or try not breathing, and you will also see.
I have been in a choke hold , speech is impossible , as is moving air in either direction past the blockage .
In a related matter , if you are ever choking on food, there is a prearranged distress signal , which is necessarily a pantomime.
That the guy was speaking demonstrates a clear airway so the "chokehold" is demonstrated to be loose enough that it can't have been the direct cause of death.
However, "I can't breathe" isn't a lie. His complaint was about his distress and difficulty which was proven to be serious by his subsequent collapse and death. Even if the chokehold specifically can't be blamed there was a stress in being arrested by a pile of policemen that was somehow too much for him.
I don't like several things about this situation, but there is not really any evidence present of police maliciousness here, so why is that what should be improved? If there is one thing I would like to have learned and see changed it would be better training for police in recognizing dangerous symptoms and health problems.
There is no means to forbid the police from grappling with arrestees ,but recognizing dangerous respiratory distress and applying oxygen or an ambu bag when needed might be reasonable training and save a dying person every now and then no matter why they are short of breath.
Also having an oxygen bottle in every patrol car would be pretty cheap and would improve such a situation with little training.
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Compliance with the Police officer's initial instructions still proves to be the best treatment for any potential unforeseen tragedy
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Compliance with the Police officer's initial instructions still proves to be the best treatment for any potential unforeseen tragedy
That may be so, but a resisted arrest is not uncommon, there should be good preparation for a bad outcome because it is so likely.
In this particular case there should be a reasonable way to protest an unjust tax.
There needs to be a way for someone who feels singled out and persecuted to appeal against unfair treatment.
It is very hard not to feel a lot of sympathy for the guy.
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Agreed....but the bottom line, is that the officer is required to enforce the law...even laws he may not agree with (Our President should be so in tune with that concept). When Garner decided, on his own. not comply, he escalated the situation that forced a plethora of officers to deal with this gigantic man. Unfortunately, his body couldn't deal with the stress it was put under, as a result of his non compliance. It's truly tragic and hardly some idiotic notion of justice
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The bottom line, is that there were ways to arrest this guy without killing him, and whatever the cop did, killed him as a direct result, and that makes the cop incompetent, because his job is NOT to kill people.
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Yea, and if the fella decides to ignore the officer's instructions, or worse tries to kill them, the officer should just say please....and pray apparently. :o
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It would have been a wiser choice, since no one would have been killed over a petty think like selling single cigarettes.
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Your abilities to read minds and devine the future are no better than your meritless accusations, I'm afraid. Not to mention no law enforcement agency on the globe has as a policy to just keep asking please, and hope there's compliance .... or...... just keep asking please. ::)
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The bottom line, is that there were ways to arrest this guy without killing him.....
Oh?
What do you have in mind?
I can imagine something , but I want to hear your idea first.
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There is pepper spray, or course. There is also just writing him a ticket, as one would for a traffic offense. Selling single cigarettes is hardly the sort of thing anyone should be hauled off to jail for.
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When a person is breaking the law, law enforcement is specific in stopping an ongoing crime. A ticket doesn't stop this specific crime. Your apparent issue is with the legislature that made this a crime. So, what party controls the N.Y. legislature again?
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There is pepper spray, or course. There is also just writing him a ticket, as one would for a traffic offense. Selling single cigarettes is hardly the sort of thing anyone should be hauled off to jail for.
I agree with the giving of a citation, in a courtroom would have been a better venue for his protesting speech.
But this was after being arrested nine times on this particular offense, at some point he was going to be taken in.
If the officers had known he was prone to respiratory failure they might have refrained from piling onto him , but pepper spray in the nose might have been equally bad for causing a dangerous asthma attack.
Tazer might have caused the same problem, not by irritating his respiratory system , but by confusing his circulatory system.
As far as I know there isn't presently a police technique for arrest that is so stress free that it will never cause fatality in the frail.
I recall an old lady that was tackled by a New Orleans policeman because he didn't want her to have a pistol, her resistance was trivial but she was hospitalized .
