DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: sirs on April 08, 2013, 06:15:33 PM
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MSNBC Host Melissa Harris-Perry » All Your Kids Belong To Us (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3qtpdSQox0#ws)
This is what passes as "intellectual thought", and what is truely scary of leftists who see themselves as so much the superior to the rest of us
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Fuckin' A right on!
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LOL...I rest my case 8)
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Man!
She is frightening!
How can we get everyone to see this horror show?
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Well, I posted it on facebook, for starters.
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What really gets me is that she is acting as a spokesman ,can there realy be orginazation with agreement with these points that don't realise what the public reaction will be to this?
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Yeah, you have EVERY RIGHT to raise your kids in the Aryan Brotherhood. You have EVERY RIGHT to have your daughter circumcised. You have EVERY RIGHT to teach them that the way to Heaven is a suicide vest.
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If the collective is responsible for the kids then they owe me a couple hundred grand for room and board.
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lol
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Part of this is about trying to deal with the shitty parents many African American adults have become.....in some ways so many black fathers are absent, thus their offspring basically do get shoved off on us...on all of us to raise....to feed, clothe, and try to educate....because the father is a reckless piece of shit...that has been cultured by the liberal victimhood myth that someone owes them everything. Between 65-72% of all black children in America grow up in fatherless homes.
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"Liberal victimhood" has nothing to do with this.
The fact is that nearly half of all children in this country are born to single mothers. This includes a lot of White people as well.
People who want to abolish abortions have something to do with this, but the fact is that human beings are not by nature monogamous.
This is complex and requires a study of anthropology rather than your erroneous oversimplifications.
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What this has to do with, which you were all gung ho about, is the mindset that the Children of this country belong to the government, and that it is their "obligation" to "educate" them appropriately.
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uhm
you do all know this is actually how things run in the recent past. the neighborhood was the ones who made sure you kid didn`t wander too far out.
it`s the family who said you mind your own business which gives the kids more freedom. I often hear from people older than me saying kids in the past didn`t have a chance to get into too much trouble because the neighbors would snitch on them. so this aint a liberal thing at all . it truly is old fashion traditions(annoying as hell though) remember the slums mind their own business.
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with the exception of maybe eskimo, I think I`ve seen most races with a single mom situation. but thiers a bright spot. people will not like this info. those teen mom shows are actually lowing cases of teen pregnancies all over the places . people thought those show encourage underage pregnancies but it actually has an opposite effect. crazy
http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/local_news/news_blogs/teen-pregnancy-shows:-promoting-or-discouraging-pregnancy (http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/local_news/news_blogs/teen-pregnancy-shows:-promoting-or-discouraging-pregnancy)
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Being a good neighbor and voluntarily supervising other's children, is a far cry from what this professor is advocating, Kimba
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I rewatched the vid and she didn`t really state specifics so it still seem align with what I stated. what did you think she meant. If anything she was talking about the direction of how education should be applied communal instead singularly a family situation.
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I think she meant that the Government can do a better job at "educating" the children, and beyond that, that the Government has an obligation, as in that the children really do belong to the Government. Nothing voluntary in her tone or intentions, from what I gathered
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Government-run schools and government certified schools surely do a better job of educating children than would be the case is every child were home schooled. There are no countries on the planet that do not have some form of public education in their constitutions.
Even non-countries, like Transdnestria and the Polisario refugee camps have some sort of public education.
I think that universal home schooling is pretty rare in the world, perhaps limited only to remote African villages and the steppes of Mongolia. Peasants had home schooling all during the Middle Ages, also known as the "Dark Ages" because of the degree of ignorance that prevailed.
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Government-run schools and government certified schools surely do a better job of educating children than would be the case is every child were home schooled.
Source?
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What do you mean "source?"
Compare the way that serfs educated their children in the Middle Ages with any country on the planet.
There are NO COUNTRIES where all children are home schooled as a matter of policy. The reason for this is because it would not work.
People can home school their kids here, and some do a good job of it, but many do not. There is always some form of government supervision of any home school plan, and this is as it should be.
All this woman is saying is that it is better to educate children in schools than to leave it entirely up to their parents. There are no countries that do not have this as a guiding principle.
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well
to me that's not exactly a easy subject.
