DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: Kramer on October 14, 2011, 03:49:16 PM
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Coast Guard member spit on near Occupy Boston tents
Updated: Friday, 14 Oct 2011, 8:53 AM EDT
Published : Thursday, 13 Oct 2011, 10:13 PM EDT
BOSTON (FOX 25 / MyFoxBoston.com) - The Coast Guard in Boston confirmed that a woman in uniform was harassed and spat upon near Occupy Boston protesters.
The woman was walking to the train and said protesters spit on her twice, called her foul names and even threw a water bottle at her.
Now, the Coast Guard is warning all staff working on Atlantic Avenue to avoid those protesters while in uniform.
Devon Pendleton, a spokesman for Occupy Boston, doesn't believe that those male protestors are actually part of the movement. However, Pendleton wants to be clear, that if protestors are responsible for doing something so disrespectful, he'd like to apologize on behalf of Occupy Boston.
Coast Guard official Luke Clayton tells FOX25 whether or not the people who spit on the woman are part of Occupy Boston or not, what happened is against the law and he expects police to protect them against things like this in the future.
More than 140 Occupy Boston protesters were arrested earlier this week for refusing to cooperate with police on the Rose Kennedy Greenway.
The peaceful protestors say the violence wasn't supposed to happen and a group of anarchists were the ones rebelling. They say they do not condone that type of behavior.
Some Occupy Boston members have told FOX 25 they plan on sticking it out through the winter. They have receive donations like tarps and tents to stay dry and have raised more than $11,000 online .
If the Occupy Boston protests only last through October, it could end up costing taxpayers $2 million in Police overtime costs.
FOX 25 went digging and found one reason the group may not have to get a permit, may stem from a federal lawsuit . Read more on that story here .
Read more: http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/news/local/occupy-boston-protesters-spit-on-coast-guard-member-20111013#ixzz1amdbtQb7 (http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/news/local/occupy-boston-protesters-spit-on-coast-guard-member-20111013#ixzz1amdbtQb7)
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No evidence at all that it was Occupy Boston! protestors spitting on the woman, but lack of evidence wouldn't stop Kramer from accusing them. Did Tea Party members spit on Congressman Lewis? Oh, that's a whole other story!
Almost everyone in the protest movement agrees that stories, whether true of not, of antiwar demonstrators spitting on servicemen, cost the antiwar movement a lot of support in Middle America during the Vietnam War, so
BE WARNED, folks, if you hear any stories of protestors spitting on servicemen, that spit sure as hell didn't come from any members of the Occupy! movement.
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BE WARNED, folks, if you hear any stories of protestors spitting on servicemen, that spit sure as hell didn't come from any members of the Occupy! movement.
Why not? Are that Occupiers that disciplined in their top down organization?
Who exactly do they take their orders from?
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No evidence at all that it was Occupy Boston! protestors spitting on the woman, but lack of evidence wouldn't stop Kramer from accusing them. Did Tea Party members spit on Congressman Lewis? Oh, that's a whole other story!
Almost everyone in the protest movement agrees that stories, whether true of not, of antiwar demonstrators spitting on servicemen, cost the antiwar movement a lot of support in Middle America during the Vietnam War, so
BE WARNED, folks, if you hear any stories of protestors spitting on servicemen, that spit sure as hell didn't come from any members of the Occupy! movement.
of course
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Let's say that it's possible that the odd person in the Occupy! movement doesn't know that it's bad to spit on troops.
Let's say that it's possible that the odd government or FBI officer charged with crushing dissent like this doesn't know how much the antiwar movement was damaged by allegations of spitting on troops.
Let's say that it's possible that the odd conservative activist or MSM hack doesn't know how much the antiwar movement was damaged by allegations of spitting on troops.
Considering who knows what, whose interests are damaged by spitting and the unscrupulous methods of past police and FBI in crushing dissent in America;
Considering that right wing activists have already admitted to infiltrating the Occupy! movements as provocateurs to make them look bad, and that the FBI has done the same thing on a massive scale to the antiwar movement in the past;
Considering all the above, if troops DO get spat on, I'd say the likelihood of it being a real protestor might be around 2% and the likelihood of this being a conservative activist or an FBI provocateur is around 98%.