What I have in mind is reducing the number of total times that the police arrest people.
The responsibility rests in the legislative bodies , things that are not dangerous for the public that members of the public do , should not be so illegal that they require dangerous means of arrest.
The State legislature of NY should hang their heads in shame and rescind the high tobacco tax.
Then every other law that is just not worth the risk and expense of arrest should be revisited and reduced in priority until the priority to arrest is appropriate to the risk to the public .
The idea being that only activities that are likely to injure the public should be worthy of the risk of harm that arrest represents.
If arrests for insignificant offenses are eliminated , there will be less wasted effort for the police and less risk for the public getting arrested , and less risk for the police as well.
This doesn't fix the problem that Michael Brown had , but it might reduce the kind of problem that Eric Garner had.
I have more , but this is a long post already.
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I think that every method that exists for apprehending someone that we presently have will have some rate of fatality and some rate of serious injury.
I have imagined a means of arrest that do not presently exist , and I have several versions. Join in and brainstorm.
1) Virtual arrest. Some people live off the grid , but this is a shrinking minority, if someone is committing an offence that is not immediately harmful, but it is possible to positively identify him , his dependence on society can be exploited to arrest him. An arresting officer could make him aware of his citation with verbal notice on tape or with a written ticket and carbon so that his accounts for power , credit , communication etc. can be attached unless he keeps an appointment with a bailiff. This won't work on the homeless, lets hope this is a small drawback.
2) Envelopment. Dropping a big net on someone isn't stress free, but it is pretty gentle and technology to make big nets work exists already. Nets are topology dependent and will work a lot better on someone standing next to a mailbox than someone running between trees. Nets can be projected with mortars and therefore are able to entangle large numbers of people. Nets are not always going to work but they have potential to fix a portion of the problem.
3)Goo. There are already several versions of sticky foam that can be sprayed on a person which harden and immobilize a person trapped in a cocoon that grows and hardens freezing his joints, or fastening him to objects or the ground. This method bears a risk of asphyxia if the goo hits the face.
4) Drugs. Capture guns have been used on lions and rinos and bears for years , firing a drugged dart it can cause sleep or paralysis in short order. Unfortunately though the fatality rate is pretty low , it is not zero. Like a Tazer it could be useful to have one in quiver of choices but it requires an expert to be safe. An overdose can be fatal a shot to then eye or throat can be fatal, a proper dose properly placed can be fatal if the person shot falls into something hard sharp or suffocating.
5) Drugs again, sleeping gas is a movie staple , but it would not work at all in the wind or rain, and when the Russians tried it in an enclosed and ideal circumstance it had a high rate of overdose. There are not any such drugs that cause zero allergic reaction and the dosage is uncontrolled when delivered through the air.
I have one more idea that is worthy of a post of its own, has anyone heard of a very gentle method of arrest that I have not hit here?
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This is my furthest out idea, so I separated it from the rest.
A cadre of anti-police.
It has already been pointed out that co-operative arrestees are less prone to be injured, I am attempting to come up with a notion for a system of arrest that maximizes this effect.
There is already such a thing as a public defender, a civil servant whose job it is to be the advocate of accused against the attorneys that the government has hired to convict .
What if there were such a thing on the scene of an arrest?
This would have to be a person in good standing with the public , trained in law and negotiation at least as well as a policeman , but empowered to resist the arrest on behalf of the potential arrestee , first by asking "is this arrest really necessary?" ,then to witness the arrest as an advocate of the arrestee.
If this anti-policeman can be persuasive enough that the arrest will feature no abuses, and this becomes a well known feature of the system unresisting arrests will become more the rule.
If abuses happen in spite of the influence of the anti-policeman , the anti-policeman will have a function in the court room to mitigate the plight of the arrested with his testimony and to cause the poorly performing policeman to answer up to a credible accuser in turn.
