Target is transferring cashiers who avoid pork

[Stray Pooch]

I support the Muslim store clerks with qualification.  If someone gets a job in a store which handles pork products routinely, they should be expected to handle pork.  I respect the idea of accomodating religious practices when possible.  As a Mormon I would object to selling porn or serving coffee; however, I would noit get a job where I had to do either of these things unless I accepted up front that my standards were being compromised - by me.  I worked as a projectionist when I was (much) younger.  Sometimes the theater showed a soft-core porn movie.  I just tried to do what I could not to watch it but you have to watch the screen for reel changeovers and the like.  It was money and I knew going in I would have to do it, so I didn't complain.

If the issue of handling pork is so important to these clerks - and I respect the fact that it is an issue for Muslims - they should seek employment elsewhere.  If they can work with Target to accomodate their practices, more power to both sides.

[kimba1]

the article said it only takes a few seconds to have somebody else to scan pork items for me
incorrect it can take up to several minutes.
people hate delays.
anything that create delays in a unforgivable sin.
ex.home depot
it sounds cruel,but thats the reality of the situation
target is not denying people work
they are simply ultilizing them in task more suited for them.
cashiering is not one of them.

[Plane]

I honestly don't recall Christ ever killing anyone, or for that matter condoning violence of any kind.

Matthew 10:34
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:33-35 (in Context) Matthew 10



Acts 10:13
Then a voice told him, "Get up, Peter. Kill and eat."
Acts 10:12-14 (in Context) Acts 10


http://www.biblegateway.com/

[Stray Pooch]

That scripture verse is out of context.  God was telling Peter to eat unclean foods.  It would be normal to kill it before he ate it because, well, ya know, yuck!

The vision here was a reference to bringing the Gospel to the Gentiles.  It was about saving - not killing.

[yellow_crane]

I honestly don't recall Christ ever killing anyone, or for that matter condoning violence of any kind.

Matthew 10:34
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:33-35 (in Context) Matthew 10



Acts 10:13
Then a voice told him, "Get up, Peter. Kill and eat."
Acts 10:12-14 (in Context) Acts 10


http://www.biblegateway.com/

[Plane]

That scripture verse is out of context.  God was telling Peter to eat unclean foods.  It would be normal to kill it before he ate it because, well, ya know, yuck!

The vision here was a reference to bringing the Gospel to the Gentiles.  It was about saving - not killing.

Quote from: Plane on Today at 11:43:13 AM
Quote from: Brassmask on Today at 11:07:06 AM
Can't wait for the Walmart cashier who won't ring up a gun or a bowhunters tips because it is against their religion.




Is there such a religion?


Mabye someone who takes seriously the "blessed are the peacemakers" verse and the instruction to "beat your swords into plowshares."  



The run of the mill Christian should not have a problem with hunting.


We eat Pork because God told Peter to convert our ancestors without worring about their diet.

[yellow_crane]

I honestly don't recall Christ ever killing anyone, or for that matter condoning violence of any kind.

Matthew 10:34
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:33-35 (in Context) Matthew 10



Acts 10:13
Then a voice told him, "Get up, Peter. Kill and eat."
Acts 10:12-14 (in Context) Acts 10


http://www.biblegateway.com/

There is a general tenet held by many that if one is religious in their religion, waging violence is wrong and peacefulness is right, without fail, all the time.

When the angel appeared to Daniel in the Lion's Den, Daniel complained of the tardiness.  The angel told him he had been fighting for twenty some days to get to him, battling dark angels.

The Hindus, and well as many religions, have Gods of War.

All you have to remember when you are finding yourself in your religion is the little picture every mystic and every philospher should have on their wall--the one where a little fish is about to be gobbled by a larger fish coming from behind, to be followed yadda yadda.

You get a pretty good clue about the birth of violence when you come across the truth that, in order to live, you have to kill something and chew it down.

[_JS]

Oh, I bet the moneychangers thought Jesus was violent the time Jesus used a whip to throw the moneychangers off the temple grounds. I guess it depends on what you mean by 'violence'.

The universal response is to reply with the money changers.

The text is found in a few of the Gospels, but I'll use Matthew 21:12-13 for now.

12 Jesus entered the temple area and drove out all those engaged in selling and buying there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who were selling doves.
13 And he said to them, "It is written: 'My house shall be a house of prayer,' but you are making it a den of thieves."

Here Jesus is directly alluding to Isaiah 56:7 (it is interesting to note that Isaiah is referenced more than any other book):

Them I will bring to my holy mountain and make joyful in my house of prayer; Their holocausts and sacrifices will be acceptable on my altar, For my house shall be called a house of prayer for all peoples.

And note that Matthew leaves off the prepositional phrase "for all peoples." This is not without purpose given Matthew's intended audience, but that's a discussion for another day.

Clearly Jesus is not condoning violence for his followers. To take that from the incident with the money changers is to completely miss the point here. Christ says, "My House" has become a "den of thieves" due to the money changers.

What was happening? The money changers were a part of the process for selling objects that were required for religious practices of the Jewish people. The only coinage accepted by the merchants selling the doves and bulls was the coin of Tyre, so the money changers were the 1st century equivalent of foreign currency exhangers. The Priestly class condoned this activity which was clearly in contrast to Isaiah's statement.