I don`t believe in cookie cutter education. in fact I see education like I see crime. It`s a situation if left uncheck will grow and easily counter any solution you throw at it. one answer don`t cut it.
also limit parental involvement. if you look at why the bar is lowered it tend to be caused by a parent whose upset a student didn`t make it to the next grade.
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What i mean by "source" is that you made a blanket statement that public schools turn out on average a better educated student than those who are home schooled. I simply haven't seen any unbiased literature that would prove your statement.
So source
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I think its just supposed to be "obvious"
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Even those who are home schooled are required to follow state guidelines.
The woman quoted stated that students should not be considered to be exclusively the property of their parents. There is NO STATE in this country that subscribes to this premise. Not one. Nor should there be.'
Parents are required to educate their students responsibly according to state guidelines. That is as it should be.
The success of home schooling varies greatly from one student to another. It depends on who is doing the home schooling.
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The success of home schooling varies greatly from one student to another. It depends on who is doing the home schooling.
The same could be said for public school educated pupils.
Even those who are home schooled are required to follow state guidelines.
Yes and i doubt the home school teachers bellyache about meeting standards as much as those employed by government schools.
And still no data to prove that public school children on average achieve better than home schooled children on those dreaded standardized tests.
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"The whole promo would be laughably pretentious if it weren't so redolent of creepy collectivism. Kids "belong" to whole communities? What does that even mean? Because I don't notice "the community" taking a huge interest in waking up at night when one of my children has a nightmare, or paying for a birthday party, or teaching table manners (much less the difference between right and wrong).
There's only one particular in which Ms. Harris-Perry may be right: If liberals started feeling a greater sense of social responsibility for children, maybe they wouldn't insist on keeping them trapped in failing schools . . . or pushing easy sex and even easier abortion . . . or diminishing the importance of fathers in the home. That's the kind of "investment" that might actually make a difference."
Carol Platt Liebau
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And still no data to prove that public school children on average achieve better than home schooled children on those dreaded standardized tests.
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In Florida, home schooled students do not have to take standardized tests.
I doubt that they are required to take them in most other states, either.
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this aint a liberal thing at all .
Ok we will agree to disagree
liberals have grown gvt so big
and debased our currency so much
that our dollars are worthless
thus it now takes two incomes
to survive....so children are
left for others to raise
school to raise our kids
parents drop off newborns at the daycare
leaving it to other to raise our kids
"others" usually dont care as much
this has all taken it's toll
strangers raising our children has it's consequences
look at the results in today's world
liberals in both parties have caused this nightmare.
also providing so much gvt help encourages
people to be reckless....
have a bunch of kids not being married
and "what the heck...i'll just get welfare/foodstamps/ect.."
liberals have created whole generations dependent on gvt
their goal as welfare pimps is to create dependency
and assure re-election by becoming "Santa Claus"
uncontrolled illegal immigration
has overwhelmed our schools, hospitals, infastructure
all costing real, legal US Citizens their RIGHT to better services and education.
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I think it would be hard to prove that governments in general are better judges of what is and isn't good parenting or education than the common family is.
While the structure of our familys is falling apart , can the government really pick up the slack?
Right now the USA is locking up a huge number of us , making even adults wards of the state in huge numbers.
Once the government is your parent , when does it stop being so?
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Please. The Federal government does not run your local school. If you think it does, you are a dolt, because it clearly does not.
If you do not fancy how it is run, elect another school board. Elect people you agree with to the state legislature.
At the very most, the Feds have only focused on literacy and math skills.
It is in the interests of the society that children know basic facts and basic skills, and in many cases, parents are not capable for various reasons of providing these to their children
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The schools have always taught the three R's.
The federal interest is in preventing prayer and fostering good citizenship as the fed defines it.
As they say in song, another brick in the wall.
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Any kid can pray in school all they wish. They just cannot be called upon to do it publicly. Kids can say grace over lunch, they can pray all they want. The violation is when teacher leads the class in prayers to Jesus. Or Muhammad, or perhaps to the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
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These are the requirements in regards to evaluation of progress during a given school year in Florida.