I don't think this idea would be simple or cheap to implement , getting an advocate for the accused onto the scene of the arrest very promptly would be difficult and expensive.
And imperfect, already we know that sometimes when an arrest is surrounded with witnesses and cameras and microphones it can still go very badly.
But a start on this is already in the training that the police get, we call it negotiation, I am mostly proposing that negotiation be partly done by specialists who consider a low number of arrests , a low number of convictions, as a successful outcome.
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Now I am somehow responsible for the NY State legislature in the warped, dysfunctional mind of sirs.
sirs likes the idea of "comply or die", apparently.
I do not.
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And again Dr Deflection pulls out the idiotic literal card. No Dr Deflection, my point had nothing to do with your omnipotent ability to shape a legislature, however you wish. The point has to do that your complaints wrongly aimed at officers enforcing the law should be at the legislature that passed the law, that officers are sworn to enforce
Not to mention there's no such thing as comply or die, so there's nothing for me to like in that deflection effort. If anything its comply with law enforcement instructions, or else be arrested. And if one resists arrest, then accidents can and do occur
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Hundreds of cops turned their backs to
Mayor de Blasio at Rafael Ramos's funeral today!
(https://scontent-b-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10888911_824943087553127_2149155560824899693_n.jpg?oh=395ffdb46d68df04f3446190513babee&oe=554411BB)
http://abcnews.go.com/US/nypd-officers-turn-back-de-blasio-cops-funeral/story?id=27851746
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Legislators and executives have a greater influence on the law and how it gets enforced than the Police do.
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The cops appear to be both sheep and assholes.
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1013630_823539921026777_1629886814341695030_n.jpg?oh=06902f4966307a77832347ea2c65c2a6&oe=54FC4E9B&__gda__=1430753190_103fee637a8d37004a835c94efdb3cac)
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The cops appear to be both sheep and assholes.
Is a perfect policeman obedient to the executives and legislators elected by the people?
There is a direction to the flow of responsibility.
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The cops appear to be both sheep and assholes.
And what exactly is that supposed to mean? To pick and choose what laws to enforce? Seriously??
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The cops are acting like assholes by turning their backs on the mayor, and they are sheep because they are all acting in unison.
The law is not involved in them doing this,
'
They have a legal right to act like a herd of assholes.
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They turned their backs because their mayor erroneously implied the police force was racist. That makes the mayor the only a-hole in this scenario.
So what's with the sheep slur?
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Being of the ovine persuasion, I am not surprised that you failed to understand the allusion to sheep.
Racist has nothing to do with the Mayor. He did what every father must do, and he was honest enough to admit it.]
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No, I knew exactly what you meant by sheep....which is why I referenced the question regarding what laws they're supposed to enforce, vs what laws they shouldn't. You caught on to that right away, with your avoidance of answering it, and trying to focus on the a-hole angle instead
Racist has everything to do with the mayor, and why he lost an entire police force in the process
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Media Silent on Copy Cat Police Assassination Attempt in North Carolina
Thank God the police officer followed his spidey senses (and training)
A Durham, NC police officer sitting in a parked car saved his own life Thursday night by catching the approach of two men in his squad car's rear-view mirror.
The officer exited his vehicle to confront the pair, when one of the would-be assassins opened fire without saying a word:
A Durham police officer dove for cover Thursday night after a man walked up and began shooting at him, police said Friday.
The incident happened about 10 p.m. on Lakeland Street, just north of Truman Street.
Police said Officer J.T. West was sitting in his patrol car, working on a report, when he saw two men approaching his car from behind.
As West got out of the car to speak to them, one of the men pulled out a gun and began firing, police said.
The man fired six shots at West, striking the patrol car once.
West fired two rounds in return. Police said it wasn't known if West wounded either of the men.
West injured his wrist when he dove behind a staircase at a vacant apartment building at 1414 Lakeland St.
He was treated at a nearby hospital and released.
Police said West and the men, who ran from the scene, never exchanged words.
