Author Topic: Racism  (Read 9244 times)

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_JS

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Racism
« on: January 25, 2007, 11:09:18 AM »
I feel like the Cohen story probably did not get a fair hearing the other day and that it was definitely my fault. For that I apologise.

I don't apologise for my stance on the Israeli government. I'm crystal clear on that, but I think there were some good places for that topic to go and I did stifle it to make a different point.

I'd like to hear Brass' view on racism in Memphis and Sir's view on the topic in general, or specific view on the Cohen and Black Caucus issue. I'll refrain from comment if necessary or just post my points in the confines of what you all write this time.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2007, 03:53:47 PM »
I'd like to hear Brass' view on racism in Memphis and Sir's view on the topic in general, or specific view on the Cohen and Black Caucus issue. I'll refrain from comment if necessary or just post my points in the confines of what you all write this time.

My apologies, in that I haven't gotten back to this question.  I will attempt to address it later today, if possible, as it does require more time than just a quick glance & response
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2007, 11:18:05 PM »
I feel like the Cohen story probably did not get a fair hearing the other day and that it was definitely my fault. For that I apologize.....I'd like to hear Brass' view on racism in Memphis and Sir's view on the topic in general, or specific view on the Cohen and Black Caucus issue.

Boy, oh boy, where to start.  Let's go general and work toward specific.  Does racism still exist in America?, absolutely.  Is it still a problem?  Depends on how one defines "problem".  Is it this rampant out of control problem that the likes of Sharpton & JJ would have you to believe?  Of course not.  Is it a problem that saturates the South and the GOP as Tee would have you believe?  Obviously not.  Is it a problem that still manifests itself thru-out the country, with stealth like efforts at discrimination based purely on race?, yea, that still happens in some places.  Is it a problem where folks of a particular skin color are attacked based purely on that skin color?  Most certainly.

Which allows me to transition to, as a country, what have we decided to accept as it relates to racism.  You see, it sure does appear from this angle that white on Black racism is routinely and universally condemned....specifically when it's demonstrated to be a blatant racist act vs some idiotic slip of the tongue.  But boy, when it's Black on White, no matter how transparent or blatant it is, it sure seems to get a pass.  And noting how much more pervasive that is, tend to make me think that because it is so much more pervasive, that literal saturation has dulled the rest of the folks and media into downplaying it, if even reporting it in the 1st place.  I'll give you 2 prime examples...The Duke Rape case and the Long Beach Halloween Beating

The Duke Rape case was getting massive national coverage.  Poor black girl (apparently having to work as stripper to pay ends meat) accuses a bunch of supposed rich white kids of being raped.  Before the investigation even got out of the front door, you had legions of Black activists, followed in close toe by the mainscream media, howling at how justice must prevail (translated...hang them racist ivy league rich white boys).  Then a funny thing....the facts started coming out, leading to what we pretty much have now, no DNA evidence, no direct evidence, contrary eye-witness testimony, and physical evidence demonstrating other people's DNA, none belonging to the Duke boys.  But boy oh boy, did we have a ton of accusations and innuendo of a racially motivated rape, that was getting pretty much national attention

The Long Beach Halloween beating.......you ask what?  Precisely  Possibly very few of you have gotten wind of this one.  The verdict just came down today  9 youths convicted  3 White women were walking along, and brutally attacked by a throng of black kids.  As many as 40 were involved, and pretty much facilitated by the skin color of the 3 women.  You didn't have the chorus of black activists coming to these youths' defense, probably because of how blatant a hate crime this was.  Instead the defense seemed to be that these women accused the wrong black youths, that there were so many they couldn't possibly have picked the right ones.  Obviously the evidence, testimony and Judge disagreed.  So here we have an actual conviction of a hate crime.  Have you heard anything about it?  Have you seen it broadcast anywhere on the mainscream media?  And I won't even go to how the LA Times was reporting this story, before this conviction came down.  It would have made a rational mind nauseous in how PC they were being.

The point being, this reverse policy of accepting racist activity when it happens to be Black on what-ever, is really pathetic.  Racism is Racism.  Wrong is wrong.  Reverse Discrimination is still discrimination.  Blacks were beyond horrendously abused during the early part of this country.  Does that wrong translate into allowing modern day wrongs slide?  Are blacks now immune from acting racist, because of their skin color? because they "earned the right" to be racist, because of how their ancestors were treated?  MLK would be rolling in his grave if he saw what a mutation of his message on equality, it had become, at the hands of folks like Sharpton, JJ, Maxine Waters, John Conyers, Sheila Jacskon Lee, Donna Brazille, and organizations like the NAACP.

