DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: Michael Tee on June 04, 2010, 02:11:35 AM
-
from the Juan Cole website, a link to http://i.imgur.com/u9Kul.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/u9Kul.jpg) shows how the Zio-Nazi bullshit machine used old photos to depict stockpiled bullet-proof vests found on the Mavi Marmara
You know everything that comes out of these lying sacks of shit is fake, yet posters in this NG continue to post their asinine excuses for murder as if they were coming from reputable sources. Go figure.
-
Even if the charges of forgery are false, the photos show chains, sticks, an axe? things that would be on any ship.
Juan Cole
-
More from Juan Cole:
Hey, Tea Party. A foreign navy boarded an unarmed ship flying the flag of a NATO member in international waters and shot dead an American citizen with four bullets to the head and one in the chest on Memorial Day. It did this while the head of the belligerent state was on his way to a state visit to Washington, DC, to be awarded a further $200 million in aid on top of the $3 billion of American taxpayer money the US gives away to him every year.
If you are not upset by this, your tea is weak, man. Weak.
Could someone tell me what the tea Party has to do with this?
-
He's pointing out the hypocrisy of the Tea Party, the "fiscal conservatives" who decry government spending on social programs but utter not a peep about the billions given annually to Israel, which has just murdered a U.S. citizen on board the Mavi Marmara.
-
http://ibnkafkasobiterdicta.wordpress.com/2010/06/02/gaza-flotilla-how-israels-ministry-of-foreign-affairs-fakes-photos-of-seized-weapons/ (http://ibnkafkasobiterdicta.wordpress.com/2010/06/02/gaza-flotilla-how-israels-ministry-of-foreign-affairs-fakes-photos-of-seized-weapons/)
Another website with even MORE Zio-Nazi fake "weapon" photos, all pre-dating the incident. Not just one photo - - lots!!
-
He's pointing out the hypocrisy of the Tea Party, the "fiscal conservatives" who decry government spending on social programs but utter not a peep about the billions given annually to Israel, which has just murdered a U.S. citizen on board the Mavi Marmara.
Bless his heart. Bet he thinks the Tea Party controls congress lo these many years.
Probably thinks that without the Tea Party, AIPAC would have no one to lobby.
-
<<Bless his heart. Bet he thinks the Tea Party controls congress lo these many years.>>
Why,, do you have to control Congress before you can bitch about its profligate ways? I thought the whole point of those hysterical little twits was that Congress was OUT of control.
<<Probably thinks that without the Tea Party, AIPAC would have no one to lobby. >>
No such thing, AIPAC lobbies the legislators directly, but it's a nice dodge to avoid responding to the charge of Tea Party hypocrisy. I'll have to take it as an admission of total bankruptcy on your ability to respond in any way to the issue raised, meaning that there IS no answer. OF COURSE they are hypocritical little bastards, whose professed yearning for fiscal responsibility is nothing more than another blow struck in the class war against the neediest segment of American society while the giveaway to Israel can continue unabated. They're obviously much more concerned with cutting off aid to the poor and the underprivileged than they are about pouring money into America's foreign racist and fascist friends.
-
I'll have to take it as an admission of total bankruptcy on your ability to respond in any way to the issue raised, meaning that there IS no answer.
ahhhhh, so that explains your inability to respond to any of the issues & points I've raised. I appreciate the concession
-
from the Juan Cole website, a link to http://i.imgur.com/u9Kul.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/u9Kul.jpg) shows how the Zio-Nazi bullshit machine used old photos to depict stockpiled bullet-proof vests found on the Mavi Marmara
Can you guarantee that the time in your digital camera is correct and not some old time (without checking it, just guarantee that it will always be the current date / time)?
If not, why do you assume that the time stamp in that image is correct?
If it was taken with a cell phone camera, then I'd be more likely to trust the time stamp, as they are usually generated from either a GPS signal or from the time set signal broadcast by cell towers. However, this was taken with a Nikon D2Xs - I just checked the specs for that camera and it has neither a GPS nor a cell phone built in. In other words, the date and time need to be set and occasionally changed by a user. And I live in a world where I still go into houses that have blinking "12:00" all over the place because people don't set the time.
-
Another website with even MORE Zio-Nazi fake "weapon" photos, all pre-dating the incident. Not just one photo - - lots!!
My previous point is also pointed out in the comments on this page. And the fact that all of the photos have nearly the same time stamp just indicate that they were taken about the same time with the same camera. Since there is no way to guarantee that the time set on the camera is correct that's the only piece of information that we can glean from these time stamps.