The attempted assassination mimicked the tactics used to murder NYPD officers Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu on December 20.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/10881613_825826150798154_192759174437907878_n.jpg?oh=2e380253d4a9f9c81d5b68d11f8994f9&oe=54FBF1BC&__gda__=1428965058_f2cb5a32caeb40f24ee314ee0e2a7dd0)
[e-mail]
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This illustrates why it is a bad thing for this country to get involved in lots of wars. It means that the thugs are likely to be much better shots.
It takes some serious training to be a good sniper, so we are lucky that these clowns were insufficiently trained.
But of course, making it easy for them to be armed and dangerous--that is a good thing, right?
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thiers a running gag in action movies about that rogue cop who goes into a situation saying" no time for backup". well recently I heard response time for police has slow greatly due now officers wait till they has enough support to go to any situation. so now in real life the saying is "make time for backup"
I totally don`t blame them and will point out it was never their jobs to risk their lives to those extremes to begin with . we simply lost those bonuses we took for granted til now.
note I must point out the police were never the only targets in this matter firefighters and ambulance are at risk also. so we will see longer response from these services also.
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But of course, making it easy for them to be armed and dangerous--that is a good thing, right?
So, you think there should be a rule against thugs shooting at police?
I am shocked that there is not one already.
Or what sort of rule were you thinking of?
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There should be a rule against shooting anyone.
If the bad guys in the examples you mentioned had been properly trained by the military, those cops would be dead.
If they had been unarmed, then this entire conversation would not exist.
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I'm still trying to figure out how psychopaths and radicals, who already acquire and/or use forearms illegally, how we are supposedly "making it easy" for them to get them. How is one allowed to illegally obtain and fire a weapon?? Some ATF test I'm not aware of?
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There should be a rule against shooting anyone.
If the bad guys in the examples you mentioned had been properly trained by the military, those cops would be dead.
If they had been unarmed, then this entire conversation would not exist.
This is very mysterious.
Why do you think that a rule against shooting people is a bad idea, but a rule against having a gun is a good idea?
Or have I got it wrong?
Do you think that a rule against having a gun would be somehow more respected than a rule against shooting people?
Neither way really makes sense to me.
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(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10891608_10152922810425432_3366169312041480128_n.jpg?oh=cbfa9c2b1eefa9a2e8e6a526a78c67be&oe=552A055E&__gda__=1425973576_8f68d071a72342fe04d5839bbdf5d984)
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remember people tend to tell police officers to not bother them and only go after real criminials. I guess it take two dead cops for them to finally do just that.
http://nypost.com/2014/12/29/arrests-plummet-following-execution-of-two-cops/
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Yep :-\
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remember people tend to tell police officers to not bother them and only go after real criminials. I guess it take two dead cops for them to finally do just that.
http://nypost.com/2014/12/29/arrests-plummet-following-execution-of-two-cops/
This is a bit disturbing.
I wouldn't have asked for it.
This will be an interesting experiment if it continues for a while.
If the injuries and fatalities resulting from crime rise, the lower level of police effort will show its cost.
If the injuries and fatalities overall go down then New York has had too much policing.
Eric Garner was killed by his arrest, I hope his case is unusual.
Past mayors have endeavored to make the city cleaner and safer with more policework, did they over dose on that?
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If you were Black and constantly harassed and frisked by cops, I think it would be warranted if you thought you were over policed.
Suppose that every time you walked out the door you were stopped and frisked by rude Black cops. How would you feel?
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If you were Black and constantly harassed and frisked by cops, I think it would be warranted if you thought you were over policed.
Suppose that every time you walked out the door you were stopped and frisked by rude Black cops. How would you feel?
I guess I would feel like looting the Winn Dixie?
Eric Garner was apparently arrested several times without any need, I note that of his 30 arrests nine were for selling untaxed cigarettes.
The state of New York LEGESLATURE should answer for this.
The greed of the government in taxing society to the limits of its ability to bear it is a direct cause of this death.
