DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: Christians4LessGvt on July 25, 2016, 07:27:01 PM
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANwNjC9tynU
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Wow. there is irony here... somewhere....
Is it the antidemocratic tactics of the Democratic party?
Is it the trashing of the nominee at her coronation?
Is there some Irony in the scandal being from e-Mails intercepted by Russians?
Yes there is both Irony and Incongruity aplenty.
Can the Democrats make a bigger mess of their convention than the Republicans , they are off to a good start.
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Earlier today, I was listening to a BLM activist who's starting a movement for Blacks to not vote for anyone until......and I quote...."Blacks lives matter". Doesn't believe anything Clinton says. Believes that the Democrats are just spouting rhetoric, with no intention of doing anything. And until some apparent "Justice reform" is initiated, wants Blacks to boycott this upcoming election. Yes, even at the probability of electing Trump. He claims that there are repercussions for not taking their demands seriously, and given the current Democrat Presidential nominee, can't be believed, in any way shape or form, has called on blacks to not vote this coming election
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Made me think about a movie called a day without the mexicans. It bacisly note how much this race is needed in America. Ironically this cannot be said for any other minority in the U.S.
So when blacks boycott thier vote they may not missed as they think.
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Refusing to vote has never made sense in this country. We have never has so much corruption that anyone got an official 99% of the vote.
Refusing to vote in Brazil under the generals or in North Korea today would make sense. But only if the ballots were anonymous.
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The issue of voter ID is to prevent certain people to vote but those very same people are boycotting voting
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I do not think they are the same bunch of people. Certainly not the exact same people.
We would need a Venn diagram to explain this effectively
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The same supposed demographic category of people.
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The same supposed demographic category of people.
Imaginary people?
The reason for voters to produce ID is to prevent vote cheating, I can't understand the idea that being black makes a person ID free.
There are poor and stupid people of every color, also unlucky people who have lost their ID in a fire or something , just as likely one color as another.
Why ever complain about IDs being a race preference ? There is no office for seeking White people without proper ID to give them one.
Anyone who was really worried about the enfranchisement of actual people might do well to seek them and facilitate their gaining IDs, this would make sense to me .
But preserving the right to cheat makes no sense to me at all.
After all how are the Democrats so totally certain that Republicans are not cheating in just this way?
I am tempted to do it , but I unfortunately live in a state that checks ID. I would have to travel to vote a lot.
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The claim is id checking is racist since most people without id tend to be minorities. I stated on another post i remember in my youth how hard it is to come up with the money and said it should be free since it is required in so many things . I'll only deal with cost of it . I have no knowledge for other reasons not to have id. I'll not defend that.
I think i show my id too much .most people i deal with hate i show it since they know me for years
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and on that note...did anyone catch the sign that was at the front door of the DNC convention?
(http://thefederalistpapers.integratedmarket.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/voteriddncfb.jpg)
egads...how racist
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hence the term becoming the enemy
it`s in the book animal farm
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The claim is id checking is racist since most people without id tend to be minorities. I stated on another post i remember in my youth how hard it is to come up with the money and said it should be free since it is required in so many things . I'll only deal with cost of it . I have no knowledge for other reasons not to have id. I'll not defend that.
I think i show my id too much .most people i deal with hate i show it since they know me for years
"Minorities " are not offended by this patronizing attitude?
White plus male plus protestant Christian , is a minority. Who is concerned that we be led to the offices that Issue ID?
Who is concerned that we don't vote too often?
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White male protestant thought as minority is a new thing and will be awhile to be adddressed. But is a growing concern since culturally at this moment becoming something I don't know how to say.
Example movies ,comics, certain character are being replaced. Ghostbuster, thor, ironman are replaced.A kind of push to not allow white males to be shown.
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(https://s20.postimg.org/7llj1bhkd/voteriddncfb.jpg)
SIRS....is that not a racist sign?
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If we're to believe the left, it must be. I mean, how can any blacks possibly get in now??
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SIRS....is that not a racist sign?
