What was really surprising about Flordia were the demographic breakdowns.
Amongst Republican voters:
McCain won every age group except 30-44 who voted for Romney.
McCain won the Catholic vote and Romney won the Protestant vote (even beating Huckabee in the Protestants who attend church weekly demographic)
Hispanics voted, in large margin, for McCain.
Romney won only one education demographic - "Some College"
One of the most interesting - Romney won only one region of Florida - Southern Florida
Also interesting - Romney won amongst Republican voters who listed "Illegal Immigration" or "Terrorism" as their most important concern.
McCain won amongst Republican voters who listed "the Economy" or "Iraq" as their primary concern. That was tough on Romney, who spent much of his time concentrating on the economy. Yet, McCain spent much of his time concentrating on terrorism and national security.
One of the most interesting - Romney won only one region of Florida - Southern Florida
Romney put on a guayabera (Cuban shirt) and spent several afternoons denouncing Fidel among the rightwing Cubans.
McCain didn't do this. Cubans tend to mistrust both senators and military men.
McCain 'forgave' the Vietnamese and returned and made nice with the Communist government in Vietnam.
Rush has no influence with the South Florida Cubans, who don't understand English, but the local Spanish radio demogogues all backed Romney. I suspect they were paid. This is a common practice here. Pay Armando Perez Rourra and he will denounce his own grandmother. Probably he'd cook and eat her, too, for enough money, had she not died and been buried in Cuba long ago.
McCain/Giuliani Ticket?
I know he wouldnt' be eligible for Prez, but is he technically eligible for VP?
But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.From the 12th Amendment to the US Constitution.
I know he wouldnt' be eligible for Prez, but is he technically eligible for VP?QuoteBut no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.From the 12th Amendment to the US Constitution.
Florida Fallout: Super Tuesday Looks to be a McCain Blowout
Sure it is.
Why have quality control in education.
Might as well disband the FDA while we are at it.
My sister is a teacher. Been one for 30 years.
I don't see what is so onerous about requiring students to read at 5th grade level at the end of 5th grade. And it is a national disgrace to have the number of college students taking remedial classwork that we do.
Ask XO, he sees the results of children left behind.
Why have quality control in education.
Might as well disband the FDA while we are at it.
Heh. That's funny. Yeah, right.
seems most of the complaints are coming from teachers not making the grade. And administrators should be fired for gaming the system.
Actually i don't.
Should educators be held accountable for their work?
Is 5th grade reading competence an unrealistic goal for 5th graders?
Should taxpayers get value for their investment?
What say you?
California charter schools are exempt from the "highly qualified" NCLB rule.
So you would not have a problem with 50 NCLB's managed at the state level?
By the way the investors are the local taxpayers who pay the majority of costs for local school districts. Do they deserve a fair ROI?
Huyck taught at a California Charter School
| Yet when Mr. Goldenkranz became principal in September 2005, he was informed by the Santa Cruz County Office of Education that, as he recalled in a recent interview, ?in no uncertain terms, we had to develop a path to compliance with N.C.L.B.? Once the teachers were certified, Pacific Collegiate itself would have to pay $6,000 per teacher to the state for their enrollment in a program devised to improve retention of new faculty members. Mr. Goldenkranz had Pacific Collegiate?s lawyers poke for any loopholes. The word came back from the county. If Pacific Collegiate failed to have every one of its supposedly unqualified teachers enrolled in a certification program within two years, it would risk losing its charter to operate or its stream of public financing. Under California law, a teacher must successfully complete a certification program to fulfill the mandate of No Child Left Behind that there be a ?highly qualified? instructor in every classroom. Marilyn Errett, an administrator with the state Commission on Teacher Credentialing, said California did offer a fast-track route for experienced teachers in the core subjects of English, science and math, as well as a path that combined a teaching internship with 100 hours of college course work. |
The fact is California charter schools are exempt from that provision of the nclb. School districts cn set their own standards. Nclb is being blamed for actions they did not take. Huyck did not leave because of rules out of DC.
And no i didn't imply you wrote or altered the times article. It isn't sarcastic enough for your style.
So no teachers in ordinary public schools have to worry about these sort of mandated classes? Well, that's good to... wait, you didn't say that?
Huyck was not forced out because of NCLB rules.