What choice the police had did not include anything like leaving him alone.
This tobacco tax is credited with saving a few lives by making dangerous cigarettes more expensive, this should be juxtaposed to the destruction caused by a black market and enforcement of an unpopular tax.
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If you were Black and constantly harassed and frisked by cops, I think it would be warranted if you thought you were over policed.
Suppose that every time you walked out the door you were stopped and frisked by rude Black cops. How would you feel?
Let's see some facts that support the claim that blacks are frisked by cops every time they turn around or walk thru some door. Don't worry, no one is going to hold their breath waiting for you to back up your opinion
Plane is again dead on, in that your beef isn't with the police...it's with the legislature, who pass the laws, that the police are by law required to enforce. And not just the ones they like. they aren't sheep, they're employees of the people, who pay their salary. And they are legally required to enforce all laws that they observe being broken.
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http://nypost.com/2014/12/29/arrests-plummet-following-execution-of-two-cops/
This will be an interesting experiment if it continues for a while.
Hypothesis
1)Criminals will not take a holiday while the police do, but people will not report as many petty crimes, so reliable figures will be hard to come by except from emergency rooms and morgues.
2)Serious crimes , injuries and deaths will not be equal in all neighborhoods , those neighborhoods that already has a bad problem will see the most increase.
I don't really know this will be the case , but if I am wrong I will learn even more than if I already know.
If I am wrong , and there is no increase , then I will consider it proven that New York City has been over policed.
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Actually legally thier not required to enforce all laws they do have power of discretion. It's really needed in order to do thier job properly.
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That is true.......in particular of crimes that they may see one time, such as a parking infraction or even a moving violation. If someone is consistently speeding however, despite repeated warnings, they're going to get more than a ticket. They're going to get arrested, or at minimum, lawfully detained & handcuffed in the back of a patrol car
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Let's see some facts that support the claim that blacks are frisked by cops every time they turn around or walk thru some door.
they may be frisked everytime they resist arrest or refuse to comply with a police officer's instructions.
most of these cases that end in tragedy would not happen if the person had been cooperative with the police.
i know just like with any profession there is is percentage of nutty police.
so i am always very respectful, yes sir, no sir, and do just as they ask
in the last few years i've been pulled over twice for VERY QUESTIONABLE reasons
but even under those circumstances I was quite respectful.
the big picture is to cooperate, not get arrested, not get killed....
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Let's see some facts that support the claim that blacks are frisked by cops every time they turn around or walk thru some door.
they may be frisked everytime they resist arrest or refuse to comply with a police officer's instructions.
most of these cases that end in tragedy would not happen if the person had been cooperative with the police....the big picture is to cooperate, not get arrested, not get killed....
Precisely. But know, these raice baiters are literally making things more dangerous, not just for blacks, but anyone that feels compliance with law enforcment is now merely an option. Thank you Obama, Holder, Sharpton, and clan >:(
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But now the major portion of the protesters are not black so race may not the the issue anymore. Maybe the growth is not race baitting but actual issue of police conduct. I did say at the beggining the police chief was acting like a douche and still is. In fact nationally police frowned upon the back turning of the officers to the mayor. It actually gives the impression police won't listen attitude. Started this. Post pointing out a line has been crossed meaning knowing whose right will not solve this and this will grow. Note the protesters are trying very hard ignoring the death of the officers effect thier cause. Note the work slowage of the officers. It's gone too far and im betting something carzy stupid new happen jan. 2nd
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There has been no issue with Police conduct Kimba. Grand jury's have looked over all the evidence we're not privy too, and concluded nothing criminal. Be it the Zimmerman case, the Brown case, or the Garner case. Now, if the officer involved in the Garner case used a technique that is neither sanctioned nor authorized by the NY City Police Dept, then he should be reprimanded. But that's not some egregious police conduct analogus to simply harrassing black folks for no reason, outside of their color. THAT's the false narrative that's being pushed. THAT's the race baiting, by hard core leftists of all racial persuasions being pushed