It is not racist. The Convention is not open to the public, neither was the Republican Convention.\
Voting is a right of every citizen, guaranteed by the Constitution.
Attending a political convention is not a right guaranteed by the Constitution.
The entire country is free to watch it on TV. Noone could do this before 1952, as it was not televised.
sirs, you are a smartass. It is annoying.
My father was an usher at the Republican Convention that nominated Herbert Hoover in Kansas City in 1928. To enter the hall, everyone had to show a credential to get a ticket.
I still have several tickets, by the way.
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America you could be next...
(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-0/p235x350/13872940_1406758722673311_5616802928610276034_n.jpg?oh=98df28ffce4f176fa39f15d88fe52774&oe=5826E743)
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Still surfing the web for stupid shit, I see,
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Still ignoring the rank hypocrisy, I see
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STFU sirs.
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Sorry, i realize how much lefists despise everyone else's constitutional rights, you don't have that power to deny my free speech
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(http://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/4017/327/original.jpg)
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SIRS....is that not a racist sign?
It is not racist. The Convention is not open to the public, neither was the Republican Convention.\
Voting is a right of every citizen, guaranteed by the Constitution.
Attending a political convention is not a right guaranteed by the Constitution.
Ok...using your standard then, since the right to a firearm is a Constitutional right, no one need bother with photo ID to obtain one of those either.....right??
Starting to grasp how flawed your concept is??
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SIRS....is that not a racist sign?
It is not racist. The Convention is not open to the public, neither was the Republican Convention.\
Voting is a right of every citizen, guaranteed by the Constitution.
Attending a political convention is not a right guaranteed by the Constitution.
Ok...using your standard then, since the right to a firearm is a Constitutional right, no one need bother with photo ID to obtain one of those either.....right??
Starting to grasp how flawed your concept is??
That is a good point.
The requirement for background checks must be just as skewed against minorities as Voter ID requirement .
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Absolutely. It's completely racist how they disenfranchise minorities when it comes to the 2nd Amendment
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There is a national database of registered voters.
There is no national database of registered gun owners.
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And......? The issue is photo ID
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There is a national database of registered voters.
......
Yes?
I didn't know that.
What makes getting an ID so hard then?
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What makes getting an ID so hard then?
Taking time off to stand in line waiting for an ID.
Getting to the location where the IDs are applied for using public transportation.
Not getting paid for the day one visits the office.
My pocket was picked and I needed to get a new license.
It took me SIX HOURS to do this, including the hour between 7:00 and 8:00 AM before the office opened, Five of those hours I spent waiting outside the office in the hot sun.
The nearest bus stop was ten blocks away from the DMV office. I took the chance and drove to the office.
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So you're implying that minorities never have any time that they're not working and are too dumb to find a location??
Seriously??
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It took six hours and a lot of work and frustration , but you did it.
Because you are white.
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I was able to do it because I am RETIRED. I have no job. I do a Silver Sneakers class three times per week, but attendance is not obligatory.
College professors have flexible schedules.
Many poor people have schedules that make it very difficult to visit the DMV where all licenses and IDs are issued. The DMV's used to be open on Saturdays, but Rick Scott closed them to save money, he said.
He cut off early voting in 2008 as well. More economy. I had to wait six hours to vote for Obama.
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It took six hours and a lot of work and frustration , but you did it.
Because you are white.
That sure seems to be what xo is implying. He's just smarter than blacks...and they apparently are always working, so they can never take any time to do....anything, other than work
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I was able to do it because I am RETIRED.
Did you get your first ID when you retired?
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i got all my government issue stuff when i`m not working so yes it`s very possible minorities have it tough to getting ID`s
passport took me three months to get and only because the clerk took pity in me. i really didn`t think I would get it. my citizen papers did match my ID. foretunately I`m not a rare case and the clerk is familiar. lets just saY obama had it way easier than me.
did you know certain types of birth certificates actually expire . the guy im front of me had that happened. the clerk told me that happens every few months.
