Author Topic: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?  (Read 2299 times)

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Stray Pooch

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What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« on: May 24, 2008, 02:40:41 PM »
Hillary Clinton mentioned Kennedy's assassination as an example (perhaps an unfortunate one) of a LONG campaign.  She wasn't wishfully thinking about someone taking out Barak in the late stages.  She was pointing out that it happened in JUNE - that's later than it is now.   Her entire point (and she used other examples as well) was that this long campaign is NOT an anomaly and that she might still win the nomination (however unlikely that is).

Sometimes the rush to make a sound-bite worthy gaffe leads to this sort of silliness.  It's like "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED" which was obviously only a message to the sailors on the boat but the left blew it into a premature declaration of victory.  There are a million other examples, but they are all the same.  Hillary said something that, at worst, might have been a poor choice of examples.  It was obviously not disrespectful or threatening or any of the other ridiculous interpretation.  It pisses me off to have to defend HRC, since I have little respect for her and don't trust her any farther than I can throw her.  But she is not guilty of anything here.  This is just another case of the media making news where there is none, aided, no doubt, by the Obama campaign.

The only difference between politics and "professional" wrestling is that occasionally wrestlers tell the truth.
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fatman

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2008, 02:42:57 PM »
I'm in total agreement Pooch, yet again the media takes something out of context and distorts it into something that it was never intended to be.  Intent should be considered when reporting these stories.

BT

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2008, 02:44:49 PM »
truth hasn't mattered for ages.

Brassmask

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2008, 03:03:20 PM »
If you'll all be honest with yourselves, you'll come to realize that the 1968 primaries were sort of delayed because it was assumed that LBJ would handily defeat any opposing candidates for the nomination but then Eugene McCarthy ran an anti-war campaign.  When the votes were tallied in New Hampshire on March 12th, McCarthy came very close to LBJ.

To McCarthy's chagrin, RFK then declared on March 16th, so clearly he was very late to the race.  (According to Wiki, Hubert Humphrey sat in the wings during all this expecting party bosses to just hand him the nomination.)

One would have to be Evel Kneivel to make the leap of comparing THIS year's campaign (which seems to have been going on for nearly two years or so) to the 1968 campaign which might have gone on slightly longer had RFK not been cut down in that hotel hallway.

The outrage over what she said was that she had to use '92 and the tenuous example of 1968 (with the assassination being part of the ending of the primary) in order to support her extremely tenuous point that primaries drag on.

Personally, I think it was a Freudian slip.  (Please no harangues on the "true definition of Freudian slip" if it means anything other than the generally accepted definition of it.)  That had to have been said before by her or someone on her staff.  And it was just wildly inappropriate.

Stray Pooch

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2008, 03:09:37 PM »
If you'll all be honest with yourselves, you'll come to realize that the 1968 primaries were sort of delayed because it was assumed that LBJ would handily defeat any opposing candidates for the nomination but then Eugene McCarthy ran an anti-war campaign.  When the votes were tallied in New Hampshire on March 12th, McCarthy came very close to LBJ.

To McCarthy's chagrin, RFK then declared on March 16th, so clearly he was very late to the race.  (According to Wiki, Hubert Humphrey sat in the wings during all this expecting party bosses to just hand him the nomination.)

One would have to be Evel Kneivel to make the leap of comparing THIS year's campaign (which seems to have been going on for nearly two years or so) to the 1968 campaign which might have gone on slightly longer had RFK not been cut down in that hotel hallway.

The outrage over what she said was that she had to use '92 and the tenuous example of 1968 (with the assassination being part of the ending of the primary) in order to support her extremely tenuous point that primaries drag on.

Personally, I think it was a Freudian slip.  (Please no harangues on the "true definition of Freudian slip" if it means anything other than the generally accepted definition of it.)  That had to have been said before by her or someone on her staff.  And it was just wildly inappropriate.