And THAT's what's making the situation far more dangerous, as it not only implies that compliance with law enforcement is largely optional now, it encourages folks to do exactly what that thug did in assassinating 2 police officers....neither of whom, were white either. Officers across the country will now react in 2 ways....be even more cautious, with a finger on their firearm or tazer, when approaching someone acting suspisciously, even if they're only listing to their ipod. Or simply stop arresting people. Neither of which is a good for the safety of this country
And here's the kicker....all these folks berrating police for some supposed country wide epidemic of gross misconduct, if they hear someone coming into their home, thru some window, who's the 1st person they're going to call? Absolutely, the Police. And are they going to complain of some misconduct, if the person who was just trying to rape their daughter is aggressively pulled off and handcuffed? Unlikely
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I'm not directly talking about the conduct of those cases but it is a serious factor. I'm going to say something which will highly likely be ignored. These cases by alrights would be ignored but due to previous event it would of still happened if not by these people. If i state to not avoid a riot is to just not have a unarmed black person to get shot in the month of december. Is it possible? Repeatedly it stated those officers did thier duty but thats not the issue. The issue is can those deaths with those job requirement be avoided
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I think that if any member of anyone's family was choked to death by some cop over a trivial crime, they would seriously pissed and would have a right to be seriously pissed in this case both at the cop and at the grand jury.
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You're right Kimba, in the sense it would be ignored since there are numerous current examples of white folks shot and killed by officers that get no attention whatsoever. Example after example of blacks attacking, even killing whites, based principally by skin color, that receives squat media attention. There's a narrative that's being pushed, and any/all evidence to the contrary must be ignored
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I think that if any member of anyone's family was choked to death by some cop over a trivial crime, they would seriously pissed and would have a right to be seriously pissed in this case both at the cop and at the grand jury.
Who would think otherwise?? :o. Anyone who lost a loved one like that would be pissed
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Good For Them!
New York Consequences: NYPD Arrest and Activity Enforcement Drops Dramatically. It appears the New York Police are taking "safety first" seriously. NEW YORK: It's not a slowdown, it's a virtual work stoppage. NYPD traffic tickets and summonses for minor offenses have dropped off by a staggering 94 percent following the execution of two cops, as officers feel betrayed by the mayor and fear for their safety, The Post has learned.
[e-mail]
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Yeah, right. The Mayor gives a perfectly logical speech to his son and made it public, so the cops stop doing their jobs.
It seems that the cops are bigger assholes than DeBlasio warned his son about.
What a bunch of slackers.
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The cost of erroneously trying to paintbrush your police force as racist. Nothing logical about his speech, outside of asanine political correctness coming home to roost
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The NYPD is not "my police force". I do not live there I pay no taxes there. They might as well be in Helsinki, Guam or Sebastapol.
They are, however acting like stupid, spoiled brats with minimal reasoning powers. Anyone can see this.
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The NYPD is not "my police force". I do not live there I pay no taxes there. They might as well be in Helsinki, Guam or Sebastapol.
Do you really just not get it?
Is it not contextually obvious that SIRS is referring to De Blasio painting HIS police force as racist?
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Folks that have a rational grasp of linguistics would. Those who have a pathologic inability to focus on the point being made, not so much. :-\
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De Blasio was simply warning his son that he needed to act respectful of the police, any police, since it is a well-known fact that the police have among their numbers officers who will kill you if you do not comply.
The proof of this is the guy who was killed for selling loose cigarettes. Or disobeying the officer who strangled him to death.
Wouldn't you tell your son not to resist arrest? Wouldn't anyone?
These cops are acting like assholes.
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No, he wasn't. He made it clear in his ongoing inferrences, that HIS police force was a bunch of racists. It had squat to do with being respectful, since he was referring to his son's skin color, not about being respectful to a policeman's instructions, in general
The mahor is acting like an A-hole