...The way the system is being organized and operated today...with all the data collecting, business tactic processes, assessments given more than instruction, not to mention lack of funding to train teachers as promised by the NCLB act....the system is failing, not the teachers/teaching.
The child who can't make that 'grade' in a regular classroom is sent through a referral process then tested for special education. In the past, those children who COULD NOT learn due to diagnosed learning disabilities were helped with special education classes. Now, those children are expected to make the grade along with all the other kids. That's just not reality. My god...we are not saying that we don't want to 'GIVE THEM A CHANCE".....OR that they can't learn.....
But as it is now, those children who need help are not placed, not qualifiying into special programs and are simply not serviced. = they are left behind.
The way it is today all children expected to do the exact same on tests scores..be damned their abilities. THAT'S what is wrong with the act...not the high standard of teaching or the programs provided. I love the new programs. I am one of the advocates of the NCLB provisions...."Reading First" schoosl...etc.
Lawsuits have forced school systems to focus more on the life of the system as opposed to the needs of the children. ..but at what cost?
To require/demand that EVERY single child read at the 5th grade level is actually not a bad idea....but the punitive actionst that are given to the schools/teachers who dont' make that happen is unfair and frankly doing more to reverse the very idea of leaving no child behind. That's why this has to change...
Are teachers cheating by teaching to the test?
To whose benefit?
Are teachers cheating by teaching to the test?
To whose benefit?
You keep bringing back the punitive portions of the act. Seems to me it is only punitive to those who fail to meet the goals. And the goals don't seem outrageous. 5th grade reading in 5th grade. Now if they were testing for 9th grade reading and calling it a 5th grade standard then you would have a point but i haven't heard that claim. I do hear a lot of excuses. Like lack of training for professionals who by definition should come into the field trained.
Quote...The way the system is being organized and operated today...with all the data collecting, business tactic processes, assessments given more than instruction, not to mention lack of funding to train teachers as promised by the NCLB act....the system is failing, not the teachers/teaching.
The child who can't make that 'grade' in a regular classroom is sent through a referral process then tested for special education. In the past, those children who COULD NOT learn due to diagnosed learning disabilities were helped with special education classes. Now, those children are expected to make the grade along with all the other kids. That's just not reality. My god...we are not saying that we don't want to 'GIVE THEM A CHANCE".....OR that they can't learn.....
But as it is now, those children who need help are not placed, not qualifiying into special programs and are simply not serviced. = they are left behind.
The way it is today all children expected to do the exact same on tests scores..be damned their abilities. THAT'S what is wrong with the act...not the high standard of teaching or the programs provided. I love the new programs. I am one of the advocates of the NCLB provisions...."Reading First" schoosl...etc.
Lawsuits have forced school systems to focus more on the life of the system as opposed to the needs of the children. ..but at what cost?
To require/demand that EVERY single child read at the 5th grade level is actually not a bad idea....but the punitive actionst that are given to the schools/teachers who dont' make that happen is unfair and frankly doing more to reverse the very idea of leaving no child behind. That's why this has to change...
I wasn't really that interested in this discussion at first because I don't have kids. It's not that I'm not concerned about the quality of education today - I live in a neighborhood full of kids, of all ages, and have several schools within a couple of miles of the house. I have noticed, the last few years, that whenever I get a chance to talk to younger people about, oh, let's say general subjects they should have learned in school, a large proportion of them don't seem to 'know' what you might have expected someone that age to have learned by their age, say, even twenty years ago. That's a mild way of saying it seems like people are getting dumber.
I think I can understand a lot of what Cynthia is complaining about. It is unreasonable to expect every child of a certain age - say 10, about the age of the average fifth grader - to progress at the same rate, and be at the same level. On average, most should be able to pass basic reading, math, science, et cetera, tests for their grade level. Some will score higher ( the A and B students), some average (the C students), some below average (the D students), and some will fail (the F students). (That may not be the grading system your schools use, but that's what the schools I went to used back in my day.)
The students who couldn't (or wouldn't) keep up, who slipped into the lower C average or to a D, were given extra time, usually in a remedial class. If they failed, they were held back a year to go through that class level again, until they could pass the material. Students who were ahead of their class could be moved to a more advanced class - not the next grade level, necessarily, but a class in their grade level that covered more advanced material than the basics.