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super easy to happen
spitting is by law assault,but ALOT of people on both sides think it`s a right . I`ve seen it several times. crazy
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Let's say that it's possible that the odd person in the Occupy! movement doesn't know that it's bad to spit on troops.
Let's say that it's possible that the odd government or FBI officer charged with crushing dissent like this doesn't know how much the antiwar movement was damaged by allegations of spitting on troops.
Let's say that it's possible that the odd conservative activist or MSM hack doesn't know how much the antiwar movement was damaged by allegations of spitting on troops.
Considering who knows what, whose interests are damaged by spitting and the unscrupulous methods of past police and FBI in crushing dissent in America;
Considering that right wing activists have already admitted to infiltrating the Occupy! movements as provocateurs to make them look bad, and that the FBI has done the same thing on a massive scale to the antiwar movement in the past;
Considering all the above, if troops DO get spat on, I'd say the likelihood of it being a real protestor might be around 2% and the likelihood of this being a conservative activist or an FBI provocateur is around 98%.
Your entire supposition is based on the premise that the Occupy X movement is meaningful, real and on message. To most passerby, it is an inconvenience and a curiosity. And because it has no traction, the need to demonize it is non existent. So there are likely no agent provocateurs from the government, spitting on Coast Guard personnel, to give the movement a bad name. The FBI is busy busting the Anonymous hacker groups who have threatened to bring down the NYSE as a show of Solidarity with the Owwies.
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<<Your entire supposition is based on the premise that the Occupy X movement is meaningful, real and on message.>>
It's based on the premise that your rulers have been paranoid about any social protest movement since at least the 1960s and remember very well how the anti-war movement grew from a few "flakes" on a few university campuses into a mass movement.
<<To most passerby, it is an inconvenience and a curiosity. >>
And yet I've read at least one press report that tourists passing by on bus-roof tours cheered and gave thumbs-ups to the demonstrators. Besides which, the infiltration is highly unlikely to come from "most passersby."
<<And because it has no traction . . . >>
You're kidding, right? It has no traction, but it spread all over the country, 300,000 people wrote to the mayor of New York protesting the planned eviction of the protestors, which was then called off . . . jeeze, glad they have no traction, think of how far they could go with a little traction.
<< . . . the need to demonize it is non existent.>>
OK, BT, now pull the other one.
<< So there are likely no agent provocateurs from the government, spitting on Coast Guard personnel, to give the movement a bad name. >>
If it's just one isolated incident, I'd tend to agree with you. The agents are there, waiting to be called into action if attrition and internal dissension don't start to break down the movement or if it continues to grow. But at this point, the odds are that the one spitting incident was either an undisciplined OWS or the Boston equivalent of the homeless bums of Zucotti Park who hang around the edges of the Wall Street Occupation.
<<The FBI is busy busting the Anonymous hacker groups who have threatened to bring down the NYSE as a show of Solidarity with the Owwies. >>
LOL. Don't underestimate the FBI - - they are multi-taskers. They're still harrassing people I know for stuff they did in the Sixties and Seventies. They're everywhere.
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It's based on the premise that your rulers have been paranoid about any social protest movement since at least the 1960s and remember very well how the anti-war movement grew from a few "flakes" on a few university campuses into a mass movement.
Times have changed Mikey. Obama and the dem leadership support this movement. I wouldn't be real surprised if they weren't behind it.
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Spitting does not endanger democracy.
One incident of an unidentified spitter is of no more consequence that someone being shat upon by a pigeon in the park, and less annoying, if you look at it objectively.
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Spitting does not endanger democracy.
this is no good
note even the protesters wanted no part of this. actual;ly this is a sign of growth in the modern protest. if they keep this kind of civility up they got a real chance.
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I do not endorse spitting. I have never spit on anyone. I do not spit where anyone can see me spit, other than a dentist.
But this is not a major issue. It is trivial.
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I got serious doubts this subject would ever get ignored. in fact shouldn`t this be worst than a politician mis-speaking because it`s physical.