Which takes this rant full circle to the Congressional Black Caucus.  We even have folks on the left, such as Brass conceding that their actions of not accepting anyone unless they're Black, as racist.  I have a theory.  When a Black Republican tried to join a while back, he was prevented, then inhibited, but finally accepted.  Of course at that point, the caucus suddenly required sub committies, so you then had the Democrat Black Caucus, and the Republican Black Caucus.  So basically the GOP member got to caucus with himself.  Perhaps the Dems didn't want to pass on policy ideas that the GOP member could provide to the opposing party.  OK, I'll buy that.  Now here comes new congressman Cohen.  A white fella, elected in a predominantly black district, who's chief of staff is black, who supports nearly all the black "causes", and wants to add to the dialog and idea suggesting, by wishing to join.  He's told no.  I can understand why the Black Republican was blocked off, but why a white liberal democrat, supportive of nearly all their issues, and from a predominantly black district?  Here's my theory, that has absolutely no evidence what-so-ever, but chalk full of logic.  My guess is that at these meetings, they likely trash "white people" up and down their rows.  My guess it's stuff as egregious as what you'd hear at a KKK rally, but within the sound proof confines of Democratic Black Caucus meeting room.  Just a theory though, but it makes sense to me.

And I won't even go into if if they receive Federal funds or not.  If they did, it shows just how big of hypocrites they are, to match their racism.  Demanding that private organizations accept whomever wants to join, especially if their black, or gay, or female, or especially all 3, but the Democratic Black Caucus gets a pass on that one.  But if they don't receive any federal funding, and are largely a private organization within the democrat party, then they remain simply racists.  Not that that will get any attention of course.  Black on what-ever racism is largely accepted, right?

So endeth my rant.  I realize this was far more than anyone wished to read, and for those who actually took the time to do so, my sincere appreciation    8)
« Last Edit: January 26, 2007, 11:28:18 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2007, 11:45:26 AM »
Just so you knew Js (& Brass), I did respond to your question, when I had more time.  Though I apologise for being a tad verbose
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

_JS

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Re: Racism
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2007, 12:03:57 PM »
I don't necessarily disagree with your assesment Sirs, but I think you have a short-term memory for these incidents.

What about Abner Louima, Amadou Bailo Diallo, Gidone Busch, Ousmane Zongo, Sean Bell, Rodney King, Martin Lee Anderson, Robert Davis, Johnny Gammage...etc?

Yeah, sometimes police officers were punished, sometimes acquitted, sometimes promoted. Then you have actions like the New York City Blackout Riots in the late 70's or the Katrina aftermath and you don't expect African-American communities to feel some resentment?

You should have read some of the letters to the editor that I read after Katrina. Some of them lacked any human compassion and basically said it was their fault, tough. It is possible that you're right about so-called "reverse discrimination" being more acceptable an that is not appropriate. Yet, I don't think we are as far along in racial relations as you seem to imply.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2007, 01:24:51 PM »
What about Abner Louima, Amadou Bailo Diallo, Gidone Busch, Ousmane Zongo, Sean Bell, Rodney King, Martin Lee Anderson, Robert Davis, Johnny Gammage...etc?  Yeah, sometimes police officers were punished, sometimes acquitted, sometimes promoted. Then you have actions like the New York City Blackout Riots in the late 70's or the Katrina aftermath and you don't expect African-American communities to feel some resentment?

Are you trying to condone racist actions because someone might "feel" resentment??  How does any of the above give a pass to Black-on-whatever racism??


You should have read some of the letters to the editor that I read after Katrina. Some of them lacked any human compassion and basically said it was their fault, tough. It is possible that you're right about so-called "reverse discrimination" being more acceptable an that is not appropriate. Yet, I don't think we are as far along in racial relations as you seem to imply.