Students who somehow passed to the next grade but who were found unable to do the work at that grade level once they started could be put back into the previous grade level. I would imagine there was some system to track this, so the school system could keep tabs on the teachers and be sure they weren't just passing students to get rid of them, or to keep their numbers up.
It wasn't a bad reflection on the teacher back then to go to the administration and tell them student X just could not keep up with the classwork and needed to be placed in a remedial class. Back then, before ADD, ADHD and Ritalin became well known, it was understood that some kids were going to have more trouble learning the material than others, and more trouble keeping up with their grade level, and the teachers and administrators were able to exercise several different options to try and help them.
I've heard a lot of the same complaints Cynthia has from several others. Teachers are 'teaching to the test' in order to have enough of their students pass the FCAT (Florida Comprehensive Assessment Test) to keep their percentages up and keep their jobs. Students are learning more by rote, rather than learning problem solving skills. Students who have no business being passed on to the next level are being passed. It's on the news and in the papers.
In the meantime, America is losing - and in some cases, has already lost - it's place as the world leader in several different technologies. I read in the paper the other day that the Army is having to accept more and more recruits who don't have high school diplomas.
Our education system seems to be broken. NCLB doesn't seem to be fixing it, if it is forcing teachers to 'teach to the test' and fudge their numbers in order to keep their jobs. That's not quality control. Maybe I just got lucky and managed to spend my school years in an exceptional system, but it seems to me it worked just fine. Teachers were free to try to help their students get the education they needed without fear that they could be dismissed for referring a student to remedial classes, or even holding a student back because he could not handle the material; at the same time, teachers who weren't doing their jobs (by passing students to the next level who shouldn't have been passed, ignoring problems and having higher than normal failure rates) were weeded out by the system.
And the students learned. It seems to me that's the bottom line.
You don't seem to understand the point on the "punitive" actions. If a child simply can not read at a fifth grade level (a special needs child),
I don't think NCLB allows race or class to qualify as a special need however.
Cynthia brought class into it with her remarks about home environments.
QuoteCynthia brought class into it with her remarks about home environments.
Looked for 'em, couldn't find 'em. Wanted to see 'em in context to see if the 'home environments' part could only be construed as some sort of class or racial thing. Could mean the kid just has parents that don't give a crap.
Cynthia brought class into it with her remarks about home environments.
It needs tweaking..that's what I have been saying all along.
But they bring us to our knees, humiliating those who don't meet the AYP by publishing the schools in the newspaper.
QuoteIt needs tweaking..that's what I have been saying all along.
Thus your support for Hillary... i believe she being the one who wants to do away with NCLB.
QuoteBut they bring us to our knees, humiliating those who don't meet the AYP by publishing the schools in the newspaper.
Yes better to keep it all hush hush.
What would work?
I like vocher systems because I beleive competition is self policing. Parents would compare schools and use the ones that appealed to them.
My Father was taught in a one room school house , the School marm was a state employee but she had a lot of autonomy and controll of the class , the class was all grades in the same room ,but the teachers task was not impossible , she taught the older grades mostly and taught them to teach the younger kids.
Where is a modern , first world ,school system being effective? We probly don't need to invent anything .
It's not fair and balanced as it is recorded based on false evidence of hard working teachers and students.
It goes like this; to hold a child who clearly can not make that grade level benchmark--no matter how hard a system tries...to the exact same standard as all other 3, 4, 5th graders is not fair nor is it balanced in terms of calling that school a failure.
QuoteIt goes like this; to hold a child who clearly can not make that grade level benchmark--no matter how hard a system tries...to the exact same standard as all other 3, 4, 5th graders is not fair nor is it balanced in terms of calling that school a failure.
Are not all schools held to the same standards. Are the rules different for urban vs rural schools? UIf not, why is it unfair to point out schools that do not make the grade.
I have no problem with tweaking the concept. I do have a problem with doing away with the requirements and the program because teachers and administrators appear to be more concerned with their jobs than they are with the children.
Who but the administrators and teachers "teach to the test" and adjust curriculum to game the system?
What is their motivation?
Why does recognizing that fact indicate bias?
