Author Topic: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama  (Read 8841 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Christians4LessGvt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11153
    • View Profile
    • "The Religion Of Peace"
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2008, 04:23:02 PM »




"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Christians4LessGvt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11153
    • View Profile
    • "The Religion Of Peace"
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2008, 04:25:29 PM »

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2008, 04:26:55 PM »
In the second version, he's known to the regulators he meets with as Senator John McCain.  They know who they're talking to.  And Keating knows who he's sending in.  Senator John McCain.

Oh, you mean these regulators, who routinely meet with Congressmen during their normal business, are intimidated just by the PRESENCE of the (then) Junior Senator from Arizona?

They got a sudden case of yellow belly?

Regulators meet with Congressmen all the time. What was so unusual about this case? Where is your evidence that he applied any pressure?
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Rich

  • Guest
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2008, 05:22:45 PM »
All this nonsense aside, if Republicans voted 90 percent for a White guy running against a Black guy , do you think they'd be called racists?

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2008, 05:44:17 PM »
<<Oh, you mean these regulators, who routinely meet with Congressmen during their normal business, are intimidated just by the PRESENCE of the (then) Junior Senator from Arizona?

<<They got a sudden case of yellow belly?

<<Regulators meet with Congressmen all the time. What was so unusual about this case? Where is your evidence that he applied any pressure?>>

No, I think the public should have all the facts.  Not just that they met - - why did they meet?  At whose suggestion, for what purpose?  It's a fairly easy story line to follow - - the crook and his crooked financial dealings, the investigations, the crook and his crooked Senator meeting to discuss this, I need some help, John-Boy, Sure, Chuck, what kind of help, Meet with them, get them to back off, I need a breather.  Then the meeting, You need to back off the Chuckmeister, boys, he's a friend of mine, Oh, sorry, I didn't know, Senator, sure, we can cut him some slack -- - then the Narrator's voice: 

"The average regulatory investigation takes ____ months from ordering the investigation to draft preliminary report.  THIS investigation took ____.  The average investigation takes_______ from draft preliminary to final investigation report; this one took ________.  How much time did the Senator gain for his jailbird friend and big-time donor before the Feds finally closed him down?  ____months;  ____months in which they were, thanks to Senator John M. McCain, still raking in over $__________ daily, from unsuspecting working, saving Americans like you.  [showing pictures of average Americans]  Like your parents. [more pictures]  Like your grandparents.[more pix]

Of course, the average American TV watcher will know immediately, this didn't have to be a Senator.  Any dumb schmuck can just walk off the street, into a Federal regulator's office, and get the Feds to back off an important multi-million dollar Federal fraud investigation just by asking.  Michael Tee could do it and he's not even a citizen.  Lynndie England could do it.  Osama Fucking Bin Laden could do it.  Federal regulators are nothing if not obliging.  Hell, they'll put the brakes on an important investigation for anyone.  At least, that's how Ami sees it.  Most viewers will probably have a different take on it.

BT

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16143
    • View Profile
    • DebateGate
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 3
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2008, 06:36:05 PM »
The Keating Five were five United States Senators accused of corruption in 1989, igniting a major political scandal as part of the larger Savings and Loan crisis of the late 1980s and early 1990s. The five senators, Alan Cranston (D-CA), Dennis DeConcini (D-AZ), John Glenn (D-OH), John McCain (R-AZ), Donald W. Riegle (D-MI), were accused of improperly aiding Charles H. Keating, Jr., chairman of the failed Lincoln Savings and Loan Association, which was the target of an investigation by the Federal Home Loan Bank Board.

After a lengthy investigation, the Senate Ethics Committee determined in 1991 that Alan Cranston, Dennis DeConcini, and Donald Riegle had substantially and improperly interfered with the FHLBB in its investigation of Lincoln Savings. The Committee recommended censure for Cranston and criticized the other four for "questionable conduct."