Standardized Tests: Only required for parents homeschooling under the homeschool law in Option 1 above. The parent must file a copy of the evaluation with the local school superintendent annually. There is no specific statutory deadline. Fla. Stat. § 1002.41(1)(c). Each student must do one of the following each year:
1) Have educational progress evaluated by a teacher holding a valid regular Florida teaching certificate and selected by the parent. The evaluation must include review of a portfolio and discussion with the student;
2) Take any nationally normed student achievement test administered by a certified teacher;
3) Take “a state student assessment test used by the school district and administered by a certified teacher, at a location and under testing conditions approved by the school district”;
4) Be evaluated by a Florida licensed psychologist or school psychologist; or
5) Be “evaluated with any other valid measurement tool as mutually agreed upon.”
“The district school superintendent shall review and accept the results of the annual educational evaluation….
http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/florida.pdf (http://www.hslda.org/laws/analysis/florida.pdf)
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Home school is tricky since it depeds on the parent to be a great inhouse tutor. At this moment we mostly hear positive results. But how much is that can be true since parents as a whole has a lesser rep than homeschool
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Only required under Option 1.
A test by any certified teacher, rather than a teacher with experience in home schooled students, on any normed standardized test makes this essentially meaningless.
I do not question that home schooled students COULD learn as much, perhaps more, than students enrolled in a school. But there are no really valid evaluation procedures that guarantee this.
"Evaluated with any other valid measurement as mutually agreed upon", could be anything. The law as it stands, is essentially meaningless.
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Actually i've seen one example it can be bad. A friend of mine did home school her kids and one turned out brilliant but the other is special needs and really needed a school enviroment to sync up socially. If you were to talk to him you would notice he talks at a much younger level despite being very intelligent.his social skills simply is not up thier. Eventually the mom did tried to put him to school but the assesment test shows he's two years behind and has doubts he coulds catch up despite of his high intlligence. The low test score is caused by the fact the home schooling did not teach him focus since his mom did not bother teaching that and just stuff she thinks is important.
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MSNBC's Harris-Perry Doubles Down on Communist Ads: Fox News Women Respond (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSRlRR_sA98#ws)
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She said NOTHING LIKE what these two airheaded women said she did.
She did say, accurately that children are not the property of their parents. And they are not. That is why it is illegal to sell them.
Children should not be destitute, uneducated and hungry even if their parents abandon them, either. That is why we have institutions to deal with orphans and neglected children.
Human beings are social beings that live in communities, we are not like coyotes, wandering alone all over the place and only socializing for sex and reproduction.
I have never heard Monica Crowley say anything that made minimal sense.
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Children are citizens and wards of their guardians .
Not the playthings of the state.
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I don't know how many years ii have heard nothing but the lack of parental involvement is why schools fail, yet homeschooling is the complete opposite of lack of parental involvement and here we have folks saying the home schooled are doomed to failure.
Tell that to a former member of PIC (CUSprings) who was attending the University of Colorado after being home schooled, ended up President of her class, went on to the University Of Chicago Law School and is now an intellectual property lawyer in LA.
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Some folks just can't handle competition, so they have to try and skew the field in a particular direction, most often via pushing legislators to pass more and more regulations. If folks like Xo and this Mrs Harris-Perry had their way, they'd do away with homeschooling and private schooling all together. You see, its just not fair to the others who don't have the means to home school or attend private school (unless of course you're a rich elite liberal, and then its perfectly acceptable & perfectly fair. No hypocrisy here, move along)
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I did not say that homeschooling is doomed to failure. I did not say that at all. What I said was that it has the capability to range from terrific to abysmal, and the measures taken to guarantee that it is adequate are simply lacking and need to be strengthened to make it viable.
Children are not the property of the state, nor are they the property of their parents. Both parents and the state have a valid interest and obligation to see to it that children are educated for both their own benefit and that of society.
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Children are not the property of the state, nor are they the property of their parents.
No but the parents are the primary responsible party, not the other way around. The state is backup.
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I agree that the parents are primarily responsible for their children, unless they have had the children taken away from them for some serious reason, like child molestation or abuse.
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I agree that the parents are primarily responsible for their children, unless they have had the children taken away from them for some serious reason, like child molestation or abuse.
And who takes the children away from the state?
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Not to mention that this isn't at all what Harris was addressing or emphasizing, since no one is arguing that if a child is being abused, state/CPS intervention is likely necessary.