Author Topic: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus  (Read 1375 times)

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BT

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How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« on: December 05, 2011, 08:08:34 PM »
How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
Should a scientist's truly frightening experiments be published?

By Michael Mechanic | Sat Dec. 3, 2011 3:00 AM PST

In science, the unwritten rule has always been to publish your results first and worry about the fallout later. More knowledge is always good, right? Information wants to be free.

But what if the thing you want to publish is truly frightening?

Millions-dead kind of frightening.

This isn't a rhetorical question, in light of some experiments [1] now in the pipeline for publication. H5N1 influenza viruses—a.k.a Avian flu—are efficient killers that have wiped out some poultry flocks and a few hundred hapless people who were in close contact with the birds. (New Scientist reports [2] that 565 people are known to have caught the bird flu and 331 died.) But at Erasmus Medical Center in Rotterdam, the Netherlands, virologist Ron Fouchier has created an Avian flu that, unlike other H5N1 strains, easily spreads between ferrets—which have so far proven a reliable model for determining transmissibility in humans. What's more, his breakthrough, funded by the National Institutes of Health, involved relatively low-tech methods.

Are you scared yet? You have reason to be. In the December 2 issue of Science magazine, Fouchier admits that his creation "is probably one of the most dangerous viruses you can make," while Paul Keim, a scientist who works on anthrax, adds, "I can't think of another pathogenic organism that is as scary as this one." (Here's a summary [3]; you'll need a subscription to read the full text.)

Now Fouchier hopes to publish the results of experiments—first announced in September at a meeting of flu researchers in Malta—that many scientists believe should never have been done in the first place. He and Yoshihiro Kawaoka, a virologist at the University of Wisconsin who is reportedly seeking to publish a similar study, have long pursued this line of research, hoping to determine whether H5N1 has the potential to become infectious in people, a jump that could trigger a worldwide pandemic. Knowing the specific genetic mutations that make the virus transmissible, Fouchier told Science, will help researchers respond quickly if this sort of killer virus were to emerge in nature.

This type of research is euphemistically known as "dual-use," which means it could be used for good or evil. Publishing such work is a "risk-benefit calculation," Donald Kennedy, then editor-in-chief of Science, told me for a story published on the first anniversary of 9/11. Science, Kennedy said, had never rejected an article out of concern that the information could be misused, although, he added, "I suppose one could conceive of a scenario in which one would decline to publish."
"If I were a journal editor and I received an article that said how to make a bioweapon, I'd never publish it, but that would be based on self-regulation, not any government restriction."

"If I were a journal editor and I received an article that said how to make a bioweapon, I'd never publish it, but that would be based on self-regulation, not any government restriction," added bioterror expert and retired Harvard professor Matt Meselson. "I've never heard of a case where the government has restricted publication. I don't think it would work."

Kawaoka, whose lab has also published methods for reconstituting a pathogenic virus from its DNA sequence, didn't respond to Science, but when I talked to him back in 2002, he was adamant that dual-use data should be published. He argued that even recipes for nuclear weapons exist online, and that once you start censoring potentially dangerous results, you may as well ban knives and guns and even airplanes—the terrorists' weapon of choice the previous September.

What most troubles critics now was the lack of any meaningful review of Fouchier's experiments before they were conducted. Some scientists think any work this dangerous should be vetted by an international panel; others reject the notion, fearing that such a move would create an unacceptable bottleneck in the flow of scientific information.

Back in 2002, I also spoke with Brian Mahy, a virologist with the Centers for Disease Control, and part of the team that had sequenced smallpox and several other highly dangerous pathogens in the early 1990s. Toward the end of the smallpox project, Mahy told me, the team had internal debates about whether to go public. "My view is it was scientific evidence that needed to be in the public domain, and we're a public institution, so we published it," he said. "There were suggestions it be burned onto a CD-ROM and chained to [then-CDC chief] Bernadine Healy's desk."

But such decisions, then and now, have been left largely in the hands of the researchers. The U.S. National Science Advisory Board for Biosecurity [4], an NIH advisory panel, is currently reviewing the Fouchier and Kawaoka papers, according to Science. But in 2007, the board recommended against mandating prior reviews of dual-use research. Instead, it suggested that scientists alert their institutional review boards to any experiments of concern—something they were supposed to be doing already. Keim, who sits on the NSABB, told Science that any potential risks should be flagged at "the very first glimmer of an experiment…You shouldn't wait until you have submitted a paper before you decide it's dangerous."

These particular experiments, it's safe to say, were exceedingly strong candidates for scrutiny.
Source URL: http://motherjones.com/environment/2011/12/how-make-deadly-pandemic-virus

Links:
[1] http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21128314.600-five-easy-mutations-to-make-bird-flu-a-lethal-pandemic.html
[2] http://mojo.ly/tWbJz0
[3] http://www.sciencemag.org/content/334/6060/1192.summary
[4] http://oba.od.nih.gov/biosecurity/about_nsabb.html

Plane

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2011, 08:19:26 PM »
  Stephen King wrothe this one.