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<<Times have changed Mikey. Obama and the dem leadership support this movement. I wouldn't be real surprised if they weren't behind it.>>
You don't get it, BT. Obama shills for the same war-mongering, thieving, lying scumbags that the GOP shills for. They both get their water from the same well. THAT is one of the protestors' main beefs and the reason they resorted to direct action - - the political "two-party" system is a shell game - - vote for the other, you get the same wars, same tortures, same bail-outs, same shielding of all corporate white-collar criminals etc. etc. etc. That's why they went OUTSIDE the system in the first place.
If you saw the video of the Tea Party going to visit the Occupation, one of the funniest moments was the dialogue between the Tea Paty Types and one of the Occupiers, where the TPT thought he'd boxed in the Occupier, leveraging the Occupier's supposed loyalty to Obama, and appeared at a loss for words when the Occupier showed no such loyalty at all. Actually, it was hilarious.
TPT: "Don't you support our troops?"
Occupier: "Our troops are terrorists!!!"
TPT: (with this "Gotcha!" look on his smug, overfed face) "Why terrorists? Aren't they just following the orders
of their Commander in Chief?"
Occupier: "FUCK the Commander in Chief!!!"
You still say these guys are Obama's guys? I don't think so. They might have been once, like everyone in the country, they wanted hope and change, but Obama never delivered. They should know better than anyone that Obama cannot or will not solve the problem. He's part of the problem, not part of the solution. If any of them are still being taken in by his phony expressions of empathy, they're just plain stupid and deserve to be fucked in the ass second time round. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice . . . "
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I do not endorse spitting. I have never spit on anyone. I do not spit where anyone can see me spit, other than a dentist.
But this is not a major issue. It is trivial.
maybe real Americans should go to where the idiot protesters hang out and spit upon them.
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I invite you to find such a place and join as a spitter or spitee.
Either way, it is something you deserve to participate in.
Me, I am uninterested in such trivial nonsense
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I invite you to find such a place and join as a spitter or spitee.
Either way, it is something you deserve to participate in.
Me, I am uninterested in such trivial nonsense
then why did you comment?
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Obama wants to tax the rich, the Owwies want to blame the rich.
Obama wants to increase taxes on the top 1%, the Owwies claim they are of the other 99%.
Obama receives funding from George Soros, Adbusters receives funding from George Soros.
Obama gave energy grants to the owners of Zuccotti Park, the Owwies are camping in Zuccotti Park.
Obama was supported by public sector unions, The Owwies are supported by public sector unions.
Yeah there is no connection between Obama and the Owwies.
Obama engages in class warfare, the Owwies engage in class warfare.
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Obama wants to tax the rich, the Owwies want to blame the rich.
Obama wants to increase taxes on the top 1%, the Owwies claim they are of the other 99%.
Obama receives funding from George Soros, Adbusters receives funding from George Soros.
Obama gave energy grants to the owners of Zuccotti Park, the Owwies are camping in Zuccotti Park.
Obama was supported by public sector unions, The Owwies are supported by public sector unions.
Yeah there is no connection between Obama and the Owwies.
Obama engages in class warfare, the Owwies engage in class warfare.
Obama is a bad apple
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<<Maybe real Americans should go to where the idiot protesters hang out and spit upon them.>>
Yeah "real Americans" like hedge fund managers and Fortune 500 CEOs. You're forgetting that the real Americans are the guys in the street, the 1% can hire others, like undercover cops and FBI, to do their spitting for them. They're too busy stealing money from the public purse to have time for such childish pursuits.
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Isn't it kind of disgusting that the Owwies don't take showers?
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<<Maybe real Americans should go to where the idiot protesters hang out and spit upon them.>>
Yeah "real Americans" like hedge fund managers and Fortune 500 CEOs. You're forgetting that the real Americans are the guys in the street, the 1% can hire others, like undercover cops and FBI, to do their spitting for them. They're too busy stealing money from the public purse to have time for such childish pursuits.
they wish you would join them
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<<Isn't it kind of disgusting that the Owwies don't take showers?>>
Maybe, but not as disgusting as the fact that hedge fund managers fuck their own mothers.
