Author Topic: Is the Right Growing up?  (Read 1867 times)

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The_Professor

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Is the Right Growing up?
« on: March 19, 2007, 02:10:05 PM »
The maturing of the Right

Conservative Evangelical Christian voters have come a long way in a short time. From their nearly unanimous condemnation of Bill Clinton for his extramarital affairs, a growing number of these "pro-family" voters appear ready to accept several Republican presidential candidates who do not share their ideal of marriage and faith.

Among those seriously under consideration by these church-going folks is former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, who has been married three times and who had an affair with the woman now his wife when he was married to wife number two. The second wife, Donna Hanover, once recorded a political commercial for Giuliani, touting his virtues as a husband. She called him "honest and very kind" and "this is the kind of man I wanted to be the father of my children" and "Rudy is such a great Dad." It's on YouTube. In recent days we've learned from his son Andrew that he and his father are estranged, but that they're working on it. Andrew says he got his values from his mother.

Another of the thrice married is former House Speaker Newt Gingrich who, last week, trod the Damascus Road to Colorado Springs. On the syndicated radio program of psychologist James Dobson, Gingrich confessed that he had an extramarital affair with the woman to whom he is now married while he was married to his second wife. Gingrich acknowledged not living up to his own standards, or G-d's.

A third Republican presidential candidate is Sen. John McCain, who has been married twice. He is disliked by many social conservatives more for his support of "campaign finance reform," which they regard as an attempt to limit their speech, his work on immigration with Ted Kennedy and past remarks that some evangelical leaders are "agents of intolerance."

Mitt Romney has the right social conservative views, fairly recently bringing them into conformity with their own, but to some conservative evangelicals he has the "wrong" religion. Romney, a Mormon, is the poster boy for family values: one wife, handsome children, and no apparent personal skeletons in his closet, but some, not all, evangelicals can't get over the Mormon belief that Jesus once visited America. They also reject the "Book of Mormon," which they believe tells "another gospel."

That substantial numbers of conservative evangelical voters are even considering these candidates as presidential prospects is a sign of their political maturation and of their more pragmatic view of what can be expected from politics and politicians. It is also evidence that many of them are awakening to at least two other realities — (1) they are not electing a church deacon; and (2) government has limited power to rebuild a crumbling social construct.

The Census Bureau recently noted that only 23.7 percent of the U.S. population fit the '50s stereotype of heterosexual married couples with children. Even in the "golden age" of the '50s, the figure was just under 50 percent. Until this election cycle, most social conservatives supported candidates and policies based on the married with children "ideal" family model. It may be the ideal, but it is no longer widely practiced, including by many conservative evangelicals. Researchers have found many conservative Christians live in states where divorce rates are highest. These states overwhelmingly oppose same-sex marriage. Too bad they don't do a better job supporting opposite-sex marriage in which they claim to believe.

No politician can "fix" broken heterosexual marriages. If they could, some of those mentioned above would have fixed their own. The crumbling "traditional" family is the result of many social and cultural factors. The solution, like the fault, lies neither with government, nor with politicians.

While "character issues" can overlap with other concerns when considering for whom to vote, conservative evangelicals are beginning to see them as less important than who can meet the multiple challenges faced by the nation. Put it this way: if you are about to have major surgery and your only choice was a church-going doctor with a high mortality rate, or an agnostic with a high success record, which would it be? I'd choose the agnostic.

Conservative evangelicals have grown up. But they still can't stand Hillary Clinton, though she's only been married once and is a Methodist. Jimmy Carter, also once married, only lusted in his heart. It makes one nostalgic for the "good old days."

By Cal Thomas @ http://www.JewishWorldReview.com

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2007, 02:49:34 PM »
I think that all along, the Fundie movement consisted of a few honchos telling their gullible disciples what to do. It turns out that the honchos have decided that they won't stress the fact that all the major GOP candidates (except Romney, a weirdo Mormon) have been married two or more times. I seriously doubt that this was of any personal importance to them ever. It always seemed to me that Jimmy Swaggart was far more sorry that he got caught than anything else.

The actual point at which the rubber hits the road is the general election. If the disciples don't follow their honchos, many of them probably won't vote at all. These are people who rarely or never voted in the past. They require severe goosing to turn out, and many must feel that they are being goosed by God Himself.

One form of this Divine Goosing was to make sure an anti-sodomy (anti gay marriage) was on the ballot. This can't be done in every election.

The Right is not growing up. Maturity is not so much the issue as competence and ideology. Their bad judgement (in starting a useless and costly war on false pretenses, and charging it all to future generations) and their lies would appear to be their biggest liabiities,


Will their wives be likely to vote for a philandering clown like the Newtster or Mayor Rudy if his sins are spread far and wide? I tend to doubt this.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2007, 02:57:31 PM by Xavier_Onassis »
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The_Professor

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2007, 03:10:15 PM »
I think that all along, the Fundie movement consisted of a few honchos telling their gullible disciples what to do. It turns out that the honchos have decided that they won't stress the fact that all the major GOP candidates have been married two or more times. I seriously doubt that this was of any personal importance to them ever. It always seemed to me that Jimmy Swaggart was far more sorry that he got caught than anything else.