All five of the senators involved served out their terms, but only Glenn and McCain ran for re-election (and were subsequently re-elected).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keating_Five

BT

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16143
    • View Profile
    • DebateGate
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 3
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2008, 06:45:54 PM »
 Excerpts of Statement By Senate Ethics Panel

SPECIAL TO THE NEW YORK TIMES
Published: February 28, 1991

Following are excerpts from the statement today of the Senate Select Committee on Ethics concluding its hearings involving Senators Alan Cranston, Dennis DeConcini, John Glenn, John McCain and Donald W. Riegle Jr.: Introduction

The United States Senate Select Committee on Ethics initiated preliminary inquiries into allegations of misconduct by Senator Alan Cranston, Senator Dennis DeConcini, Senator John Glenn, Senator John McCain, and Senator Donald Riegle, in connection with their actions on behalf of Charles H. Keating Jr. and Lincoln Savings and Loan Association. In the course of its preliminary inquiries, the committee held hearings over a two-month period which began Nov. 15, 1990.
   . . .

While the committee has concluded that none of the Senators' actions . . . when considered without regard to any contribution or other benefit, violated any law or Senate rule, each act must also be examined against more general ethical standards to determine if there was any impropriety because of any relation between those actions and campaign contributions or other benefits provided by Mr. Keating and his associates.
   . . .

Based on all the available evidence, the committee has concluded that in the case of each of the five Senators, all campaign contributions from Mr. Keating and his associates under the Federal Election Campaign Act were within the established legal limits, and were properly reported. Similarly, from the available evidence, the committee concludes that the Senator's solicitation or acceptance of all contributions made in these cases to state party organizations, political action committees, and voter registration organizations were, standing alone, not illegal or improper; nor did any such contribution constitute a personal gift to any Senator.

With respect to each Senator, there remains the question of whether any actions taken by the Senator, standing alone or in combination with contributions or other benefits, constitutes improper conduct or an appearance of impropriety. The committee has examined the specific conduct of each Senator and has determined that under the totality of the circumstances: the conduct of each of the five Senators reflected poor judgment; the conduct of some of the Senators constituted at least an appearance of improper conduct; and the conduct of one Senator may have been improper.
   . . .

Recommendations Constituent Service

As noted in the course of the committee's hearings, the Senate has no specific written standards embodied in the Senate rules respecting contact or intervention with Federal executive or independent regulatory agency officials. . . .

The committee believes that the Senate should adopt written standards in this area. A specific proposal should be developed either by the Senate Rules Committee or by a bipartisan Senate task force created for this purpose.
   . . .

Campaign Reform

The inquiries in these five cases have shown the obvious ethical dilemmas inherent in the current system by which political activities are financed. The committee notes that over 80 percent of the funds at issue were not disclosed funds raised by candidates for Senate or House campaigns under the Federal Election Campaign Act. Rather, such funds were undisclosed, unregulated funds raised for independent expenditures, political party "soft money," and a non-Federal political action committee. Any campaign finance reform measure will have to address these mechanisms for political activities, as well as campaign fund raising and expenditures directly by candidates, in order to deal meaningfully and effectively with the issues presented in these cases.

The committee urges the leadership and members of both the Senate and the House to work together in a bipartisan manner to address the urgent need for comprehensive campaign finance reform. The reputation and honor of our institutions demand it.
   . . .

Panel Findings Senator Cranston

. . . The committee finds that there is substantial credible evidence that provides substantial cause for the committee to conclude that, in connection with his conduct relating to Charles H. Keating Jr., and Lincoln Savings and Loan Association, Senator Cranston may have engaged in improper conduct that may reflect upon the Senate, as contemplated in Section 2 (a) (1) of S. Res. 338, 88th Congress, as amended. To wit, there is substantial credible evidence that provides substantial cause for the committee to conclude, based upon the totality of the circumstances, including but not limited to the following conduct or activities, that Senator Cranston engaged in an impermissible pattern of conduct in which fund raising and official activities were substantially linked:

(1) From April 1987 through April 1989, Senator Cranston personally, or through Senate staff, contacted the Federal Home Loan Bank Board on behalf of Lincoln, during a period when Senator Cranston was soliciting and accepting substantial contributions from Mr. Keating. On at least four occasions, these contacts were made in close connection with the solicitation or receipt of contributions. These four occasions are as follows:

(i) As a result of a solicitation from Senator Cranston in early 1987, Mr. Keating, on March 3, 1987, contributed $100,000 to America Votes, a voter registration organization. This contribution was made during the period leading to Senator Cranston's participation in the April 2 and April 9 meetings with Federal Home Loan Bank Board Chairman Edwin J. Gray and the San Francisco regulators.