As I said, this is not some bizarre lesson that Christian's may use violence.

Acts 10:13
Then a voice told him, "Get up, Peter. Kill and eat."
Acts 10:12-14 (in Context) Acts 10

I cannot explain it better than Pooch did.

Matthew 10:34
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:33-35 (in Context) Matthew 10

The "context" really begins with verse 32:

32 Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father.
33 But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.

Clearly this is once again not some sort of bizarre call to violent arms of Christ's followers. This is Jesus discussing the final judgement of the Heavenly Father. The parallel is Luke 12:8-10

8 I tell you, everyone who acknowledges me before others the Son of Man will acknowledge before the angels of God.
9 But whoever denies me before others will be denied before the angels of God.
10 "Everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but the one who blasphemes against the holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

Honestly, you are not going to find Christ as some bloody warrior. That is not Christ-like, no matter how much modern culture wishes Him to be otherwise.

[Plane]

The subject o the question was selling hunting equipment .

It has grown since then, ...


When Jesus drove the money changers out he used a whip as a wepon , he plated this thing himself, this proves that the action was pre-meditated , I guess the driveing out was an exciteing scene with Jesus putting a hurt on thse sedentary theves.

But look what he didn't do , he didn't lead a mob , he didn't exploit the favor with the public this might have earned him , he didn't use a wepon that would have a fatal effect and he didn't use miraculous power.

Thre is a lot going on , I don't want to pretend that I fully understand.

[_JS]

And note who was doing the driving out of the money changers and where He said He was?

"My House"

and what did Isaiah say about His house?

I really don't think one can simply take that action and then say: "hey Jesus acted violently, so can we!"

[Lanya]

The "sword" I was told was that when Jesus came back, families would be divided. 
Do I have it right?

[Plane]

The "sword" I was told was that when Jesus came back, families would be divided. 
Do I have it right?

Is that what he says?

[Lanya]

No, I got it wrong. It isn't talking about the 2nd coming at least as far as I can tell.

"Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it." (Matthew 10:34-39 NASB)

[Universe Prince]

I really don't think one can simply take that action and then say: "hey Jesus acted violently, so can we!"

I agree that we cannot take that one instance by itself and use it as a blanket excuse for violence. But I would say clearly Jesus felt violence was an appropriate reaction to the situation. And given that we are told to be like Jesus, to say that some how Jesus gets to express Himself violently but no one else does seems dishonest. It's like the admonition that Christians should always appear happy even if they're not because Christians have to be good witnesses of Christian joy all the time. Christ was not always happy in public, so it is an obvious double standard that I don't see Christ issuing. I don't recall any place in the Gospels where Jesus said "do as I say not as I do."

I realize there exists a notion that holiness is some sort of perpetually placid state of self-denial and submission, but that is not a notion with which I agree.

In any case, all of this has nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

[_JS]

I agree that we cannot take that one instance by itself and use it as a blanket excuse for violence. But I would say clearly Jesus felt violence was an appropriate reaction to the situation.

No, but for some reason a lot of people today seem to think that Jesus is condoning violence here. He quite clearly is not. He is cleansing His house.

And given that we are told to be like Jesus, to say that some how Jesus gets to express Himself violently but no one else does seems dishonest.

No. This is why WWJD is completely idiotic. We cannot possibly do what Jesus does (or did). I don't think any of us are going to turn water into booze at the next wedding we attend. I don't think any of us are going to ascend into heaven under our own power either.

The original meaning of the phrase has been obscured (it was a Christian Socialist statement made in the 30's asking why Christians were not properly caring for the poor). It has recently become more of a fashion statement than anything.

The truth is, you have to do as Christ says because you don't have the ability to do as He does. Otherwise you must accept Pelagianism, which is another debate entirely.

The problem with violence is that you must find a way to have it coexist with Christ's two commandments. Look at Luke 10:25-37

25 There was a scholar of the law who stood up to test him and said, "Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
26 Jesus said to him, "What is written in the law? How do you read it?"
27 He said in reply, "You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your being, with all your strength, and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself."
28 He replied to him, "You have answered correctly; do this and you will live."
29 But because he wished to justify himself, he said to Jesus, "And who is my neighbor?"
30 Jesus replied, "A man fell victim to robbers as he went down from Jerusalem to Jericho. They stripped and beat him and went off leaving him half-dead.
31 A priest happened to be going down that road, but when he saw him, he passed by on the opposite side.
32 likewise a Levite came to the place, and when he saw him, he passed by on the opposite side.
33 But a Samaritan traveler who came upon him was moved with compassion at the sight.
34 He approached the victim, poured oil and wine over his wounds and bandaged them. Then he lifted him up on his own animal, took him to an inn and cared for him.
35 The next day he took out two silver coins and gave them to the innkeeper with the instruction, 'Take care of him. If you spend more than what I have given you, I shall repay you on my way back.'
36 Which of these three, in your opinion, was neighbor to the robbers' victim?"
37 He answered, "The one who treated him with mercy." Jesus said to him, "Go and do likewise."

I don't see those two coexisting.