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I did not say that they prevented all Blacks from voting. The goal is simply to prevent as many as possible.
In Florida the standard ID is a drivers license,
If you are poor, and drive to work, the insurance is expensive, and poor people let it lapse.
They are more likely to get stopped, for sure. Every time I see someone stopped, it is a Black person.
I have not been stopped for ten years now. I admit that I am a very careful driver and always signal and exhibit courtesy, while most drivers here are rude, fail to signal and will hook at you to go even if the light has not turned green.
If you are stopped, and do not have your insurance. the cops call a tow truck that will put your car in an impound lot and it will cost at least $200 to get it out. The cop will also take your license away from you. If you do not bail your car out, they sell it without a title to a junkyard. And if you owe money on it, you will still be liable to pay off the loan.
Poor people are ruined when this happens.
They are so pissed off they just forget about getting an ID card. They don't want to give the State of Florida another nickel.
In some of my classes, half the students had lost their licenses. Sure, they should have wised up and paid for the insurance. I found this out when students stopped coming to class.
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Moral of the story, obey the laws of this country, and there will be no negative impact as a result
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i would never say no negative impact but certainly less.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/21/florida-police-shoot-black-man-lying-down-with-arms-in-air
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IIRC Kimba, this man was shot not for raising his hands or even not obeying some command. He was accidentally shot from a stray bullet. That doesn't excuse the fact he was shot, but let's make sure not to infer something that didn't happen, such as rasing his hands, only to be aimed at and shot by police
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all three shots from a rifle aimed at the disabled man with a toy truck and missed is a stray shots
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In one word, yes.
Do you know how many times police shoot at suspects and miss?? It's more than 50%. I recall a shootout in NY not too long ago, where hundreds of rounds were fired by police, and only hit the suspect a scant few. Contrary to popular belief, despite the training, police can get caught up with adrenaline, just as much as the next person, and what should be automatic, becomes.....less so....as it relates to aiming and targeting. That's a sad commentary, on the training of law enforcement, but a true one
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i got all my government issue stuff when i`m not working so yes it`s very possible minorities have it tough to getting ID`s
passport took me three months to get and only because the clerk took pity in me. i really didn`t think I would get it. my citizen papers did match my ID. foretunately I`m not a rare case and the clerk is familiar. lets just saY obama had it way easier than me.
did you know certain types of birth certificates actually expire . the guy im front of me had that happened. the clerk told me that happens every few months.
All other things being equal, would you have had an easy time getting ID and benefits if you were white?
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I did not say that they prevented all Blacks from voting. The goal is simply to prevent as many as possible.
In Florida the standard ID is a drivers license,
If you are poor, and drive to work, the insurance is expensive, and poor people let it lapse.
They are more likely to get stopped, for sure. Every time I see someone stopped, it is a Black person.
I have not been stopped for ten years now. I admit that I am a very careful driver and always signal and exhibit courtesy, while most drivers here are rude, fail to signal and will hook at you to go even if the light has not turned green.
If you are stopped, and do not have your insurance. the cops call a tow truck that will put your car in an impound lot and it will cost at least $200 to get it out. The cop will also take your license away from you. If you do not bail your car out, they sell it without a title to a junkyard. And if you owe money on it, you will still be liable to pay off the loan.
Poor people are ruined when this happens.
They are so pissed off they just forget about getting an ID card. They don't want to give the State of Florida another nickel.
In some of my classes, half the students had lost their licenses. Sure, they should have wised up and paid for the insurance. I found this out when students stopped coming to class.
I am not going to argue with any of that , except that being black causes it.
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All other things being equal, would you have had an easy time getting ID and benefits if you were white?
The answer would be yes due to this not exactly a racial issue but a economic one. Race plays a factor but it's pretty much about the person who can't come up with $35 --$65 . To me its so low can't remember what i paid for mine. But that does not mean it's affordable to somebody else. I was poor once and thought fastfood and frozen dinners was a luxury.