The "tests" don't reflect what has been taught, first of all.
the motivation of the teachers in Bush's State of Texas to teach and cheat to the test was all about fear.
The fact that the companies who produce such tests, mandate the curriculum at large?
If you are told that child (a) must know fact (1) by day 100......you should be given the proper assessments to test that child and thus drive the instruction for that child to reach that goal.
The way it is now......the assessments don't connect with the curriculum and the results are practically invalid...at least they would be invalid if those points were votes!
The war has nothing to do with nclb.
After a while, it though gets to you, doesn't it? Plus, being away from home might be difficult on marriages, so I bet the divorce rate is probably pretty high.
And, it is hard on the body. Were alot of your colleagues experiencing this as well?
...associationofchristiantruckers...
The war has nothing to do with nclb.QuoteThe "tests" don't reflect what has been taught, first of all.
Why not? A world history class should cover Greece and Rome. Does the test also cover this?Quotethe motivation of the teachers in Bush's State of Texas to teach and cheat to the test was all about fear.
What does that have to do with discussing your situation in NM?QuoteThe fact that the companies who produce such tests, mandate the curriculum at large?
Do they? Give examples. Is a sample test available online?QuoteIf you are told that child (a) must know fact (1) by day 100......you should be given the proper assessments to test that child and thus drive the instruction for that child to reach that goal.
The way it is now......the assessments don't connect with the curriculum and the results are practically invalid...at least they would be invalid if those points were votes!
If Greece is covered in chapter 3 i would suspect that questions about Greece are valid on the test. Is this not the case?
Why not just teach fact(1) to kid (a) before day 100?
The endorsement of Obama by Sen. Edward M. Kennedy (D-Mass.), Caroline Kennedy, and just about the whole Kennedy clan was not just the best political theater seen in Washington in some time. It was a dagger through the heart of the Clintons that they tried hard to prevent. The sense of entitlement and inevitability for Sen. Clinton continues to decline.
Who but the administrators and teachers "teach to the test" and adjust curriculum to game the system?
What is their motivation?
The answer is straightforward: systemic high-quality education, disseminated to reach the entire territory, including the most remote and impoverished communities of this vast country, so that all Brazilians can acquire the means to become creative and critical thinkers, capable of developing their own opinions and becoming true contributors to solve the challenges involved in constructing a fair and democratic society.
Three tenets serve as the main foundations of the Brazilian Plan for the Development of Education (PDE): systemic, territorial and empowering education. Enacted by the current administration, this plan outlines a broad range of executive measures aimed at rescuing the quality, reach and long-term impact of the Brazilian education system.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=brazils-option-for-science-educationQuoteThe answer is straightforward: systemic high-quality education, disseminated to reach the entire territory, including the most remote and impoverished communities of this vast country, so that all Brazilians can acquire the means to become creative and critical thinkers, capable of developing their own opinions and becoming true contributors to solve the challenges involved in constructing a fair and democratic society.
Three tenets serve as the main foundations of the Brazilian Plan for the Development of Education (PDE): systemic, territorial and empowering education. Enacted by the current administration, this plan outlines a broad range of executive measures aimed at rescuing the quality, reach and long-term impact of the Brazilian education system.
I like that they have decided what it is they want from their education , the goals are clear.
Who but the administrators and teachers "teach to the test" and adjust curriculum to game the system?
What is their motivation?
I believe the motivation is to get better test scores so the school gets a good rating in the NCLB system. And so far the results are less than unimpressive.
I thought the motivation was to educate all children. Impressive results take time, as well. We are given a small window of time, and even less funding. But, by darn on paper, the president "thinks" we are on the right track. He's not listening to his American People, it seems. Perhaps Obama will.
I thought the motivation was to educate all children. Impressive results take time, as well. We are given a small window of time, and even less funding. But, by darn on paper, the president "thinks" we are on the right track. He's not listening to his American People, it seems. Perhaps Obama will.
OK, this is all getting a bit silly.
The way NCLB works is this:
The first year a school gets below par scores, the school board is mandated to INCREASE their funding to achieve better scores.
This is repeated a second year.
After the THIRD year, the school board is mandated to remove under-performing teachers in addition to increasing funding.
So, it's not like NCLB doesn't give you time and money to fix problems...
