DebateGate

Bingo.  Whether it was your goal or not, the continued harping as if this all GOP wrong doing, while you ignore the history of Dems doing far much more, yet largely gets a pass, because, hey, they don't advocate living a higher moral & ethical life, so it's really no biggie when they have affairs, when they actually have sex with pages.

Apologies, I should have used some sort of sarcasm indicator with that reply. I wasn't really old enough to condemn anyone in 1983. So, I'm not sure what you want me to do beyond some sort of Star Trek space-time thing. If you've got Doctor Who's phone booth, I'll go back to '83 and condemn that Democrat guy. While I'm there I might make a few sports bets too. Was Microsoft publicly traded then?

My point was made on an individual basis Sirs. You even ask why it isn't looked at in such a manner, then go on to attack someone who does. Perhaps you've answered your own question?

Let me respond another way then.

Why should Israel keep such policies? Why have ritzy suburbs that only have Jewish denizens? Why deny Arab citizens the right to live in those areas?

There are Israelis who clearly agree that such policies are outdated. Barak, for example, attempted to remove some of these restrictions and also invest heavily in the poor Arab regions of Israel during his very short term. So clearly, there is a sentiment there for social justice and equality.

It wouldn't take much pressure from the nation that provides most of the aid to Israel to get more done in that direction. That is my point. Why not make that extra effort? Would it not make sense to show the Arab world that there is more to Israel than segregation and restrictions?

At least you're honest Professor.

Alarming, and sad, but honest.

The problem with your statement is that it is not parallel. We have supposedly learned from our dealings with the Native Americans. We do not systematically refuse to allow them into specific cities. We do not require them to hold a pass or restrict them from certain jobs.

That is not true of Israel.

We did not aid Ian Smith's regime in Southern Rhodesia. Eventually we even came to our senses in South Africa. Why do we support it in Israel?

So, you don't think it is acceptable but is some part of the "growing pains" of an imperfect system.

There seems to be a disagreement then, as Sirs has said that the segregation performed by Israel is their sovereign right and that they are in fact more democratic than the United States due to their Parliamentary political system.

Should the United States support a nation that systematically disenfranchises of a specific group of people?

Would Republicans really vote for Giuliani? Or as a better question, would the Evangelicals really vote for him?

I mean, here is a guy who clearly violated his marriage vows. Lived with a gay couple while he was estranged from his second wife (no, I'm not implying he is gay - but he has supported gay marriage and this would seem to indicate he has no problem with it). He's been ambivalent about abortion.

He's really a Northeastern style Liberal Republican, but has found a lot of support for his crime fighting as mayor and his face time during 9/11.

Also, did Frist's comments about the Taleban in Afghanistan hurt him?

You change your vocabulary to change whatever is currently in vogue, so you essentially bob and weave to whatever terminology is predominant by whomever has currently changed this terminology to suit their political/cultural aims. Weak, my man, weak. Be bold. Stand up for what is true and right, using your own terms, not those used by anothers' agenda.

Example?

Why are you linking democracy with 100% suffrage.

Not once have I done so. I am merely asking the question of whether or not segregationist or apartheid policies as carried out by Israel or formerly by South Africa truly belong to a democratic state. It is up to you as to whether or not you answer "yes" and defend said policies.

If you believe that systematic disenfranchisement of a specific group of people is acceptable in a democratic state, then let's hear you defend it. I'm not the one defining democracy, I'm just asking the question.

So, do you consider a state that enforces segregation to be a democratic state?

Do you deny you succumb to the PC "conspiracy"?

By all means Professor, explain how I have fallen prey to this brilliant conspiracy.

how can a nation be a democracy to all, if it is only a demoracy to a few?

Do you, Professor, regard Israel as a democratic nation?

Has there ever been a democratic nation? I havent ever heard of one with 100% sufferage.

No one here is claiming 100% suffrage to be a democratic state Plane. Yet, should a specific minority be denied rights based solely on their heritage? Should we claim Israel as a democratic state when it clearly has segregation?

Fair?, no.  Their right as a soverign nation?, yes.

So, you support Israel's segregation based on religion? You still consider that democratic? At least you admit it is unfair.

I seem to recall many having good jobs, access to much of what Isreal produces & sells, the freedom to choose where they want to work, live, and do business, which includes the freedom to go elsewhere.

No, they don't have freedom to choose where they wish to live, nor where they wish to work (considerable areas are segregated). Freedom of movement is also restricted. In other words, your recollection is wrong.

Israel is an even greater Democratic country than ours, given the huge amount of political parties involved in the governing process

You keep saying that as if it were something amazing. It is a parliamentary system Sirs. We could have the same here. Why not argue for it? It is nothing miraculous, it is just not FPTP as we use (well, we use a variant of FPTP, though in Presidential elections we use our own bizarre elitist system). The ability to manipulate Parliamentary politics to favour an outcome is easily documented in history. Giving the Arabs a party is nothing spectacular. Sinn Fein has a party in Northern Ireland as well, it doesn't make segregation and disenfranchisement an impossibility.

If there weren't such an overt Anti-semetic bias within the Palestinian and Arab nations

So what? Other nations have no meaning in Israel proper. Does denying Arabs within Israel rights make them more likely to be good Israeli citizens and have more generous attitudes towards Judaism? These are, after all, descendants of Arabs who did not take up arms against the Israelis in 1948 and instead chose co-existance.

Basically, you are saying segregation and restriction are suitable answers to anti-semitic feelings. Even such non-violent attitudes. I wonder if you'd prescribe the same for the United States.