Author Topic: Net access tax?  (Read 2373 times)

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The_Professor

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Net access tax?
« on: May 24, 2007, 03:16:47 PM »
Politicians weigh renewal of Net access tax ban

By Anne Broache
http://news.com.com/Politicians+weigh+renewal+of+Net+access+tax+ban/2100-1028_3-6185868.html

Story last modified Wed May 23 06:40:05 PDT 2007

 
WASHINGTON--With only months left on a moratorium restricting state governments from taxing Internet access, the U.S. House of Representatives on Tuesday began a debate over whether the ban should be made permanent or allowed to lapse.
At issue is the scheduled expiration on November 1 of a law, initially enacted in 1998, that says local governments generally cannot tax Internet access, including DSL (digital subscriber line), cable modem and BlackBerry-type wireless transmission services. The law also prohibits governments from taxing items sold online in a different manner than those sold at brick-and-mortar stores, but it does not deal with sales taxes on online shopping.

That's the way it should remain, some politicians said at a brief hearing here convened by a House of Representatives panel on commercial and administrative law.

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Former House Majority Leader Dick Armey talks to News.com
about Internet taxation. "If we could liken the Internet to a mall, a place where you can go in and purchase goods and services, and also liken it to a library, a place where you can go and pull a book, pull a resource, and obtain some information, why would we tax a person upon entering a mall or why would we tax a person upon entering the library?" asked Rep. Hank Johnson, a Democrat from Georgia.

Industries that provide Internet access services have long backed making the ban permanent, and they already enjoy support from some members of Congress. In the House, Rep. Anna Eshoo, a California Democrat, has introduced such a measure, and senators have made similar moves.

But previous attempts at renewing the ban for more than two to four years have failed, in part because of resistance from state and local government lobby groups. State government representatives caution against making the moratorium permanent, saying it would deprive states indefinitely of vital revenue sources and that its original purpose--boosting the nascent Internet to commercial viability--has essentially been accomplished.

A 'slippery slope'
"If a moratorium is made permanent, there is a slippery slope where other industries will seek their own preemptions of state laws," said David Quam, director of federal relations for the National Governors Association.

The NGA supports the idea of extending the ban in a limited sense and for a defined time period, he added. He said reports by government auditors and the University of Tennessee have shown no statistical correlation between levels of broadband penetration and the existence of Internet access taxes.

Rep. Jim Jordan, an Ohio Republican and one of 66 House members who co-sponsored the permanent ban proposal, suggested he wasn't swayed by that argument. "Taxes always impact everything else in our economy," he said. "I would assume they've had a major impact in this area as well."

As a rule, economists dislike taxes that could discourage investment, but taxes that could hinder build-out of the Internet are especially problematic, argued Scott Mackey, an economist and partner at the law firm Kimbell Sherman Ellis. He spoke on behalf of a coalition of Internet service providers, "backbone" providers and application and content companies that support a permanent extension of the tax ban.

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"A permanent moratorium will send a strong, pro-investment signal to those entrepreneurs that are looking to improve communications and commerce over the Internet," he told the politicians.

A U.S. Senate committee is scheduled to weigh the issue at its own hearing scheduled for Wednesday.

A separate issue on one politician's mind was what to do about the collection of sales taxes on the Internet. State governments have long griped that they are losing revenue to booming e-commerce businesses that aren't required to collect taxes from customers in states where the businesses don't have a physical presence. Rep. Bill Delahunt, a Democrat from Massachusetts, said he was planning to try again at enacting a bill designed to address those concerns.

As for the Net tax ban, he said, "my own position is we ought to have a temporary moratorium until we finally resolve the issue of how the states are going to support public services with an eroding tax base predicated on the growth of e-commerce."

http://news.com.com/2102-1028_3-6185868.html?tag=st.util.print

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kimba1

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2007, 03:55:59 PM »
"If we could liken the Internet to a mall, a place where you can go in and purchase goods and services, and also liken it to a library, a place where you can go and pull a book, pull a resource, and obtain some information, why would we tax a person upon entering a mall or why would we tax a person upon entering the library?"



what the hell is he talking about
libraries amd malls don`t charge money so the tax would effect people in a library
and the laws regarding mail-order is totally compartable with internet business.
except mail-order can handle checks .

kimba1

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2007, 04:15:32 PM »
opps
wrote that too fast

I mean that since nobody is charging to enter a library or mall taxes with not effect people entering them

but all online purchases can be taxes by the sameway mail-orders are done.