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Does having White privilege mean that white people aren't ever broke?
I will certainly grant you that life in general is less convenient to the poor.
But not that this effect is restricted to Minority persons.
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Sure wasn't restricted to my single mother and us 3 pale white children
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I think you proved my point if the concept of not able to pay for a id escapes you. I said personally in my youth it was difficult. If it wasn't for you than I'm living proof it was. $5 was a lot of money to me once
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I think you proved my point if the concept of not able to pay for a id escapes you. I said personally in my youth it was difficult. If it wasn't for you than I'm living proof it was. $5 was a lot of money to me once
I have been there.
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$5 plus the lack of a day's pay would be worse.\
Worse than that old poll tax from the Jim Crow days.
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And yet my Mom managed under both scenarios. I guess it was because she was white.....right?
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But that does not mean everybody did. I said was very difficult to me at the beginning. It totally does not mean everybody else can without help. I did say ID should be free . Out of all the things our tax dollars pay for this should be the basic.
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But that does not mean everybody did.
Precisely.....my mother CHOSE to make the extra effort. To get whatever help was needed, be it time off without pay, or .... whatever. Everyone has the right to vote. Not everyone exercises that right, for whatever reason. Sometimes that reason is increased financial hardship. And as such, I can completely sympathise with that situation, having lived it with my mother. Yet my mother still managed to, which refutes the utter nonsense that voter ID laws are somehow racist by design
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An id means access to social services so i really doubt they are choosing to not have a id.
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Point being, they do what they need to do to obtain a valid ID.....regardless of race
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But that does not mean everybody did. I said was very difficult to me at the beginning. It totally does not mean everybody else can without help. I did say ID should be free . Out of all the things our tax dollars pay for this should be the basic.
No objection.An id means access to social services so i really doubt they are choosing to not have a id.
True , getting an ID to these people should be a higher priority than merely protecting the right of voting without ID.
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Whatever you think, the fact is that this requirement was determined by Republican legislatures, based on census and other 0data, to prevent people who normally vote for Democrats from voting. Voter impersonation is very rare and hardly a problem.
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On our economic end it easy to say just get it but lately I know close people who are homeless and to me just to come up with that amount does not seem possible to me. Thiers a certain kind of change in mindset thats happens which makes thing even more difficult in thier lives. It's one of thr factors why it looks like they want to live like this.
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Good gravy....look at all these racist actions. Looking forward to the left denouncing each and every one
(https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13880391_1036744069707642_5781242104825669366_n.jpg?oh=69fd3e6e4e8ecdec02adc70eea3e2b60&oe=5818AB14)
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Thats doesn't even counter a thing . Chart also points out all the other things needed for id.
Im just saying a people with extremely very limited economic resources may not be able to afford a valid id. And that group tend to stereotypically be minorities. I also said make id's free but never once said said the requirements different so with the exception of cost.
I did state i did came up with the money fir the id but stand my proposal to make it free due to the difficulty i once had. That list is so long i think it support id needs to be free of cost.
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Yes.....NEEDED. voting is fundamental to the function of this country. And contrary to popular lefist opinion, voter fraud is occurring country wide. Report was just published here in CA, at the epidemic of dead people apparently voting. That couldn't happen with a photo ID (unless you had an identical twin who had passed away)
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Thats doesn't even counter a thing . Chart also points out all the other things needed for id.
Im just saying a people with extremely very limited economic resources may not be able to afford a valid id. And that group tend to stereotypically be minorities. I also said make id's free but never once said said the requirements different so with the exception of cost.
I did state i did came up with the money fir the id but stand my proposal to make it free due to the difficulty i once had. That list is so long i think it support id needs to be free of cost.
I totally agree.
The solution is getting IDs to those who need them.
Including those white guys who are trying to get off the grid in remote Idaho, you might have to bring an armed regiment to make them take the ID.
Why is it that"that group tend to stereotypically be minorities"?
I might like to hear that White people are never stupid , but I don't quite believe it.