You're wrong, Ami.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=brazils-option-for-science-educationQuoteThe answer is straightforward: systemic high-quality education, disseminated to reach the entire territory, including the most remote and impoverished communities of this vast country, so that all Brazilians can acquire the means to become creative and critical thinkers, capable of developing their own opinions and becoming true contributors to solve the challenges involved in constructing a fair and democratic society.
Three tenets serve as the main foundations of the Brazilian Plan for the Development of Education (PDE): systemic, territorial and empowering education. Enacted by the current administration, this plan outlines a broad range of executive measures aimed at rescuing the quality, reach and long-term impact of the Brazilian education system.
I like that they have decided what it is they want from their education , the goals are clear.
"By bringing their vision, efforts and experience together, the Brazilian government, through the Federal University of Rio Grande do Norte, and the ELS-IINN have partnered to establish the Natal Campus of the Brain and to use this multidisciplinary, scientific-social initiative to launch the Alberto Santos-Dumont Science Education Program for Children. The goal of this initiative is to enroll one million children from the public school system nationwide in the most comprehensive science and technology education program in Brazilian history."
Sure, Plane...look at the support Brazilians are willing to provide in terms the synergy of partnering---sans the threats, punitive actions. I have yet read anything of the latter. Perhaps there's more to the story, but so far I read that this country has taken the bull by the horns with a clear and focused goal for children in the arena of quality science education.
That slippery slope of demanding scores rise with no caution to what districts will to do to get there is coming to fruition in many districts across the country. Like I said, NCLB had/and possibly has potential but on the ground floor, on the front lines, I see first hand that it is not necessarily all about substandard teaching...... but an unbalanced approach and a flawed system ---NCLB.
Reading the bill doesn't mean that it is working!
How would increased funding alleviate time constraints?
Increasing the length of the school day or year round schooling are not part of the scope of NCLB, nor should it be.
Ok, does it sya who sets these goals? Why can't local officials?
Ok, does it sya who sets these goals? Why can't local officials?
Reading the bill doesn't mean that it is working!
If you've read the bill, tell me what part of my description is incorrect.
No, I am speaking about the mandates we receive to teach literacy for 120 minutes, math for 120 minutes and then find the time to teach science etc. I was replying to Plane's post on Brazilian schools in terms of science ed. As it stands now, we don't have that window to teach such things because the NCLB has demanded that we spend "X" amount of hours on only the core subjects. That's how it has trickled down.
Ok, does it sya who sets these goals? Why can't local officials?
Yes, it says who sets the goals; state education boards with input from the local school boards.
QuoteNo, I am speaking about the mandates we receive to teach literacy for 120 minutes, math for 120 minutes and then find the time to teach science etc. I was replying to Plane's post on Brazilian schools in terms of science ed. As it stands now, we don't have that window to teach such things because the NCLB has demanded that we spend "X" amount of hours on only the core subjects. That's how it has trickled down.
What was the schedule prior to NCLB?
What specifically is covered when you teach literacy?
No, I am speaking about the mandates we receive to teach literacy for 120 minutes, math for 120 minutes and then find the time to teach science etc. I was replying to Plane's post on Brazilian schools in terms of science ed. As it stands now, we don't have that window to teach such things because the NCLB has demanded that we spend "X" amount of hours on only the core subjects. That's how it has trickled down.
Funding is not there. period. NOt enough, that is.
Perhaps I have not keep as lcose a track in this thread as I could becuase I still see that NCLB occured becuase school systems were not successful in what they do. If that occurs, SOMETHING wil lfil lthat voacuum whether it is government or business sectors.
People complained and this Act came about. It does seem flawed but is there something better, e.g. something that will assure school systems do their job? As far as funding, if the funding isn't there, then perhaps a SPLOST is in order?
No, I am speaking about the mandates we receive to teach literacy for 120 minutes, math for 120 minutes and then find the time to teach science etc. I was replying to Plane's post on Brazilian schools in terms of science ed. As it stands now, we don't have that window to teach such things because the NCLB has demanded that we spend "X" amount of hours on only the core subjects. That's how it has trickled down.
No part of the NCLB act mandates time requirements for teaching any subject.
So the problem is with the script and not the concept and intentions of NCLB?
Who chose Houghton Mifflin to be your curriculum vendor?