Lanya

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2007, 05:58:17 PM »
I think he made perfect sense.  And the analogy to malls and libraries is very apt, in that a tax on entering them would discourage people from...entering them.  And we don't want that.  Bad for business and for an educated populace.  Same thing with the internet.  Bad for etc.etc.
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kimba1

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2007, 07:25:03 PM »
not quite
this is a complete broadbase ban on taxes
meaning almost no taxes is paid for the internet business

from the article
<
The law also prohibits governments from taxing items sold online in a different manner than those sold at brick-and-mortar stores, but it does not deal with sales taxes on online shopping.
>
this is a serious advantage over the regular business,with no reason

Lanya

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2007, 08:32:02 PM »
I am sorry, Kimba, I didn't read it very well.  You have a serious point there. 
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Amianthus

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2007, 12:24:09 AM »
It says that they can only charge the same tax on an online purchase as if you purchased it in a store. ("The law also prohibits governments from taxing items sold online in a different manner than those sold at brick-and-mortar stores").

Don't know why that is a bad thing...
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Lanya

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2007, 02:13:27 AM »
A separate issue on one politician's mind was what to do about the collection of sales taxes on the Internet. State governments have long griped that they are losing revenue to booming e-commerce businesses that aren't required to collect taxes from customers in states where the businesses don't have a physical presence. Rep. Bill Delahunt, a Democrat from Massachusetts, said he was planning to try again at enacting a bill designed to address those concerns.

As for the Net tax ban, he said, "my own position is we ought to have a temporary moratorium until we finally resolve the issue of how the states are going to support public services with an eroding tax base predicated on the growth of e-commerce."
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So figure out what taxes to charge, and charge them. 
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Amianthus

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2007, 06:42:41 AM »
So figure out what taxes to charge, and charge them. 

They're already doing that. All states are in the process (some have passed, others have legislation pending) that would enable collection without a physical presence.

This bill does not ban that - it only bans states from charging a DIFFERENT RATE for online sales.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

The_Professor

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2007, 06:22:17 PM »
Weell, I just purchased a new Dell laptop for my wife and they didn't charge me!
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BT

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2007, 08:02:10 PM »
Why should they be able to tax internet sales?  What infrastructure costs do states contribute to a virtual world?


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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2007, 08:14:01 PM »
Why should they be able to tax internet sales?  What infrastructure costs do states contribute to a virtual world?

Excellent point bt

Lanya

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2007, 10:23:41 PM »
What infrastructure costs?

Electricity grids, power plants, coal mine inspectors (to inspect coal mines which feed the power plants),  roadways to deliver new laptops, mail service to deliver same.  That's all I can think of right now.  Might be more.
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BT

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2007, 11:11:56 PM »
All of which already feed the states coffers.


Let's say you buy a tshirt from Brass for his Oz' Lion flick.

You live in Ohio so currently you are not subject to sales tax on an item purchased from Brass. He ships the tee shirt via UPS. UPS pays taxes on it's profits. Brass pays UPS. You pay Brass for the Tee shirt as well as the shipping. Part of the cost of the shipping pays for taxes on aviiation fuel and gasoline or diesel which helps maintain the roads.

Brass pays the electric company for the power he uses to process the order. The electric company pays the coal company for raw materials and they in turn pay taxes which pays for their inspectors.

So  again what infrastructure improvements do states bring to the table to treat internet sales different than mail order sales, which to the best of my recollection are not taxed either.



Lanya

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Re: Net access tax?
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2007, 03:07:01 AM »
All of which already feed the states coffers.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Electricity grids pay the states? I had no idea.  The interstate highway system pays the states?  There again, I didn't know.  All these things pay the states, who'd a thunk it?
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