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<<Isn't it kind of disgusting that the Owwies don't take showers?>>
Maybe, but not as disgusting as the fact that hedge fund managers fuck their own mothers.
I think it would be safer to be spat upon by a CEO than a diseased protester. I bet half those protesters have herpes. Except for George Soros. I bet he has a sort of disease.
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<<I bet half those protesters have herpes.>>
So what? The hedge fund managers' mothers have herpes AND syph, and all of the hedge fund managers have both.
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<<I bet half those protesters have herpes.>>
So what? The hedge fund managers' mothers have herpes AND syph, and all of the hedge fund managers have both.
So that's what you think about Soros!
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Soros wouldn't fuck his own mother. He's an exception to the rest of them, cuz he's got a good heart.
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I'm sure the people of Ukraine agree with you.
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You lost me there, I'm afraid, BT.
What do the people of the Ukraine have to do with any of this?
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Google is your friend.
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Think I'll say hello to my little friend.
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Google is your friend.
these people are very selective about who they find offensive. They pretty much like murderers, thieves and rapists as long as they properly align with their politics. I think Mike likes Stalin about as much as he likes Soros, maybe even more.
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I'm sure Stalin and Soros are just misunderstood.
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Well, Google ain't my friend no more. Won't tell me a God-damn thing. Google "Soros and Ukraine" and you get a God-awful mish-mash from which it appears that Soros put a shitload of money into the Ukraine, they hate him, they love him, he's trying to help them, he's trying to buy them, he wants them to get rich, he wants them to fail so he can buy up the pieces and on and on and on. He's a philanthropist, he's a shark, he's a Jew and a Zionist, he's secular and has no religion . . . There is some reason I need to give a shit?
Fuck it I ain't writin no masters thesis on the subject, I've put in all the time with my "friend" that I'm prepared to put in. Thanks for nothin.
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I'll make it easier for you . Google Soros and the UK.
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How about you just say what you mean or we can both abandon the subject?
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For such a philanthropic humanitarian he sure has hurt a lot of little people with his currency speculation.
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For such a philanthropic humanitarian he sure has hurt a lot of little people with his currency speculation.
I wonder if he loves the protesters or looks at them as useful tools? What's in it for him?
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<<For such a philanthropic humanitarian he sure has hurt a lot of little people with his currency speculation.>>
Since when did you develop such an interest in fiscal mythology? Your concern for the "little people" allegedly hurt by the currency speculation of Mr. Soros is very touching. Too bad you can't extend it to the "little people" hurt by American bombs in Bush's wars of unprovoked aggression.
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For such a philanthropic humanitarian he sure has hurt a lot of little people with his currency speculation.
I wonder if he loves the protesters or looks at them as useful tools? What's in it for him?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5fTOMAio2c# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5fTOMAio2c#)
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Your concern for the "little people" allegedly hurt by the currency speculation of Mr. Soros is very touching.
Thank you.
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That (Pink Floyd in London) was so bad I couldn't stand to watch it all. Jesus Christ, people paid money to watch THAT? I'd rather have invested the ticket price in sub-prime mortgage bonds.
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Maybe, but not as disgusting as the fact that hedge fund managers fuck their own mothers.
Most hedge fund managers like John Paulson and Goldman Sachs are liberal New Yorkers. They donated heavily to Obama. Fuck them, indeed.
The Owwies should shower up and move to Pennsylvania Ave. and protest at the White House and these policies which truly are wrecking this economy. They are misplaced in their goals.
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No.
Most hedge fund managers you have never heard of, and I doubt if many of them want to do away with their 15% capital gains income tax advantage.
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<<The Owwies should shower up and move to Pennsylvania Ave. and protest at the White House and these policies which truly are wrecking this economy. They are misplaced in their goals.>>
Yet another misguided conservative who thinks that the Occupy! folk should deal with the monkey and not with the organ grinder. NO! It is Wall Street and their lobbyists who tell Obama and the legislators which laws and regulations to pass and which to kill. They dictate equally to Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Boehner, McConnell and anyone else who needs the schooling. It's fine with them if Obama favours legislation that the Congress later kills - - they care more about results than process, and within those parameters don't give a shit what little charades Obama and the Republocrats perform for the benefit of the rubes otherwise known as the American electorate.
