Turkey Lawmakers OK Possible Iraq Attack

[Richpo64]

>>But what is the benefit acrued from spraying this onto the face of the Turkish people right now?<<

The benefit is that it helps the Democrats hurt the United States of course. it further jeopardizes American civilians and American military in the region. There's no other reason.

[_JS]

Oh, the timing is obviously political, but that doesn't make the resolution any less true or necessary.

Tell me about what makes this necessary.

It is necessary to ensure that Turkey comes to terms with its history and to better understand genocide. Someone earlier spoke of Turkish democracy, is it really a democracy when Turks who speak out on behalf of the Armenians are removed from positions of importance?

Why all of this fear of Turkey all of a sudden? It is a simple, non-binding resolution. It has been considered before. Why allow Turkey to play hysterics and get their way?

[Plane]

Oh, the timing is obviously political, but that doesn't make the resolution any less true or necessary.

Tell me about what makes this necessary.

It is necessary to ensure that Turkey comes to terms with its history and to better understand genocide. Someone earlier spoke of Turkish democracy, is it really a democracy when Turks who speak out on behalf of the Armenians are removed from positions of importance?

Why all of this fear of Turkey all of a sudden? It is a simple, non-binding resolution. It has been considered before. Why allow Turkey to play hysterics and get their way?

   It has been considered before and rejected before for the same resons it should be rejected now. Turkey has been a lot of help to us in opposition to the USSR and they are critical in the same way to our fight in Iraq.

    It is the Turkish people who will feel insulted and they are more democratic now than ever , a Referendum recently reversed the Turkish governments plan to support the overthrow of Saddam , it may be good that they are becomeing more and more democratic but it makes it more and more problematic to insult the people at large as they do.

     Imagine that the year was about 1917 and an otherwise allied England criticised George Washington , Thomas Jefferson , James Polk for being mean to Indians and owning slaves , it could be the truth and still foolish to say.

[_JS]

Being mean to Indians and owning slaves is not on the same level as genocide, and you know it Plane. That is a dishonest comparison.

Turkey helped us against the USSR. So what? We've excused Suharto's murdering, Pinochet's murdering, Saddam Hussein's murdering, a host of South Korean dictator's murdering, Chiang Kai-Shek's murdering, the Peron's murdering, Somoza's murdering, the Shah's murdering, and dozens of other tin pot dictators who wouldn't look at you twice before they had their goons shoot you in the head...

When do we stop excusing them because they helped us?

No. You tell the Germans and Israelis that the Holocaust doesn't really matter and I'll believe your sincerity. Otherwise, we're giving Turkey an excuse because they are our pals and pragmatism needs to prevail.

But really, they are throwing their toys from the pram and you all want to reward them for it.

[BT]

It is necessary to ensure that Turkey comes to terms with its history and to better understand genocide.

How does a nonbinding congressional resolution do that?

[Xavier_Onassis]

 There's no other reason.

Well, yes there is.

Campaign contributions from wealthy Armenians are a MAJOR factor here.

It is always the wrong time to do the right thing.

There is always a wrong reason to do the right thing as well.

The Democrats do not intend this to cause harm to US troops.

[Christians4LessGvt]

[Michael Tee]

<<Just Satan condemns the only Democracy in the Middle East with his lies and distortions. All Israelis vote. Jews, Christians, Muslims, all have the same rights in Israel.>>

More fucking lies and bullshit from AIPAC and the rest of the Israel Lobby.  Thanks Rich and thank "the only Democracy in the Middle East" ROTFLMFAO if you will excuse me - - How many Palestinians vote in the West Bank and Gaza, moron, and what good do their votes do them under military occupation for FORTY YEARS in the face of at least 60 UN resolutions?  They can vote for a Palestinian government which can't do jack-shit about the conditions they live under, the army that plows their crops under and bulldozes their homes and orchards and murders their children and wives and jails and tortures their young men and women.  Yeah, that is some "Democracy" the only democracy in the Middle East.  You are full of shit, my friend, and I think at some level you must realize that yourself.

<< If not for the attempted genocide of Just Satan and his kind there would be peace.>>

There is no attempted genocide.  There was no attempted genocide.  Driving an intruder and his army off your land is not genocide, bullshit artist.  Fighting back against a lying, stealing bunch of bastards who settle on your land while pretending to negotiate how they will give it back to you once you lay down your arms and stop fighting them  is not genocide, Mr. Lying Mouthpiece of the Israel Lobby. 

<<Remember, God has protected Israel from these monsters since they returned to their land. >>

What YOU better remember, asshole, is that if God exists, he  has punished the Jews before when they didn't do right and he won't hesitate to do it again if they continue with their lies and their bullshit, their dispossession of other people and the torture and murder of their families. 

<<JS and his people have tried to exterminate them, men women and children and failed.>>

Full of shit again.  Another fucking lie.  You and the Israel Lobby you represent will make up any fucking lie you like, slander anyone, to protect the murderous, lying Zionists who have suckered the U.S.A. into supporting their criminal actions, to their huge detriment which the poor dumb fucks are just now starting to realize.  JS has obviously had nothing to do with the extermination of the Jews and there probably isn't one single member of this group apart from you who believes otherwise.  You are a lying piece of shit. 

<<. Peace isn't their objective, death is. >>

You got that right, dickhead.  They'd rather die fighting for their land than surrender it without a fight to people who came from all over the world to steal it from them.