Your analysis of the comparison is all well and good (and indeed, it really is quite good).  Fred Thompson tried to use just the same sort of logic to explain why he waited so long to get in the race.  We see how well that played.  But I still see nothing wrong, other than just poor reasoning, with the comment she made.  It wasn't wildly inappropriate.  It was just unfortunate that it was something which could be overdramatized by the media and her opposition.
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sirs

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2008, 03:17:54 PM »
The only difference between politics and "professional" wrestling is that occasionally wrestlers tell the truth.

touche', Pooch       ;D
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Brassmask

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2008, 03:21:47 PM »
Your analysis of the comparison is all well and good (and indeed, it really is quite good).  Fred Thompson tried to use just the same sort of logic to explain why he waited so long to get in the race.  We see how well that played.  But I still see nothing wrong, other than just poor reasoning, with the comment she made.  It wasn't wildly inappropriate.  It was just unfortunate that it was something which could be overdramatized by the media and her opposition.

True, it was poor reasoning, I agree.  We simply disagree on the degree of "poor".  (I like to believe that I have left my bias against Hillary in favor of Obama of it but it may influence it still.  Fair enough?)

Stray Pooch

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2008, 03:47:00 PM »
Fair enough?

Indeed so.  I did enjoy your retrospective analysis of that '68 election.  I had forgotten (because I was, only 10, after all) how wild that race was.  Thanks for that.
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Christians4LessGvt

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2008, 04:29:34 PM »
i think it has to do with what everyone knows
ok, maybe not everyone
but alot of people honestly think Hillary Clinton is one ruthless human being
of course it's speculation
but honestly
does anyone really think
Hillary Clinton would be sincerely upset to the core if some nut
knocked off Obama and allowed her to become President?

sure there are some that think she would just be so so sad
actually i think she might be sad, but not that sad
there are many that think she would be more than happy to be the stand-in

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Brassmask

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2008, 05:39:38 PM »
i think it has to do with what everyone knows
ok, maybe not everyone
but alot of people honestly think Hillary Clinton is one ruthless human being
of course it's speculation
but honestly
does anyone really think
Hillary Clinton would be sincerely upset to the core if some nut
knocked off Obama and allowed her to become President?

sure there are some that think she would just be so so sad
actually i think she might be sad, but not that sad
there are many that think she would be more than happy to be the stand-in

These are the lightbulbs I was talking about.

Lanya

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2008, 09:54:15 PM »
I read it and watched the YouTube of her saying this, and I thought  how memorable those days were. 

i don't think she meant anything bad by it.

I also think her campaign is toast now.  Dean Scream toast (I never got the Dean Scream thing, either).












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Christians4LessGvt

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2008, 10:17:50 PM »
These are the lightbulbs I was talking about.

can you explain?
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Brassmask

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2008, 12:45:25 AM »
These are the lightbulbs I was talking about.

can you explain?

I can't remember if it was this thread or the other one where I mentioned that when Hillary says something like her RFK comment, "lightbulbs" start going off in some peoples' heads.  Meaning that people start thinking about how she is one of most hardcore politicians and how she is supposedly capable of "anything" if it means she might lose if she doesn't resort to "anything".

At the time, I was thinking like over the top stuff like the Clinton "death list".

Plane

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2008, 01:34:22 AM »
These are the lightbulbs I was talking about.

can you explain?

I can't remember if it was this thread or the other one where I mentioned that when Hillary says something like her RFK comment, "lightbulbs" start going off in some peoples' heads.  Meaning that people start thinking about how she is one of most hardcore politicians and how she is supposedly capable of "anything" if it means she might lose if she doesn't resort to "anything".

At the time, I was thinking like over the top stuff like the Clinton "death list".

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp

Plane

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Re: What is so wrong with what Hillary said?
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2008, 02:24:21 AM »
Quote
Hillary Clinton: "My husband did not wrap up the nomination in 1992 until he won the California primary somewhere in the middle of June, right? We all remember Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June in California. I don't understand it."

What a remarkably wrong-headed paragraph. The formerly inevitable Clinton got into obvious trouble for her assassination comment. (And is now trying desperately to spin her way out. Lotsa luck.) But the sentence before it is totally wrong as well, as I can tell you that the Clintons knew that they would have no trouble in the 1992 California primary.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-bradley/the-other-big-problem-wit_b_103478.html