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The OWS are on the right track: they do not expect the government will change their lot. They want jobs and realize that Washington (ie the combination of the Executive and the Legislative) are incapable of giving them a job. It is the Wall Street types that do the hiring, and who set the conditions for student loans as well.
Again, they are correctly directing the protest at the Organ Grinder and not the monkey.
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You are both wrong. I guess I don't mind the Owwies protesting the big banks. I didn't support the bailouts either. They just seem like dirty and disgusting people. Why are they out on the street all week and not showering? Many are getting paid to be there. A normal person goes to a protest and they either go to a motel or home at night when they are finished and take a shower. They should also protest at the White House because it is Obama's policies that are the reason we are in this mess. Protest both, not just part of the problem. They should also be defecating in the bathroom, not on the streets.
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Jobs in the US are created by small businesses more than any other agency.
Taxes that get paid from the small-medium business and business owner directly depress hireing.
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I hardly see any blacks if at all in the mobs that make up the Owwies. Are they racist?
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<<They just seem like dirty and disgusting people. Why are they out on the street all week and not showering?>>
ROTFLMFAO.
I guess you could say the same thing about our soldiers in WWII - - why are they out in the field under fire all week without showering? BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT A JOB TO DO AND IT DOESN'T COME WITH SHOWERS. BECAUSE WHAT THEY'RE DOING IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN SHOWERS.
If it will make you feel any better about Bernie Madoff, I'll bet the guy showered and put on a clean shirt every day of his fucking life, till he ended up in prison. Every fucking crook on Wall Street showers and puts on a clean shirt every day. They must be wonderful people.
<<Many are getting paid to be there.>>
Oh, really? Who says so?
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<<Many are getting paid to be there.>>
Oh, really? Who says so?
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Indeed, who says so?
It looks to me like the majority of the Owwies are recent college graduates from the area around NYC,and as such, most are White folks.
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You guys look silly parroting each other. It is obvious that Mickey Tee is the intelligent one and XO is the grunt.
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Help wanted
Reader Greg Farrell writes to point out what he found on Craigslist. It?s an ad from the Working Families Party looking to hire protesters for Wall Street and offering $350-650 a week, depending on responsibility and length of time on staff: FIGHT TO HOLD WALL STREET ACCOUNTABLE NOW! MAKE A DIFFERENCE! GET PAID! Note: ?Recruiters, please don?t contact this job poster.?
Here?s the Craigslist posting, in case it gets cut:
http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/10/help-wanted.php (http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/10/help-wanted.php)
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Anyone can post anything they wish on Craigslist. The presence of an ad does not mean that the ad is legit.
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Those smelly people responded to that ad.
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I just looked at the ad, and it's clearly an ad for organizers, public speakers, fund-raisers and out-reach people, nobody is being offered anything for just showing up and the demo and carrying a sign.
Apparently the Working Families Party was organized by labour unions and community activists. They're coming late to the party, but if they have something to offer, why not?
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I just looked at the ad, and it's clearly an ad for organizers, public speakers, fund-raisers and out-reach people, nobody is being offered anything for just showing up and the demo and carrying a sign.
They are not paying people in leadership roles that you describe only $350 a week. That is $8.75 an hour. That is what the protestors are being paid.
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<<They are not paying people in leadership roles that you describe only $350 a week. That is $8.75 an hour. That is what the protestors are being paid. >>
Your math assumes a 40-hr. week but the occupation is for 24/7. Besides which, READ THE AD. They clearly state what they want and it's for exactly what I already described, NOT for occupying a public space. They can't pay Wall Street wages and they can't even pay regular corporate wages. People who respond to this ad will respond for love, not for money.
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How were Tea party protesters paid?
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<<How were Tea party protesters paid?>>
Not my department. Ask the Koch brothers.