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0108941/

BT

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2011, 08:30:57 PM »
Yeah i was thinking the Stand would work for the aftermath of the clash between the owwies and the rest of the people, next spring or summer.


kimba1

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2011, 11:36:23 AM »
I wonder can someone publish a fake bioweapon research like the one done about cold fusion. It's not like anyone who tries to recreate it can complain it's false.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2011, 12:49:40 PM »
Someone could, actually.

Someone did: we heard about Saddam's "weaponized smallpox" and "weaponized anthrax". Some ex-AF captain flyboy on my college's faculty was utterly convinced of it and spread the word about it in our faculty lunchroom. They sure convinced him of it in his briefings, along with Saddam's poison gas and Saddam's nukes.

By the time the WMD's were shown to be nonexistent, he had retired. Too d, never got a chance to tell him that he had been full of it.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

kimba1

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2011, 01:46:11 PM »
Awhile back I hear of research to combine ebola with flesh eating virus and thought,  why? death is not enough ,you need agony on with it?

ever notice that the vaccine for these viruses are not exactly safe to take. put ethics aside bioweapons is not safe for the people who use them. not exactly a science for smart people.


Xavier_Onassis

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2011, 02:25:14 PM »
put ethics aside bioweapons is not safe for the people who use them. not exactly a science for smart people.

===========================
I agree entirely.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2011, 12:52:06 AM »
  Compared to Atomic wepons they are cheap per casualty, and they don't ruin all the swag.

     This appeals to the poorer attacker.

      P.S. the main equipment needed is an appropriate education.

kimba1

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2011, 01:13:58 AM »
Antrax I'm ok with anthrax,but the ebola hybrid and the superbird flu is just looks like a supid pursuit to me. Note never talking about effective cures for these viruses,only the creation of it. If it's not mentioned it likely not considered.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2011, 09:39:26 AM »
I can't say I am okay with anthrax at all, but creating a new ghastly disease without devising a way for people to be immune to it is truly stupid.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2011, 09:27:14 PM »
  Most of these are investigations of  things that can happen naturally, it would be really good to understand them well before they do happen naturally.

   Influenza is already a dangerous disease and every now and then it attacks us with a new set of tools out of its tool box, if we had an inventory of that tool box we could make good use of it.

    Some of these investigations are of things that are likely wepons , I don't think it unlikely that biological attacks might ocur in the future , preparation has to include a good understanding of the threat.


      On this subject I worry about two things.

  1.     Poltry farming , where huge flocks are injected with sub-theraputic doses of  antibiotics, a course for disaster that we foolishly ignore , shrimp farming the same .

   2.     Sloppy labroatorys, I mean small nations or malicious nations or large terrorist groups or individuals with more education than sense. A bio agent or toxin could be made by a hobbyist with the cutting edge tecnology, malicious or careless experimenters could produce a "Captain Tripps" intending to make a wepon and antidote , but fail on the antidote .

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2011, 09:40:20 PM »
Here in Miami until recently, there were guys selling frozen shrimp in 3 lb. bags for $10.00. Of course, those who bought them realized too late that they had been thawed and refrozen with a couple of pounds of water added, so they were buying 8 lbs. of shrimp and 2 lbs or more of water. Even worse, there was no guarantee that they were fresh.

They have stopped doing this recently, I suspect that they were excess shrimp that supermarkets would not buy, and a couple of shysters devised this plan to unload them on the street, using the guys that normally sell flowers from Colombia.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Amianthus

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2011, 10:40:07 PM »
Here in Miami until recently, there were guys selling frozen shrimp in 3 lb. bags for $10.00. Of course, those who bought them realized too late that they had been thawed and refrozen with a couple of pounds of water added, so they were buying 8 lbs. of shrimp and 2 lbs or more of water. Even worse, there was no guarantee that they were fresh.

What a deal. Pay for 3 pounds of shrimp and get 8 pounds.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: How to Make a Deadly Pandemic Virus
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2011, 11:11:52 PM »
What I meant was that what people got was 2 lbs. of shrimp (worth $8.00) and 1 lb. of water, instead of the 3 lbs. they thought they were getting. Small shrimp were frozen in such a way as to look like larger shrimp, as the ice tended to make them look larger.

Sorry, I got the dollars and the pounds mixed up. should have reread it.

At the time, frozen shrimp was selling for around $4.00 a pound in the supermarkets, but with not the extra water.

They stopped selling these one day, I don't know whether it was the cops or the health dept. or they arrested the guys in charge.

I won't buy fish or shrimp on the street myself.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."