DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: Christians4LessGvt on April 30, 2010, 09:20:27 AM
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If this happens, the additional seats in congress for the LIBs will insure their power grab. Future elections will be meaningless. Not even the "throw the bums out" mentality in November. The "Transformation of America" will have succeeded.
Puerto Rico 51st State? Congress Scrambling to Make it So
There is a bill to make Puerto Rico a state. Again, they are trying to pull one over on us and on Puerto Ricans, who have consistently said they do not want to become a state.
Please consider this:
* The U.S. would transform, overnight, into a bilingual nation. At least half of Puerto Ricans do not speak English, the language of our U.S. Constitution and founding documents. The Washington Times article, "Puerto Rican statehood," analyzes all the implications of adding a foreign language-speaking state to the Union.
* It would bring immediate demands for massive federal spending. The average income of Puerto Ricans is less than half that of our poorest state, and infrastructure and the environment are far below American standards. Puerto Rico has a population with a median national income of $17,741, nearly a third of that for the U.S.
* Puerto Rico is already a democracy. Despite the bill's deceptive title, Puerto Rico already has an elected government and exists as a self-governed commonwealth of the U.S.
* Statehood would give Puerto Rico more congressional representation than 25 of our 50 states! It would inevitably give Democrats two additional U.S. Senators and 6 to 8 additional Members of the House.
H.R. 2499 is stealth legislation designed to lead to the admission of Spanish-speaking Puerto Rico as the 51st state, thereby making us a de facto bilingual nation, like Canada. The U.S. Congress should not be forcing Puerto Ricans to vote on statehood, especially since the Puerto Rican people have rejected statehood three times since 1991!
No Member of Congress who describes himself as a limited government, fiscal conservative should be casting a YEA vote for H.R. 2499, as Puerto Rican statehood would cause an immediate increase in federal expenditures, particularly for taxpayer-funded welfare state services.
Sponsored by Puerto Rican delegate Pedro Pierluisi (D), the Puerto Rico Democracy Act (H.R. 2499) which has reared its ugly head a number of times over the past few congresses but has yet to have any success would require Puerto Ricans to hold a national referendum to decide if they want Puerto Rico to remain a self-governing U.S. commonwealth, or become the 51st state.
The referendum would be set up as two plebiscites which would effectively deceive Puerto Ricans into voting for statehood. In the first round of votes, the Puerto Rican people would be given the choice between remaining a U.S. territory and "pursuing a different political status." If the majority votes to maintain the status quo, this bill would require that Puerto Rico vote on this same issue every eight years.
If the majority votes for "different status," a second round of votes would be held where Puerto Ricans would choose either statehood or independence-the status quo of "U.S. territory" would not even be an option! In other words, the two ballots would be rigged to favor the outcome of statehood, overriding the wishes of Americans and Puerto Ricans who want to maintain the current commonwealth status.
* Contact your US congressmen AND
* Take quick action here: http://www.capwiz.com/eagleforum/issues/alert/?alertid=14966151&type=CO (http://www.capwiz.com/eagleforum/issues/alert/?alertid=14966151&type=CO)
http://biggovernment.com/taylorking/2010/04/28/puerto-rico-51st-state-congress-scrambling-to-make-it-so/#more-113066 (http://biggovernment.com/taylorking/2010/04/28/puerto-rico-51st-state-congress-scrambling-to-make-it-so/#more-113066)
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The referendum would be set up as two plebiscites which would effectively deceive Puerto Ricans into voting for statehood. In the first round of votes, the Puerto Rican people would be given the choice between remaining a U.S. territory and "pursuing a different political status." If the majority votes to maintain the status quo, this bill would require that Puerto Rico vote on this same issue every eight years.
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There is zero deception in this. Statehood/Commonwealth/Independence are now and always have been the key Puerto Rican issues for the past 60 years. Why should they not be allowed to vote on this every eight years?
Why should {The referendum would be set up as two plebiscites which would effectively deceive Puerto Ricans into voting for statehood. In the first round of votes, the Puerto Rican people would be given the choice between remaining a U.S. territory and "pursuing a different political status." If the majority votes to maintain the status quo, this bill would require that Puerto Rico vote on this same issue every eight years.
Puerto Ricans NOT be represented in the House and Senate?
This is ALREADY a bilingual country: New Mexico has always been officially bilingual.
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So postpone any such bill until after the Nov Elections. That'll demonstrate if the notion of statehood is sincere or pure politically driven
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I would vastly prefer this. I am tired of ignorant morons with the intellectual abilities of a radish running my country.
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So Xo proposes to ...... what again? Postpone such a bill after the Nov elections? A demonstration of sincerity of statehood vs purely political. Which is it?
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why should puerto ricans be the only one to decide such an important issue?
i do not want puerto rico to be a state.
puerto ricans should be able to decide if they wish to leave
or cease being a part of the US if thats what they want.
but it is crazy to allow puerto ricans to decide whether the
United States adds a 51st state.
if only puerto ricans can decide to be the 51st state then other
states should be allowed to depart if they so choose....
i am ready for my state to leave like yesterday!
i want out of this mess the left has caused.
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well then how hard would it be for states to leave the union to form their own nations?
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I think hawaii would be very interested in this.
I`m told alot of hawaiians would like to separate
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kimba...there would be several states interested
but the "control freaks" wont like it
they know what would happen
they would loose their golden goose & be left looking like the empty suits they really are
they cant produce a damn thing....the only thing they can produce is ways to control people
if the right states left...the rest would end up being like 3rd World pieces of shit.
i hope soon the movement to leave the union gets stronger
the hell with this non-sense
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well then how hard would it be for states to leave the union to form their own nations?