The actual point at which the rubber hits the road is the general election. If the disciples don't follow their honchos, many of them probably won't vote at all. These are people who rarely or never voted in the past. They require severe goosing to turn out, and many must feel that they are being goosed by God Himself.

One form of this Divine Goosing was to make sure an anti-sodomy (anti gay marriage) was on the ballot. This can't be done in every election.

The Right is not growing up. Their bad judgement (in starting a useless and costly war on false pretenses, and charging it all to future generations) and their lies would appear to be their biggest liabiities,


Will their wives be likely to vote for a philandering clown like the Newtster or Mayor Rudy if his sins are spread far and wide? I tend to doubt this.


Interesting viewpoint, XO. Yes, I concur that the general election IS the most important piece of this pie and the actions of this voting block will be intriguing to observe this time around. You said: "These are people who rarely or never voted in the past." I am not sure this is true. I, for one, AM part of this voting block and I have voted in EVERY election, local, state and nation since I was eligible to vote.

As far as bad judgment, this is not limited to the Religious Right. Many outisde of that voting block supported this Administration, correct?

Also, I doubt Guiliani will go very far due to many factors, primarily due to his personal history.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2007, 07:30:58 PM by The_Professor »

Lanya

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2007, 04:08:43 PM »
So "maturation" is now defined as having situational ethics?
This is what I see the Right saying:

"If it's our party's guy who is the serial monogamist, it's ok."

Shorter: "Anything for continued power."

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BT

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2007, 05:33:16 PM »
Quote
Shorter: "Anything for continued power."

kinda like perjury isn't perjury if you are lying about sexual relationships in a harrassment suit?

sirs

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2007, 11:30:53 PM »
Quote
Shorter: "Anything for continued power."

kinda like perjury isn't perjury if you are lying about sexual relationships in a harrassment suit?

D'OH   
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2007, 07:05:22 AM »
Is "growing up " becoming more like the Democratic party?

The_Professor

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2007, 12:54:57 PM »
 ;D   good one.... ;D

_JS

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2007, 01:26:53 PM »
I think a lot depends on whether the individual really considers themselves to be an "evangelical voter" or a "Republican, who votes evangelical." I think that self-identity means a great deal and I suspect the latter is the case for many of them.

It isn't "growing up" as much as it is a realization that politics isn't about grand causes, not anymore and not in this country. Politics is a game played by some people, who to be good at the game have to be dealmakers and snake oil salesmen by trade.

Just don't expect to find God down there in the den of thieves.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
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Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2007, 03:43:13 PM »
I am not sure this is true. I, for one, AM part of this voting block and I have voted in EVERY election, local, state and nation since I was eligible to vote.

======================================
If you have always voted, then you are NOT a part of the fundie voting block that Rove drew out with his anti-homo, anti-abortion crap.

Either party could run a deceased Weimariner and it would get at least 40% of the vote, being as voting AGAINST is more common than voting FOR. It's the middle ground that actually decides the election.

In 2000 and 2004, the razor-thin margin that gave an unfortunate victory to the GOP consisted of fundies that previously did not vote at all, but who were somehow convinced that their marriages would be DESTROYED utterly by gay marriage and the nation would be wrecked by the Wrath of God, possibly in lightning form, cast down by a vengeful Deity.

In 2004, there was also the scaring the crap out of the voters about the Evil Muslims. The war was only barely a year old then, and people were not nearly so sick of it then. Plus, of course, the War is now pretty obviously a double-headed disaster due to the incredible incompetence of Juniorbush and Rummy.

Have you noted that now there isn't an election on the horizon, the Big Oil buddies have once more jacked the price way up.

Are Americans really so stupid as to fall for it when before November '08 the prices come down again? Eventually, people quit listening to the boy crying wolf.

It would be nice if we had more than two real parties to choose from, but this time, one party has screwed up damned near everything, and it is they who will take the fall.

McCain has a chance only if the Mighty Surge shows signs of turning into Victory.

Giulani (who COULD win against the Democrats) won't be permitted to win the GOP nomination. To them he's a babykillin' divorced Dago.

It's not time for Jebbie yet. He IS waiting in the wings, but he'd get punished for his brother's unspeakable incompetence.

That leaves Mitch the Mormon, an assortment of unknowns from flyover country. Brownback is a better giuy than Bobdole, but he could never raise the funds Dole did, and probably could not get the votes.
 
 
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Plane

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Re: Is the Right Growing up?
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2007, 10:35:22 PM »
" From their nearly unanimous condemnation of Bill Clinton for his extramarital affairs,..."



Isn't this a bit of a miscaricterization?

Bill got up the ire of everyone who was not deeply in love with him when he shook his finger in our faces as he emphasized his lie.

Are evangelical Christians the only ones who are offended by lies , sexual harassment and misuse of power?