<<These are the monsters Just Satan supports.>>

Hamas and Hezbollah are not monsters, they're courageously fighting for their land and their homes against invaders and occupiers.  JS can speak for himself as to whether he supports them or not, but you lying bastards have had your own way for far too long in defining the terms of the debate.  They're one side of a vicious struggle for land and the IDF and the Likud and Labour Parties of Israel are the other side.  AIPAC and the Israel Lobby know that the only hope they have of ensuring future American help for their criminal occupation of the West Bank, their apartheid wall and their continuing crimes and atrocities against the Palestinians is to demonize the Palestinians and those who fight for their rights.  So far as AIPAC and and the Israel Lobby are concerned, you're doing a great job here, Rich.  So far as the American people are concerned, you're fucking them right up the ass, spinning your lies and bullshit and contributing in your own small way to the web of lies and bullshit that they have blanketed the whole country with, to keep them on the wrong track as long as you and the Lobby can pull it off, each single day that they stay on it being priceless to Israel, but costing America dearly in blood and treasure.

<<These useful idiots are simply that. They have no idea what the truth is because they refuse to see it, or their hearts have been hardend by evil people who evil guides. There is no truth in these people, just evil and lies.>>

Thanks.  You just gave a dead-on capsule description of yourself, AIPAC  and the Israel Lobby.  Well done.

[Plane]

Being mean to Indians and owning slaves is not on the same level as genocide, and you know it Plane.

You don't think so?

Every now and then it did.

Perhaps it is necessary , that people appreaciate the weight of their historys that brought them to the present ,but why we have to preach to Turks about the mote in their eye....

[Christians4LessGvt]

re: but why we have to preach to Turks about the mote in their eye....

because their politcial agenda desires an american defeat

[Plane]

The Democrats do not intend this to cause harm to US troops.

If it does as much harm as predicted they may have to prove that they were ignorant .


Of course that isn't really hard.

[Henny]

<<Just Satan condemns the only Democracy in the Middle East with his lies and distortions. All Israelis vote. Jews, Christians, Muslims, all have the same rights in Israel.>>

More fucking lies and bullshit from AIPAC and the rest of the Israel Lobby.  Thanks Rich and thank "the only Democracy in the Middle East" ROTFLMFAO if you will excuse me - - How many Palestinians vote in the West Bank and Gaza, moron, and what good do their votes do them under military occupation for FORTY YEARS in the face of at least 60 UN resolutions?  They can vote for a Palestinian government which can't do jack-shit about the conditions they live under, the army that plows their crops under and bulldozes their homes and orchards and murders their children and wives and jails and tortures their young men and women.  Yeah, that is some "Democracy" the only democracy in the Middle East.  You are full of shit, my friend, and I think at some level you must realize that yourself.

Damn, I totally missed this.

Christians and Muslims DO NOT have the same rights in Israel. They can't be citizens of Israel, therefore, they cannot vote.

[Michael Tee]

<<Christians and Muslims DO NOT have the same rights in Israel. They can't be citizens of Israel, therefore, they cannot vote.>>

That's just not correct.  There are Christian and Muslim citizens of Israel and they have full rights of citizenship, except as to serving in the military.  They not only can vote, they can be elected to the Knesset (Israeli parliament) and there are Muslim members sitting as we speak.  It is the Arabs in the West Bank who have no citizenship rights, whose land is being stolen right out from under them.

I believe there are restrictions on serving in the IDF (military.)  Muslims aren't obliged to serve and I'm not sure if they can or not, even if they want to.   I don't think they can be in the army.  I don't see any reasons why Christians can't serve in the Israeli military.  The ones I know from the region, most of them anyway, hate Muslims with a passion.   The army makes exceptions made for Bedouin men, because they have no prior commitment to any other state, and also the Druze, who are some kind of weird religious group with some Muslim elements to their religion. 

You may have confused the Right of Return with citizenship rights.  Jews from all over the world can come to Israel and become instant citizens just by proving that they're Jews.  Anyone else who wants to become an Israeli citizen, fuhgeddabowdit. 

[Henny]

<<Christians and Muslims DO NOT have the same rights in Israel. They can't be citizens of Israel, therefore, they cannot vote.>>

That's just not correct.  There are Christian and Muslim citizens of Israel and they have full rights of citizenship, except as to serving in the military.  They not only can vote, they can be elected to the Knesset (Israeli parliament) and there are Muslim members sitting as we speak.  It is the Arabs in the West Bank who have no citizenship rights, whose land is being stolen right out from under them.

I believe there are restrictions on serving in the IDF (military.)  Muslims aren't obliged to serve and I'm not sure if they can or not, even if they want to.   I don't think they can be in the army.  I don't see any reasons why Christians can't serve in the Israeli military.  The ones I know from the region, most of them anyway, hate Muslims with a passion.   The army makes exceptions made for Bedouin men, because they have no prior commitment to any other state, and also the Druze, who are some kind of weird religious group with some Muslim elements to their religion. 

You may have confused the Right of Return with citizenship rights.  Jews from all over the world can come to Israel and become instant citizens just by proving that they're Jews.  Anyone else who wants to become an Israeli citizen, fuhgeddabowdit. 

Thanks for the info MT - I had no idea.

[Michael Tee]

My pleasure, Henny.  I admire the way you are dealing with Rich's lies and bullshit.  The surest way for evil to triumph is when good men (and women) remain silent.