(ii) In the fall of 1987, Senator Cranston solicited from Mr. Keating a $250,000 contribution, which was delivered to the Senator personally by Mr. Keating's employee James Grogan on Nov. 6, 1987. When the contribution was delivered, Mr. Grogan and Senator Cranston called Mr. Keating, who asked if the Senator would contact new Federal Home Loan Bank Board Chairman M. Danny Wall about Lincoln. Senator Cranston agreed to do so, and made the call six days later.

(iii) In January 1988, Mr. Keating offered to make an additional contribution and also asked Senator Cranston to set up a meeting for him with Chairman Wall. Senator Cranston did so on Jan. 20, 1988, and Chairman Wall and Mr. Keating met eight days later. On Feb. 10, 1988, Senator Cranston personally collected checks totaling $500,000 for voter registration groups.

(iv) In early 1989, at the time that Senator Cranston was contacting Bank Board officials about the sale of Lincoln, he personally or through Joy Jacobson, his chief fund raiser, solicited another contribution. (This contribution was never made. American Continental Corporation declared bankruptcy on April 13, 1989.)

(2) Senator Cranston's Senate office practices further evidenced an impermissible pattern of conduct in which fund raising and official activities were substantially linked. For example, Joy Jacobson (who was not a member of his Senate staff and who had no official Senate duties or substantive expertise), engaged in the following activities with Senator Cranston's knowledge, permission, at his direction, or under his supervision:

(i) Senator Cranston's fund raiser repeatedly scheduled and attended meetings between Senator Cranston and contributors in which legislative or regulatory issues were discussed.

(ii) Senator Cranston's fund raiser often served as the intermediary for Mr. Keating or Mr. Grogan when they could not reach the Senator or Carolyn Jordan, the Senator's banking aide.

(iii) Senator Cranston received several memoranda from Ms. Jacobson which evidenced her understanding that contributors were entitled to special attention and special access to official services. Senator Cranston never told her that her understanding was incorrect, nor did he inform her that such a connection between contributions and official actions was improper.
   . . .

The committee, pursuant to committee supplementary procedural rules . . . shall proceed to an investigation under committee supplementary procedural Rule 5; and that Senator Cranston shall be given timely written notice of this resolution and the evidence supporting it, and informed of a respondent's rights pursuant to the rules of the committee.
   . . .

Senator DeConcini

Based on the evidence available to it, the committee has given consideration to Senator DeConcini's actions on behalf of Lincoln Savings and Loan Association. While aggressive conduct by senators in dealing with regulatory agencies is sometimes appropriate and necessary, the committee concludes that Senator DeConcini's aggressive conduct with the regulators was inappropriate. The committee further concludes that the actions of Senator DeConcini after the April 9, 1987, meeting where he learned of the criminal referral, were not improper in and of themselves.

While the committee concludes that Senator DeConcini has violated no law of the United States or specific rule of the United States Senate, it emphasizes that it does not condone his conduct. The committee has concluded that the totality of the evidence shows that Senator DeConcini's conduct gave the appearance of being improper and was certainly attended with insensitivity and poor judgment. However, the committee finds that his conduct did not reach a level requiring institutional action.