I can't tell you how many of the photos I have posted on the web have "bad" EXIF time stamps. My wife is particularly bad about not setting the clock on the camera after changing batteries, so there are lots of photos that I have with time stamps around when the camera defaults the current time to...
-
<<Can you guarantee that the time in your digital camera is correct and not some old time (without checking it, just guarantee that it will always be the current date / time)?>>
No, I can't.
<<If not, why do you assume that the time stamp in that image is correct?>>
Big difference between my habits and an army's use of technical equipment. Even my office fax is sometimes out of time, which is really unforgivable. However, these photos are courtesy of the IDF, and I assume that military personnel using military equipment are subject to more rigid protocols in the use of the equipment than I am. For example, I would expect that, just as cops do with breathalyzers, the equipment settings are checked daily at the start of the equipment's working day and by each operator who uses the equipment at the start of his or her first use of it. I would expect a log to be kept for each piece of equipment, with each operator checking off the time of his or her equipment check and also divided up into checkboxes for each aspect of equipment function that the operator checked, to ensure accuracy of time and date and avoid the kind of slipshod settings that could be expected from a schlepper like me. And in armies like the British or Israeli armies, I would expect that such protocols would be rigorously adhered to.
-
I thought the whole point of those hysterical little twits was that Congress was OUT of control.
Really, wasn't it you who was saying their entire focus was keeping the black and brown man down?
-
<<Really, wasn't it you who was saying their entire focus was keeping the black and brown man down?>>
That's very true, but I ALSO said that they could never admit to that, so they had to keep it focused at the more general level of "profligate" spending by an "out of control" Congress. As it now appears, the only "profligate" spending they are concerned with is whatever helps the largely black and brown underclass, not what benefits America's foreign "allies" and helps them to kill American citizens.
-
Big difference between my habits and an army's use of technical equipment. Even my office fax is sometimes out of time, which is really unforgivable. However, these photos are courtesy of the IDF, and I assume that military personnel using military equipment are subject to more rigid protocols in the use of the equipment than I am. For example, I would expect that, just as cops do with breathalyzers, the equipment settings are checked daily at the start of the equipment's working day and by each operator who uses the equipment at the start of his or her first use of it. I would expect a log to be kept for each piece of equipment, with each operator checking off the time of his or her equipment check and also divided up into checkboxes for each aspect of equipment function that the operator checked, to ensure accuracy of time and date and avoid the kind of slipshod settings that could be expected from a schlepper like me. And in armies like the British or Israeli armies, I would expect that such protocols would be rigorously adhered to.
ROFL
I'm sure that any protocols the Israeli Army has for use of camera equipment date to prior to digital equipment being available (which has really only been a few years for the level of quality needed for forensic equipment). I'm sure that they followed all protocols, including a nice handwritten sheet of paper for documenting the chain of evidence for all the collected evidence, including tagging it.
Digital time stamps are trivial to change. They do not meet - in any form - the level of security needed for forensic evidence. So, I'm pretty sure that they're ignored, and not subject to any rules about making sure they're set correctly.
-
<<Really, wasn't it you who was saying their entire focus was keeping the black and brown man down?>>
That's very true, but I ALSO said that they could never admit to that, so they had to keep it focused at the more general level of "profligate" spending by an "out of control" Congress. As it now appears, the only "profligate" spending they are concerned with is whatever helps the largely black and brown underclass, not what benefits America's foreign "allies" and helps them to kill American citizens.
Thanks Clarissa, that explains it all.
-
<<I'm sure that any protocols the Israeli Army has for use of camera equipment date to prior to digital equipment being available (which has really only been a few years for the level of quality needed for forensic equipment).>>
Now it's my turn to ROTFLMFAO. Like the protocols of the IDF are only revised once every few years, technological changes be damned. Their cameras are probably bought in batches, after tendering or after submitting specs to their purchasing officers, and the protocols would likely be re-written as new batches of cameras are acquired, if any new technical features would warrant it.
I also have to laugh at your apparent assumption that forensic photography began with the digital camera. That's a real howler. I had cheap Kodaks that printed date and time when my kids were growing up. The same protocols that would have mandated date and time checks at the beginning of each operator's shift wouldn't even have had to change from then to now. It's virtually inconceivable that there wouldn't be an equipment check, or more than one equipment check on a mission as important as this, following comprehensive checklists that would necessarily include checking and rechecking the date and time settings at the start of each session. Especially considering that this is the IDF, one of the most technically proficient armies in the world.