With all due respect Js, I'm not sure how that refutes my point and assessments I made previously, regarding this subject, especially as it relates to the congressional Black Caucus.  Are you trying to rationalize why it's ok for Blacks to act racist?
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

_JS

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Re: Racism
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2007, 01:35:12 PM »
No, of course I'm not condoning any form of racist actions. My point is that your first paragraph seems to minimize racism as an important issue. In fact, the thesis of your post seems to be that reverse discrimination is the invisible problem permeating society. My point was to suggest that perhaps genuine racism (against non-whites) is still a major issue.

But we could discuss this in-depth and branch out in many different directions (I don't want to veer too far off course). Truth be told, there are a great number of accepted bigotries in this country.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

BT

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Re: Racism
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2007, 01:40:14 PM »
Define racism.

Specifically in regards to the Katrina aftermath.

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2007, 01:48:55 PM »
No, of course I'm not condoning any form of racist actions. My point is that your first paragraph seems to minimize racism as an important issue.

No, my 1st paragraph was to indicate that Racism isn't this out-of-control monster like it was in the early part of this country's existance, as folks like JJ, Sharpton, and the NAACP would have us believe.  In fact I made it very clear that it still occurs, and occurs everywhere in this country, just not to the hyperbolic levels some would argue.  Might not even make the top10 of areas we could target as "major problems" in this country


In fact, the thesis of your post seems to be that reverse discrimination is the invisible problem permeating society. My point was to suggest that perhaps genuine racism (against non-whites) is still a major issue.

Close.  The thesis is that ALL RACISM is an issue that should be dealt with.  Simply that some racism, White on Black is apparently treated with much more disdain, than Black on whatever.  And I'd argue that examples of the latter far outwiegh the former.  The congressional Black Caucus for instance continues to function with little peep of condemnation from the media or the left


But we could discuss this in-depth and branch out in many different directions (I don't want to veer too far off course). Truth be told, there are a great number of accepted bigotries in this country.

Agreed.  Though as you may have gathered from my original answer to your query, I've already gone into a fair amount of detailed commentary
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

_JS

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Re: Racism
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2007, 01:54:56 PM »
Bt, I don't believe I said the aftermath to Katrina was racist, but there was a feeling of resentment from some in the black community, don't you agree?

That is fair Sirs. I think you may mischaracterize the media though, you could be correct on the sheer number of racist events (I have no idea and imagine it would depend on how you define "racist event") but you must admit that a case of an unarmed minority individual being riddled with bullets by police is always going to make more news than a Congressional caucus decision. That is more the nature of selling copy than forcing any specific view onto anyone.

I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

sirs

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Re: Racism
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2007, 02:49:15 PM »
That is fair Sirs. I think you may mischaracterize the media though, .... you must admit that a case of an unarmed minority individual being riddled with bullets by police is always going to make more news than a Congressional caucus decision. That is more the nature of selling copy than forcing any specific view onto anyone.

Racism is Racism.  And acts that are in no way conclusive as racist ought not be cofused with acts that are blatantly racist
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

kimba1

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Re: Racism
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2007, 03:01:22 PM »
I think racism is too mutilated a word nowadays
ex. reverse racism
it`s the very same act ,but with switched roles
it really should treated the same,but it`s not
in california there are towns trying to be hispanic only
but it`s called protecting culture not racist.
too bad we can`t say bigoted
it just don`t have the same kick anymore.
we need a more broader word
like a$$h0!e or something

BT

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Re: Racism
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2007, 03:07:50 PM »
Quote
Bt, I don't believe I said the aftermath to Katrina was racist, but there was a feeling of resentment from some in the black community, don't you agree?

You included it in your list of racist acts. Thus my request for your definition.

domer

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Re: Racism
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2007, 03:10:02 PM »
I would prefer that this type of discussion be cast in terms of "social relations" rather than "racism," a construct more focused and less charged and broad enough to encompass all matters of race and the like.

Plane

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Re: Racism
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2007, 03:15:41 PM »
Quote
You should have read some of the letters to the editor that I read after Katrina. Some of them lacked any human compassion and basically said it was their fault, tough. It is possible that you're right about so-called "reverse discrimination" being more acceptable an that is not appropriate. Yet, I don't think we are as far along in racial relations as you seem to imply. 



I beleive that we can be reasonably certain that a storm feels no racism , just because more White people drowned than Black ones or that more Black people were rescued by the Coast Guard than White ones proves no racism.

But is racism proved in the opinions of people who are convinced that a storm had a racial preference?