DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: kimba1 on July 17, 2016, 08:46:36 PM
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DISCUSS
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The cops in Baton Rouge seemed to have escalated their forces, and perhaps that shook some nuts loose from the other side. Louisiana has the highest murder rate in the country and lots and lots of guns. Naturally, I oppose sniping at cops, but those who start pissing matches can expect to get wet. The guy the cops killed was smothered beneath two cops and one of them seems to have shot him at point blank range.
He was nor actually guilty of anything. Some panhandler was pestering him, he showed the panhandler that he had a gun and the panhandler reported it to the cops. It s only mildly stupid to show a gun to a panhandler. But that is what brought the cops to the scene. Everyone would have been better off had they simply enjoyed some donuts and kept their cool.
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It is a crime to brandish a gun at someone, even when it is a good idea.
I would not have jumped all over that guy just because I was told he had a gun, are our police trained to do that?
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The cops in Baton Rouge seemed to have escalated their forces,
Oh priceless.....it's the police's fault. How dare they do the extra effort of trying to protect themselves. How racist of them
I oppose sniping at cops, but those who start pissing matches can expect to get wet. The guy the cops killed was smothered beneath two cops and one of them seems to have shot him at point blank range.
Because he had a GUN, and appeared to be REACHING FOR IT. But nice to know you're on record as indicating the police had it coming >:(
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Because he had a GUN, and appeared to be REACHING FOR IT. But nice to know you're on record as indicating the police had it coming >:(
That is BULLSHIT the guy was squashed under two cops. He was not moving in any way inconsistent with some poor guy squashed between two cops.
Wha6t is open carry besides constant brandishing? Giver me a break, sirs, you are totally out of your league as well as your gourd.
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A well-trained Marine sergeant with an assault rifle. This is Juniorbush's unjustified war and the NRA's idiocy coming home to roost and taking a crap on America's head.
Go on! Buy more guns! Make us safer!
Good guys with guns FAIL AGAIN!
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I really have no idea why you keep thinking CCW carriers are trained to take on some thug with a gun. We're trained to defend ourselves from a thug with a gun, NOT go after them. That's the job of the Police. Nor was this fella targeting unsuspecting citizens, that might have CCW's. HE WAS TARGETING POLICE OFFICERS
And news flash...brandishing is not the same as open carry. Brandishing is holding it and producing a threat to someone else. Open carry means someone can see it, but its holstered
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What was it that your hero Wayne LaPierre said? "The only thing that will stop a bad man with a gun is a good man with a gun."
He did not say a "good cop with a gun". Police have been armed with guns forever. All Americans accept that police need guns.
Pierre was not arguing for police to be armed. He was arguing for gun nuts to be armed.
So you and all the gun nuts in this land have been deputized by Wayne LaPierre to stop bad men with guns.
It's that simple,.
You no likee, take it up with La Pierre.
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A cop IS a good guy with a gun. ::)
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I really want to see more before I make up my mind on this one.
Just that this guy had a gun with him is not a good reason to tackle him.
If there was not more provocation and reasonable suspicion than has been exposed to the public so far then these police have done a bad job.
Knowing that a citizen has a gun should not increase a policeman's likely hood of grabbing at him.
After all, where are the people that a policeman knows certainly are not armed?
There must be some more facts to come.
There were body cams there, what does the situation look like in them?
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Precisely, Plane. We need all the facts, not just some video snippet with an already cop-guilty conclusion of some targeted killing of a black man by white cops.
And on a related note,
- has anyone noted the lack of reporting that the officer involved in the Minnesota shooting wasn't white?
- Anyone noticing also the lack of reporting that there was a black officer killed in Louisiana?
- Anyone notice the lack of reporting as to the Louisiana killer's apparent "political" affiliation(s)?
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We will be lucky to get enough facts.
Even though there may have been four recording devices present.
It is rare to get ALL of the facts............
....and common to be handed all the facts that fit an agenda or narrative.
The best we can hope for is some honest reporting and a FOIA on the evidence the police have.
I think we are really not accustomed yet to cameras being all over the place.
Nasty incidents like this are in all probability less common , but much more seen.
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Well, golly, the body cams on both of the Baton Rouge cops fell plumb off.
As Church Lady was wont to say, "How con VEEEEEN-ient!"
There was no reason for Sterling to be dead. I bet the City of Baton Rouge pays a nice settlement, just like Baltimore did to Feeddy Gray's family.
Just another "unfortunate accident," right sirs?
Them Black folks sure has themselves a lot of unfortunate accidents.