The committee therefore concludes that no further action is warranted with respect to Senator DeConcini on the matters investigated during the preliminary inquiry. Senator Glenn

Based on the evidence available to it, the committee has given consideration to Senator Glenn's actions on behalf of Lincoln Savings and Loan Association. The committee concludes that Senator Glenn, although believing that the Lincoln matter was in the process of resolution, exercised poor judgment in arranging a luncheon meeting between Mr. Keating and Speaker Wright in January 1988, some eight months after Senator Glenn learned of the criminal referral. There is disputed evidence as to whether Lincoln's problems with the Federal Home Loan Bank Board (F.H.L.B.B.) were discussed at that meeting. The evidence indicates that Senator Glenn's participating did not go beyond serving as host. The committee further concludes that Senator Glenn's actions were not improper or attended with gross negligence and did not reach the level requiring institutional action against him.

Senator Glenn has violated no law of the United States or specific rule of the United States Senate; therefore, the committee concludes that no further action is warranted with respect to Senator Glenn on the matters investigated during the preliminary inquiry. Senator McCain

Based on the evidence available to it, the committee has given consideration to Senator McCain's actions on behalf of Lincoln Savings and Loan Association. The committee concludes that Senator McCain's actions were not improper nor attended with gross negligence and did not reach the level of requiring institutional action against him. The committee finds that Senator McCain took no further action after the April 9, 1987, meeting when he learned of the criminal referral.
   . . .

Senator McCain has violated no law of the United States or specific Rule of the United States Senate; therefore, the committee concludes that no further action is warranted with respect to Senator McCain on the matters investigated during the preliminary inquiry. Senator Riegle

Based on the evidence available to it, the committee has given consideration to Senator Riegle's actions on behalf of Lincoln Savings and Loan Association. The committee finds that Senator Riegle took steps to assist Lincoln Savings & Loan Association with its regulatory problems at a time that Charles Keating was raising substantial campaign funds, for Senator Riegle. During the course of the hearings, possible conflicts arose concerning actions on the part of Senator Riegle that caused the committee concern, but the committee finds that the evidence indicates no deliberate intent to deceive. The evidence shows that Senator Riegle took no further action after the April 9, 1987, meeting where he learned of the criminal referral.

While the committee concludes that Senator Riegle has violated no law of the United States or specific rule of the United States Senate, it emphasizes that it does not condone his conduct. The committee has concluded that the totality of the evidence shows that Senator Riegle's conduct gave the appearance of being improper and was certainly attended with insensitivity and poor judgment. However, the committee finds that his conduct did not reach a level requiring institutional action.

The committee concludes that no further action is warranted with respect to Senator Riegle on the matters investigated during the preliminary inquiry.


http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0CE2D71539F93BA15751C0A967958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all

 101st Congress (1989-1991)

Majority Leader: George J. Mitchell (D-ME)

Minority Leader: Robert Dole (R-KS)

Note: George Mitchell was elected Democratic leader on November 29, 1988, effective January 3, 1989.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

102nd Congress (1991-1993)

Majority Leader: George J. Mitchell (D-ME)

Minority Leader: Robert Dole (R-KS)


Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2008, 07:20:16 PM »
While you quoted the Senate Ethics Panel results, the Keating Five were also investigated by the State of California and the US Dept of Justice - neither of those investigations yielded any evidence of corruption or wrongdoing.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2008, 07:21:17 PM »
"The average regulatory investigation takes ____ months from ordering the investigation to draft preliminary report.  THIS investigation took ____.  The average investigation takes_______ from draft preliminary to final investigation report; this one took ________.  How much time did the Senator gain for his jailbird friend and big-time donor before the Feds finally closed him down?  ____months;  ____months in which they were, thanks to Senator John M. McCain, still raking in over $__________ daily, from unsuspecting working, saving Americans like you.  [showing pictures of average Americans]  Like your parents. [more pictures]  Like your grandparents.[more pix]

OK, now fill in the blanks. Obviously, you have the info close to hand.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Christians4LessGvt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11153
    • View Profile
    • "The Religion Of Peace"
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2008, 07:22:30 PM »
"Senator McCain has violated no law of the United States or specific Rule of the United States Senate; therefore, the committee concludes that no further action is warranted with respect to Senator McCain on the matters investigated during the preliminary inquiry"

Thank you BT
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #25 on: May 30, 2008, 07:43:12 PM »
BT posted an artfully edited version of the Senate Ethics Committee report.  Basically, as far as McCain is concerned, BT posted the CONCLUSIONS of the Ctee and nothing of what McCain actually did.  That is why I would like to see a TV commercial focused only on the facts.