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That was tried in 1861. It didn't work.
doofus
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well then how hard would it be for states to leave the union to form their own nations?
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That was tried in 1861. It didn't work.
doofus
isn't that the year you were born?
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well then how hard would it be for states to leave the union to form their own nations?
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That was tried in 1861. It didn't work.
doofus
Can't answer a direct question (http://debategate.com/new3dhs/index.php?topic=9552.msg99956#msg99956), but has time to call people more names. Way to elevate the level of dialog you keep complaining about in here, Xo
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Are we assuming that Puerto Ricans would vote to change the status Quo?
This Referendum has been held before and whether this bill passes or not is likely to be held again.
Puerto Rico could indeed become an independant nation , it would certainly not become the smallest nor poorest, but for most Puerto Ricans this would be a financial loss and this possibility has failed previous referenda.
Becomeing our poorest state would give Puerto Rico a little more clout in Washington , but wouldn't really improve their prestige much nor bring them a lot of swag above what they already get , this option has been rejected by the Puerto Rican population before.
Does the US have an option to expell Puerto Rico and force the question? I think we really do , but we are so unlikely to do such a thing just for honors sake that no one ever brings it up.
Can the US adopt the territory as a state (or part of a state) without
getting the permit of the population ? I guess we could , Hawaii didn't hold a referendum did it? I don't think this a likely choice it would be odius to everyone except the Macheteros who would finally acheive a real power base.
Untill something changes in a large way I think the people of Puerto Rico are wise to choose to hold the rest of us to the present situation , which gives them special access and service with very little tax burden.
Making the referendum happen more often isn't changeing any of the facts.
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plane...i just found out that even if the puerto ricans voted to
become a state it would have to be approved by the congress
so i am not nearly as worried about it actually happening
soon the House & Senate look to be evenly split or even Republican controlled
so this isn't going to happen....the vote in PR may happen
but congress will not approve of making PR the 51st state
making PR the 51st state makes no economic sense
it makes great political sense for the democrats to add millions of poor non-english speaking voters
but would be economically insane and bad for our country
so i feel sure the American people once shown what the costs would be would strongly oppose it
this is nothing more than laying the ground work by Taxocrats for a future fight
incrementalism baby!
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I think we are assuming a lot .
Do we really know before a referendum what the People there want?
Have you heard of the Tennesee procedure?
Tenn was never invited to become a state , they elected a pair of Senators and a brace of Representatives and declaired themselves to be a state .
It worked and was not challenged.
Imagine that Cuba , Qubec , Guatamala , Costa Rica British Colombia,and Puerto Rico all send Congressional delegations , duly elected according to our constitution , on what grounds would we refuse them seats?
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Tenn was never invited to become a state , they elected a pair of Senators and a brace of Representatives and declaired themselves to be a state .
It worked and was not challenged.
Nonetheless, in a close vote on June 1, 1796, Congress approved the admission of Tennessee as the sixteenth state of the Union. They drew its borders by extending the northern and southern borders of North Carolina, with a few deviations, to the Mississippi River, Tennessee's western boundary.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Tennessee#Admission_to_the_Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Tennessee#Admission_to_the_Union)
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The answer to "how hard would it be for a state to leave the Union is, "It is impossible". I think Texas had some provision included in its statehood application, but it rejoined the Union after the Civil War. Of course, Texas was forced to join the US because as an independent nation was bankrupt.
Puerto Ricans, I think, should have the opportunity to choose their status.
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Of course, Texas was forced to join the US because as an independent nation was bankrupt.
and of course....now the reverse is true!
ps: if Puerto Ricans "should have the opportunity to choose their status"
then Texans and other states should too! This one way street crap
the left always pushes is soon coming to an end!
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This one way street crap the left always pushes is soon coming to an end!
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The Civil War settled the issue of secession: there won't be any more secessions.
Puerto Rico will almost certainly become a state. DC will get at lease one senator and a Rep. or two.
But Texas isn't going to secede, ever.
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Puerto Rico will almost certainly become a state. DC will get at lease one senator and a Rep. or two.
Based on current population stats, if Puerto Rico becomes a state, it will gain 2 voting Senators and 6 voting Representatives. The 6 Representatives will be balanced by reductions in other states unless Congress votes to increase the number of Representatives.
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"The Civil War settled the issue of secession: there won't be any more secessions"
LOL....yeah sure...wars ony settle things temporarily....just ask East Germany, Poland, Kosevo, & almost every other country
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So you would call 145 years to be "temporary"? Really, there won't be any secessions in the USA.
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"So you would call 145 years to be "temporary"?"
In historical timelines of course I would.....
and anyway for most of those 145 years
there was no reason to provoke a secession movement.
The Left has basically ruined the country & the groundwork
for secession is being laid...behind the curtain OZ is still
attempting to pretend "everything is ok"....the charade may
last a bit longer..it may...it may not..we'll see..but once OZ is
shown for what he really is....well.....you'll see.
"Really, there won't be any secessions in the USA"
The secessions will happen & in fact are much more likely to be
successful today than they were in the 1800's. Washington has
a much lower level of pain tolerance now than they did then.
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Utter goofy nonsense. Secessions are about 500 times less likely that all those attacks on Iran you drool over. NOT going to happen.