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Lol
Crazy stupid irony here I am talking about people too poor to get an id and just found out a bunch of my coworker got suspended for letting their guard cards lapse for a few years. By law thier not allowed to work . it's not about money. They get paid over $26 hr. I can't and won't defend this. Some even claim economic hardship. I'm not buying it
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Which goes back to my point of making choices. This isn't one where the choice is one starves or one votes. My Mom managed. I have very little sympathy for others who claim it too hard financially, to get a bloody photo ID, when its required to do so many other things, including access to social services
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I don`t see as a counter for it still . also it still a worthy thing for our taxes to pay. it`s not a character builder.
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With all due respect, Kimba, having something subsidized by tax payers, isn't what I would consider "character building"
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But would get the ball rolling and not have it used for an excuse. The preferance of obstacles to overcome is a very flawed system. We're talking about a government issue id not free money to the poor.
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But would get the ball rolling and not have it used for an excuse. The preferance of obstacles to overcome is a very flawed system. We're talking about a government issue id not free money to the poor.
meh
Making cheating easy is a bigger flaw.
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Cheating? Im only talking about free id's nothing requirement to get a id's that never changed.
I Thought the idea that everyone doesn't have to pay for id would be popular but the notion that poor people get it free is the deal breaker. Wow
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Cheating? Im only talking about free id's nothing requirement to get a id's that never changed.
I Thought the idea that everyone doesn't have to pay for id would be popular but the notion that poor people get it free is the deal breaker. Wow
Backwards.
The free IDs are a great idea I would be firmly in favor.
The resulting loss of opportunity to cheat would make this idea unpopular with Democrats.
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They will not make ID's free. Maybe you think they will, but that won't happen. I would favor it, but they would have to be free even if stolen, and all changes of address would also have to be free and simple as well.
The rightwingers have always been against a national ID card, like what is called a carnet or cedula. They would not go for this.
Again, this is an issue designed to PREVENT specific people (ones who are perceived as belonging to a group that votes for Democrats) from voting. If you refuse to recognize this, then you are just being silly.
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Naaa....being silly is making this about something its not (the flawed concept that its supposed to be some racist endeavor to keep blacks from voting), and ignoring what its solely about (impeding the effort at voter fraud)
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Again, this is an issue designed to PREVENT specific people (ones who are perceived as belonging to a group that votes for Democrats) from voting. If you refuse to recognize this, then you are just being silly.
I think it silly for you to call black people stupid.
But I don't know how I could stop you.
If IDs are easier to get then the stupid white people will get them too.
I suppose there are many fewer stupid white people , if this situation is as you maintain.
But the stupid must vote .
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People who share the same economic status tend to vote the same way. be they Black or White. I did not say anyone was stupid.
But there are people who vote against their interests: Teabaggers (lumpenproletarians) do this because it makes them feel superior to Blacks and to people they consider to be 'trailer trash". Trump rallies are replete with such dipshits.
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So hysterical coming from you. It's literally a completely accurate description of liberal guilt mind think. Especially with the superior than thou reference. Brilliant
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The Virginia Department of Elections has released a series of interactive data visualizations that depict variations in election administration across the state’s 133 election jurisdictions. Elections Commissioner Edgardo Cortes describes the project as “part of the [Elections] Board’s broader goal of making decisions related to election administration more transparent and evidence-based.”
The interactive tools, developed in collaboration with The Pew Charitable Trusts, are based on information provided by local registrars to the state’s central voter registration and election management database on voter turnout rates, registration and denied registration rates, and processing times for absentee ballots and voter roll update requests.
http://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/analysis/2016/05/18/virginia-web-tools-let-users-access-interactive-election-data
(http://data.voterparticipation.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/data-center-template-508x400.png)
This chart showing the growth of the Rising American Electorate – unmarried women, people of color, and Millennials – in key states between 2010 and 2016 demonstrates quite clearly how broadly and quickly the face of America is changing.
http://elections.virginia.gov/resultsreports/dataproject/VoterRegistrationSource.html