<<I'm sure that they followed all protocols, including a nice handwritten sheet of paper for documenting the chain of evidence for all the collected evidence, including tagging it.>>
Yeah, and I'm sure their recorded chains of evidence are subject to expert doctoring, just like any document they produce. I'd bet that Israeli document forgers are among the best in the world.
<<Digital time stamps are trivial to change. They do not meet - in any form - the level of security needed for forensic evidence. So, I'm pretty sure that they're ignored, and not subject to any rules about making sure they're set correctly.>>
Yeah, that makes lots of sense. Moms and dads all over the world set the time and date stamps for trips to Disney World, but the IDF, taking pictures expressly for forensic usage, wouldn't have state-of-the art settings and wouldn't bother to check them anyway. If only to avoid embarrassments like this one. According to your theory, they shouldn't even bother to take pictures at all, since they too can be faked or doctored, just like the time & date stamps.
-
Sorry, BT, but I don't get the "Clarissa" reference.
-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarissa_Explains_It_All (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarissa_Explains_It_All)
-
Huh. Never heard of her OR the show, but I had heard of Sabrina the Teenage Witch. Interesting. Thanks.
-
Yeah, that makes lots of sense. Moms and dads all over the world set the time and date stamps for trips to Disney World, but the IDF, taking pictures expressly for forensic usage, wouldn't have state-of-the art settings and wouldn't bother to check them anyway. If only to avoid embarrassments like this one. According to your theory, they shouldn't even bother to take pictures at all, since they too can be faked or doctored, just like the time & date stamps.
Yeah, the Israelis are so sophisticated that they would only have state of the art equipment and people specifically trained to make sure the EXIF time stamps are set correctly on every picture they take.
And they have excellent document forgers as well.
And after all that, they were too dumb to use the command line tools that can be downloaded from the Internet for free that allows anyone to change the EXIF time stamps in any digital image.
Here are links to a few. Moms and dads all over the world have access to tools to change the EXIF time stamp, but the IDF, doctoring pictures expressly for propaganda usage, wouldn't have state-of-the art software and wouldn't bother to edit them anyway.
http://jpgtime.learsy.com/ (http://jpgtime.learsy.com/)
http://www.sentex.net/~mwandel/jhead/ (http://www.sentex.net/~mwandel/jhead/)
http://www.brothersoft.com/downloads/date-time-exif-stamp-digital-photo.html (http://www.brothersoft.com/downloads/date-time-exif-stamp-digital-photo.html)
http://www.sharewareconnection.com/software.php?list=Exif+Time+Stamp (http://www.sharewareconnection.com/software.php?list=Exif+Time+Stamp)
-
Hey, look at this! I'm more technologically proficient than the entire Israeli IDF!
The images now have a time stamp after the raid!
Click the image to see it larger, or view it yourself! (http://regex.info/exif.cgi?dummy=on&url=http%3A%2F%2Fmario.silent-tower.org%2F4662343871_184860a674_o.jpg)
-
<Chuckle>
-
hehe....impressive 8)
-
<<Yeah, the Israelis are so sophisticated that they would only have state of the art equipment . . . >>
That's a given. And they probably invented a lot of the state-of-the-art stuff themselves.
<< . . . and people specifically trained to make sure the EXIF time stamps are set correctly on every picture they take.>>
Nope. They just require every operator to check the settings on his equipment when he starts his shift on it. I don't know why you call that "sophisticated." Every fucking cop with a radar is trained to do the same thing. In any hick town in North America. You wanna call that "sophisticated," be my guest.
<<And they have excellent document forgers as well.>>
That's a fact. Got a problem with that?
<<And after all that, they were too dumb to use the command line tools that can be downloaded from the Internet for free that allows anyone to change the EXIF time stamps in any digital image.>>
Nope. Not too dumb. Just too rushed. They had to document phony weapons charges on short notice and they did, but they just forgot to change the time stamps. Shit happens. Look at the murder of 12-year-old Mohammed al-Doura - - http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html (http://www.themodernreligion.com/jihad/sniper.html) The Israelis had to re-invent their initial story TWICE MORE before they finally got it water-tight. They've got plenty of time to draw up and revise endlessly the checklists for equipment handling, but when the shit hits the fan, they have to come up with serviceable bullshit for the bullshit machine as fast as they can, and a little thing (changing the time stamp) just got overlooked. The most elaborate liars will often get tripped up on the simplest inconsistencies.