DebateGate

Is this women retarded or what, - - - she says the dumbest things and does it often.



http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080828/D92R51M81.html

Pelosi gets unwanted lesson in Catholic theology

Aug 28, 3:13 AM (ET)

By RACHEL ZOLL

Politics can be treacherous. But House Speaker Nancy Pelosi walked on even riskier ground in a recent TV interview when she attempted a theological defense of her support for abortion rights.

Roman Catholic bishops consider her arguments on St. Augustine and free will so far out of line with church teaching that they have issued a steady stream of statements to correct her.

The latest came Wednesday from Pittsburgh Bishop David Zubik, who said Pelosi, D-Calif., "stepped out of her political role and completely misrepresented the teaching of the Catholic Church in regard to abortion."

It has been a harsh week of rebuke for the Democratic congresswoman, a Catholic school graduate who repeatedly has expressed pride in and love for her religious heritage.

Cardinals and archbishops in Washington, D.C., Philadelphia, New York and Denver are among those who have criticized her remarks. Archbishop George Niederauer, in Pelosi's hometown of San Francisco, will take up the issue in the Sept. 5 edition of the archdiocesan newspaper, his spokesman said.

Sunday, on NBC's "Meet the Press" program, Pelosi said "doctors of the church" have not been able to define when life begins.

She also cited the role of individual conscience. "God has given us, each of us, a free will and a responsibility to answer for our actions," she said.

Brendan Daly, a spokesman for Pelosi, said in a statement defending her remarks that she "fully appreciates the sanctity of family" and based her views on conception on the "views of Saint Augustine, who said, 'The law does not provide that the act (abortion) pertains to homicide, for there cannot yet be said to be a live soul in a body that lacks sensation.'"

But whether or not parishioners choose to accept it, the theology on the procedure is clear. From its earliest days, Christianity has considered abortion evil.

"This teaching has remained unchanged and remains unchangeable," according to the Catechism of the Catholic Church. "Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law."

The Rev. Douglas Milewski, a Seton Hall University theologian who specializes in Augustine, said Pelosi seems to be confusing church teaching on abortion with the theological debate over when a fetus receives a soul.

"Saint Augustine wondered about the stages of human development before birth, how this related to the question of ensoulment and what it meant for life in the Kingdom of God," Milewski said.

Questions about ensoulment related to determining penalties under church law for early and later abortions, not deciding whether the procedure is permissible, according to the U.S. Bishops' Committee on Pro-Life Activities.

Augustine was "quite clear on the immorality of abortion as evil violence, destructive of the very fabric of human bonds and society," Milewski said.

Regarding individual decision-making, the church teaches that Catholics are obliged to use their conscience in considering moral issues. However, that doesn't mean parishioners can pick and choose what to believe and still be in line with the church.

Lisa Sowle Cahill, a theologian at Boston College, said conscience must be formed by Catholic teaching and philosophical insights. "It's not just a personal opinion that you came up with randomly," she said.

Catholic theologians today overwhelmingly consider debate over the morality of abortion settled. Thinkers and activists who attempt to challenge the theology are often considered on the fringes of church life.

However, there is a rigorous debate over how the teaching should guide voters and public officials. Are Catholics required to choose the candidate who opposes abortion? Or can they back a politician based on his or her policies on reducing, not outlawing, the procedure?

The U.S. bishops addressed this question in their election-year public policy guide, "Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship."

They said that voting for a candidate specifically because he or she supports "an intrinsic evil" such as abortion amounts to "formal cooperation in grave evil."

In some cases, Catholics may vote for a candidate with a position contrary to church teaching, but only for "truly grave moral reasons, not to advance narrow interests or partisan preferences," according to the document.

It is a complex discussion. The Rev. Thomas Reese, senior fellow at the Woodstock Theological Center at Georgetown University, has some advice for candidates who seek to join the debate: Stick to politics - and support programs that truly help reduce the number of abortions.

"It is a big mistake," Reese said, "for politicians to talk theology."

