Hopefully this trend continues!

[Plane]

If a school does not share a core curriculum with the rest of the country, then results of tests used to compare different schools will not be valid.

There are thousands of homeschooled students and some turn out with superior educations, others horridly ignorant, with many in between.

  I bet you haven't looked at the figures.

   Homeschooling has a good success rate.

    But where the local school is disappointing enough to foster a lot of homeschooling around it , there is an even more marked difference in outcomes .
     A school that is failing looses the children and parents who are well motivated first, and these are the ones who homeschool best , so stratification can rapidly snowball.

     But lets blame this on the failing school , rather than the highly motivated children and parents.

       Where the public schools are not disappointing , I would expect there to be a lot less homeschooling.

[kimba1]

Not quite that clear cut.

I mention before home schooling is a touch costly . Not all family can do home schooling . I actually do know one parent who home school but wants to enroll thier son to school but he test as three years behind. So he pretty much has to stay home school till he catches up. Also the reason they want to enroll thier son is the workload to teach him has been overwhelming.

im trying to say not all parents can home school .

[Xavier_Onassis]

I cannot imagine how there could be accurate statistics on ALL homeschooling.
I can imagine that the parents that are really are good at it are also good at testing and turning in the results.

So the results that are turned in are all great results.
But the more neglectful parents would not be turning in anything, or turning in what they think the state wants to hear.

[Plane]

   There really is no measure for everything.
    But one of the best indicators that is available , is the rates at which they succeed at college.

More than 2 million U.S. students in grades K-12 were home-schooled in 2010, accounting for nearly 4 percent of all school-aged children, according to the National Home Education Research Institute. Studies suggest that those who go on to college will outperform their peers.

Students coming from a home school graduated college at a higher rate than their peers­—66.7 percent compared to 57.5 percent—and earned higher grade point averages along the way, according to a study that compared students at one doctoral university from 2004-2009.

They're also better socialized than most high school students, says Joe Kelly, an author and parenting expert who home-schooled his twin daughters.

http://www.usnews.com/education/high-schools/articles/2012/06/01/home-schooled-teens-ripe-for-college

[Xavier_Onassis]

Homeschoolers who go to college may or may not be typical of homeschoolers in general.

Whether they are "better socialized" is an opinion, I don't have any idea how this could be measured.

[Plane]

Not quite that clear cut.

I mention before home schooling is a touch costly . Not all family can do home schooling . I actually do know one parent who home school but wants to enroll thier son to school but he test as three years behind. So he pretty much has to stay home school till he catches up. Also the reason they want to enroll thier son is the workload to teach him has been overwhelming.

im trying to say not all parents can home school .

http://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=372
  Right now there are about two million homeschooled kids.
   Of the population this is less than 1%.
    Of the school age population it is slightly better than 2%.

        The problem as I see it is that our schools are so cruddy that it produces only about one to two percent of us who are smart and knowledgeable enough to teach a child elementary knowledges.

     

[kimba1]

I did mentioned that school are at the whims of parents desire what is taught to to ensure thier child will graduate so again the blame cannot be soully on the shoulder of the school alone.

The cruddy school did not make these parent it's actually a constant element through out time.
I did point out it's in our culture. Ex. English only

That statement alone has allow asian student who maintain thier birth language graduate ate a higher rate.

In the future i'll never use algebra. A movie quote about somebody in the fifties. All non public schools do not have this issue. But public schools are uniquely vulnerable to the whims and notions of the parents.

Public school is the only option for the economic disadvantaged. Home school is not an option for those.

[Plane]

.......................
In the future i'll never use algebra. A movie quote about somebody in the fifties. All non public schools do not have this issue. But public schools are uniquely vulnerable to the whims and notions of the parents.

Public school is the only option for the economic disadvantaged. Home school is not an option for those.

If you design electronic circuits you will use algebra quite a bit.
Somebody ought to mention this to the kids when they start, yes it is relevant.

The overall cost of homeschool is low , less than public school.
But we all pay for the public school , even us that would rather use the competition.
A voucher system would open the world of education to the poor .
Those against vouchers are favoring a monopoly.

[kimba1]

Not just talking money. Im taking it ties up one parent from earning an income so it's pretty much for household who can afford to live on one income.

The problem with vouchers is the school still has to accept the kid. Doesn't charter have veto power which is one of the factors that make it superior to public school.

One of the factor why public school has a decline is that it cannot turn kids away.these are not motivated students

[Xavier_Onassis]

Vouchers are a TERRIBLE idea.

As soon as the government okayed loans and grants to students of unaccredited, private schools, these things popped up all over the place, and most of them are diploma mills that do not prepare their graduates for real jobs. Some of them spend more on recruiting and advertising than they do on instruction. Much of the instruction is online, where the students can simply fake having learned the material. All exams are open book exams.  What the private schools really like is that student loans cannot be cancelled by bankruptcy, making them easy to sell to loan vultures who will harass the debtors until their last Social Security check.

Everest University and its parent, Corinthian Colleges, has recently gone out of business. Most of their students never got useful degerees in anything, but they all racked up huge piles of debt.

These fly by night colleges get away with it because they donate huge amounts to politicians.

If vouchers are issued for  elementary and HS education, the same creeps will grab the voucher money and deliver crap, just as they did in higher education.

Homeschooling is okay for the few parents who are qualified to do it: give them a financial incentive and it will multiply the number of scams.

[kimba1]

I actually don't have a problem with vouchers since public schools are notoriously overcrowded. So it's a way to bring down the class size.

True public school gets funding from large class sizes but that mean they will finally redo thier books to handle it.

I've always been critical of the finances of many of the public schools. I feel like I'm the only who says public schools gets alot of money

[Xavier_Onassis]

If there is not enough money to teach students in one school, it is not going to cost less to teach them in two.

Charter schools have proven to be no better than public ones, and they are inferior in that they are permitted to keep problem students out, they are not obliged to pay their teachers according to any publicly revealed pay schedule or provide benefits for them at all, and can graduate students without their having to prove they have the same minimal knowledge as public schools. Convicted felons can own the facilities they operate in and have done this.

Vouchers MIGHT be an improvement, but because the private school lobbyists will write the laws governing them, this is very unlikely.

[sirs]

Except of course when it has been tried, it has been extremely successful.....which is why the teachers union lobbyists get their money's worth in the politicians they've bought and paid for, who then axe actual successful efforts at educating our children.  Can't be having anything competing with the Public Education teachers.....big no no

[kimba1]

Successful??

I've seen several charters school shut due to child endangerment charges. Remember they get way less oversight than public schools. Not saying all but the small percentage are fairly scarey.

Charter school is a misleading word. By nature they not alike some are acedemic utopia but most are not.

Im mixed about the teachers union. I believe they need some leeway to explore the best way to teach thier class but not to the point they don't need teacher well at all. Very confused on the subject. Over all i defend teachers and blame parents due to our anti-education culture that is globally common and not a byproduct of public education

[Xavier_Onassis]

Vouchers have been tried, and have generally sucked.