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Yes...it was. Had he complied wifh officers, he'd be alive today. Lesson 1.....when an officee gives you a command YOU OBEY IT, AND KEEP YOUR HANDS AWAY FROM YOUR BODY & POCKETS
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There is zero evidence on any of the videos that this guy was any threat whatever to these cops.
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And we know that how again??
As in we don't know what happened just prior to this video being taken.....as in we don't have all the facts to make that claim. That was the same claim given to Brown in the Ferguson shooting, until the facts provided that while Brown was "unarmed", he was hardly a non-threat, as he attacked and tried to disarm a police officer.
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As in we don't know what happened just prior to this video being taken.....
This is what I think will make those body cams interesting.
I suspect that they don't make the police look innocent, they could have been published by now it they were clearly exonerating.
If the bodycams were any use, the time to use them is now or sooner.
I am afraid that the footage is so bad that they will be held back as long as possible , the old Clinton trick. The significance may be forgotten by the time the information is free.
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The officers claimed that their body cams--BOTH of then-- were knocked off in the struggle.
I deem it probable that they did not have them on in the first place. These two cops were NOT making Baton Rouge safer.
They were bullying.
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Your OPINION is duly noted. The rest of us will wait for the actual facts to be presented
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The officers claimed that their body cams--BOTH of then-- were knocked off in the struggle.
I deem it probable that they did not have them on in the first place. These two cops were NOT making Baton Rouge safer.
They were bullying.
Unless they were destroyed in the process these bodycams would be witness to the first few moments of that fight.
Perhaps including convincing proof perhaps not , but where is it?
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No one has said one damned word about any bodycam images.
It is likely that they were not even wearing them, or turned them off.
Whey they would NOT show was this guy reaching for a gun. They would have shot him before any scuffle had that been the case.
The cops lied, and the head cops are covering up for them
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Your OPINION is duly noted. The rest of us will wait for the actual facts to be presented
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Whey they would NOT show was this guy reaching for a gun. They would have shot him before any scuffle had that been the case.
This is probably true, but this is not an empty set.
If they had a good reason to grab him it might show in these videos , but I expect that the bodycams are showing misbehavior on the part of the police.
If what the bodycam shows is that the policeman turned the thing off just before beginning this confrontation this would be a malicious dereliction , it would show an intent to hide the truth, before there was anything to show.
If the knowledge that a person has a gun is by itself probable cause for arrest or reasonable excuse for policemen to knock you down, then the second amendment means nothing.
What happened in the moments immediately before this altercation is important to know.
If the police instigated the violence , they should be held responsible for the violence.
If they had the means to record that moment , and willfully refused to record that moment , then I think it reasonable to assume that they intended some bad behavior.
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What happened in the moments immediately before this altercation is important to know.
If the police instigated the violence , they should be held responsible for the violence.
If they had the means to record that moment , and willfully refused to record that moment , then I think it reasonable to assume that they intended some bad behavior.
PRECISELY
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I deem it improbable that any video taken by these body cams will ever be released to the public. At present, no one even knows if any footage even exists. It is clear that the cops entered the scene at a moment in which no one was being threatened by anyone. Some beggar simply ratted out the video guy for having a gun to get back at him for not giving him money. The DVD seller had no way of knowing why the cops had come unless they told him: he did not hear the bum telephone them, so he did not know that the police thought he had a gun.
The police could not be certain that Sterling had a gun either. All they had was hearsay gossip, probably relayed by the dispatcher.
It is highly probable that the police deliberately took off their cameras and decided to beat the crap out of Sterling for refusing to obey them.
It is even more probable that they will be charged with anything, because the tradition is that cops get away with beating the Hell out of uppity Negroes.
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Whatever you deem....the facts are we don't have all the facts
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If the facts favor Sterling, they will be dispensed with and the cops will prevail.
They might lose their jobs or be forced to quit, as there will be those who will be gunning for them.
That is the worst that will happen to the cops.
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If.....
THAT'S JUST IT.....you're just speculating at this point...If this, If that, If whatever. You've already made up your mind, just like you did in Ferguson, and damn any facts to the contrary
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It is very ordinary for the set of facts to be incomplete.
But...
If it looks like some facts are missing because defendants have been destroying the record , I consider it fair to assume that the missing record was incriminating.
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If it looks like some facts are missing because defendants have been destroying the record , I consider it fair to assume that the missing record was incriminating.
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I agree with you on this, Plane.
If we were to make a list of states in which corruption, racism by officials and shameless lying by officials were common, Louisiana would certainly be in the bottom five.
I am all for all the evidence being presented. But I note that possible video evidence from those body cams has so far been unmentioned by any official.