Absent from BT's post is any clue of what McCain did - - he basically kept Federal regulators at bay for his crooked friend Keating so Keating could continue to defraud the public.  The Senate Ethics Committee found no laws were broken.  So be it.  The public may well conclude, no laws were broken.  The Senate Ethics committee found, McCain did nothing wrong.   Fine.  The public may not be as lax and as tolerant as the Senate Ethics Committee.  The public, the ultimate judge of a candidate's worthiness to serve, may well find, contrary to the Ethics Committee, that he DID do something wrong.

What's the matter, is the Senate Ethics Committee the only one entitled to an opinion around here as to what's right and wrong?  The public has no right to its own opinion?

Here's a quick litmus test for you:  If what McCain did was not wrong, Why did BT, in tracking down the Committee's report, DELETE every reference to what McCain actually DID, and show us only what the Committee concluded?

I am confident that the public, if shown ONLY the facts of McCain's actions - - the same facts made known to the Committee in its investigation - - will not be as tolerant as the Committee.  After all, WHO IS THE U.S. SENATE?  WHITE MALE MILLIONAIRES WORKING FOR YOU.  (A brilliant, sly and cynical phrase - - what is the likelihood that a white male millionaire would really want to work for YOU?)  They are shot through with  bullshit artists, liars and thieves.  Smart enough to stay out of jail for the most part, but not exactly the moral arbiters of the nation.  They're not even particularly skillful criminal prosecutors.  Notwithstanding the Committee's conclusions, it is not inconceivable that an energetic and resourceful prosecutor could convince a judge and jury that a criminal act had been committed.  But I don't take my argument that far.

All I say is:  show what the bastard did.  Step by step.  Meeting by meeting.  Something that BT isn't too anxious to show anyone, as he snips and snips around the Committee report until only its conclusions appear.  The Senate Committee saw the facts and rendered its opinion.  Let the public see the same facts and render ITS opinion.

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #26 on: May 30, 2008, 07:50:20 PM »
All I say is:  show what the bastard did.  Step by step.  Meeting by meeting.

Feel free. This is what I asked you for - please post your evidence. You have access to the same report as well. Go ahead and get the US DOJ and State of California's reports as well. Post the info. We're waiting with baited breath.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #27 on: May 30, 2008, 08:29:41 PM »
Bated.  You're waiting with bated breath.

I'm just the idea man.  And the writer.  I leave it to bigger organizations with research assistants to fill in the blanks.  The essence of the story is as I've reported here.  The actual dates, number of meetings, delay times, Keating's profits, the per diem, weekly, etc. cash flows - - fuck it, I've got better things to do with my time.  I can get kids at $50 - $70 /hr to fill in the blanks.  All I know is this thing's been researched into the ground.  Lots of stories out there on it.  Anyone with access to Lexis-Nexis can dig out everything I need in two to four hours. 

And don't kid yourself - - someone at moveon.org is going to do just that.  MORE than one video is probably in production as we speak.  They're all gonna be good, ONE'S gonna be great.  I wish I coulda done it, but it's not really my line.  This one'll hit that war criminal/turd/crook like a ton a bricks.

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2008, 08:44:02 PM »
"... what McCain did - - he basically kept Federal regulators at bay for his crooked friend Keating so Keating could continue to defraud the public.  "



From what do we know this?

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Half of white women now have a negative perception of Obama
« Reply #29 on: May 30, 2008, 08:50:48 PM »
<<From what do we know this?>>

Wikipedia's a good place ("Keating Five" or follow the links in "John McCain") to start.  But just google "Keating Five" and you'll find a ton of articles.