Quote from: Kramer on August 27, 2008, 03:21:19 PM

Where is their nonwhite high office holders, judges & leaders.

Is their highest paid citizens black women - nope

The lady on the left is Her Excellency the Right Honorable Michaëlle Jean, Governor General of Canada.

looks token to me got any more.

How about an equal to rice, thomas, powell, oh that's right the Democrat Part doesn't even qualify for those positions within their ranks. sad real sad.

It was a great and very informative trip. I will be returning to Paraguay, Uruguay and Argentina I am sure. All are very interesting and the people are very friendly. A LOT friendly, I think than Americans, who, of course, think they are the friendliest folks on Earth.

When Uruguayos wave their giant rubber fingers and shout Uruguay numero Uno. It is only in a soccer stadium. They are patriotic and proud of Uruguay, but like the idea that the current president a medical doctor, Tabare Vasquez, refuses to live in the rather nice presidential palace, so that he can continue to treat his patients in the office next to his home. There is one agreed-upon national hero, the gaucho General Artigas. But there are about thirty parks dedicated to the heroes of other countries.


I will let everyone know the web addresses where I post all this, but it will take a while.

Move there, you would be much happier. Have your SS check deposited in a SA bank and live like a queen...Plus with the Internet you can still post here and insult people that you disagree with.

I second kimba's motion.  It's the obvious solution.  The kid's out of his league, as they say. 

When my son was in Little League, there was a rule that the game would be called in favour of the leading team if they opened up a thirty-point lead.  This would spare the losing team the embarrassment and the depression of being whipped 120 to 3, once it became obvious that's where the game was headed.  Kids play for fun, and not everyone in the Little Leagues is going to be headed into the majors.  The league is a service and its users are the players.  They come looking for fun, not life lessons, and if there's no fun for a 9-year-old in being whipped 100 to 1, the league has to remove whatever it is that makes it not fun.

It's the same with a Little Leaguer and a 40-mph fast ball.  Every kid who steps up to the plate is going to be struck out or walked.  In addition, in return for the pleasure of being humiliated in every one of his at-bats, the kid has to run the risk of being hit by a 40-mph ball and seriously injured.  A parent would have to be nuts to put his kid into a "game" like that.

Bumping the pitcher up to the next division is an obvious win-win solution to the problem.  It's pure common sense, something that once again the conservatives who comment on this issue have proven they completely lack.

This is silly -
How should we handle Obama's loss so liberals don't develop a complex because they are losers?

Where is their nonwhite high office holders, judges & leaders.

Is their highest paid citizens black women - nope

Do they have any blacks running for high office and if they did do they stand a snowballs chance in hell of winning - nope

Canada is filled with racists going back to the early days when they killed native Indians.

Nasty Pelosi Quotes

House Democratic leaders and protesters waving McCain signs had a war of words Tuesday at a press event outside an old train station. The demonstrators interrupted House Speaker Nancy Pelosi with chants of “Drill here! Drill now!”

Pelosi paused and asked the group, “Right here?”

Seeming to enjoy the back and forth, she followed with another question: “Can we drill your brains?”

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Pelosi said Sunday on NBC's ``Meet the Press'' that ``doctors of the church'' have not been able to define when life begins. That prompted swift rebukes from Washington Archbishop Donald Wuerl and Denver Archbishop Charles Chaput, who said Pelosi was incorrect and that Catholic teaching has consistently condemned abortion.

This makes the most sense for McCain to pick a women.

_Dec. 3, 2007: "So you decide which makes more sense: Entrust our country to someone who is ready on Day One ... or to put America in the hands of someone with little national or international experience, who started running for president the day he arrived in the U.S. Senate."

_March 2008. "I know Sen. McCain has a lifetime of experience that he will bring to the White House. And Sen. Obama has a speech he gave in 2002."

_Feb. 23, 2008: "Now, I could stand up here and say, 'Let's just get everybody together. Let's get unified.' The skies will open, the light will come down, celestial choirs will be singing and everyone will know we should do the right thing and the world will be perfect."