Author Topic: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears  (Read 1757 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Religious Dick

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1153
  • Drunk, drunk, drunk in the gardens and the graves
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« on: September 30, 2012, 02:42:43 AM »
Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
By David Goodhart

Steven Van Riel, Labour's director of policy at the last election, recommends that if party activists travelling to their annual conference in Manchester on Sunday want to read something truly frightening, they should bring the annual survey of what their fellow citizens think.

He is right, especially when it comes to attitudes about welfare. The latest British Social Attitudes survey  spells out in agonising detail the collapse in support over the past decade or so for social security spending and what might be called poor peoples' welfare.

There is still strong support for the National Health Service and even a slight upward blip in the number of people calling for an increase in tax and spend. But whereas in previous recessions sympathy for the poor and jobless rose, this time it has continued its inexorable march downwards.

In 1991 58 per cent of Britons agreed that government should spend more on benefits even if it led to higher taxes. That figure is now down to 28 per cent. More than half believe people would "stand on their own two feet" if benefits were less generous, with only 20 per cent disagreeing. In 1993 the responses were almost exactly the reverse.

According to a YouGov poll this year for Prospect magazine  74 per cent of voters agreed that welfare payment levels should be cut. The less well-off were almost as hostile as the rich. Labour voters supported reduction by a large majority.

This narrowing of sympathy ought to benefit the Conservatives. But they too are grappling with their own welfare problem - the huge Welfare Reform Act introduced by Iain Duncan Smith, the work and pensions secretary.

But what is at the root of this apparent decline in social solidarity since the early 1990s' The "scroungers" who abuse the system have always been unpopular and their number has always been exaggerated - fraud has been in sharp decline in recent years.

More significant, changes in society and in welfare have created a greater social distance between middle Britain and the typical social security recipient. As people have grown richer the Beveridge ideal of a social security system that all citizens feel part of has given way to a residual system for the poor.

Instead of unemployment being a temporary misfortune that could befall anyone, it is increasingly associated with people in the old industrial regions who have lost the work ethic or inner city youths who never acquired it. As in America many recipients of welfare have become more like a separate caste.

Such social distance does not matter so much when a welfare system is heavily insurance-based, as it is in much of Europe and used to be in Britain. You don?t need a moral consensus when there is a clear link between what you pay in and what you get out.

But social security in Britain has become increasingly "non-contributory": paid for out of general taxation. This has happened at a time of declining trust among citizens. When life experiences and values become more diverse, it becomes harder to assume that other people will have the same attitudes to work and welfare that you do.

Meanwhile the system has grown much bigger. Last year we spent almost ?200bn on benefits and pensions, 40 per cent more in real terms than in 1999. Housing benefit and disability benefit - benefits that barely existed 30 years ago - pay out about ?20bn each a year.

As welfare has expanded it has grown away from peoples' moral intuitions. The average taxpayer thinks that too many people are getting something for nothing. But then if they need the system, they find that they get nothing for something. You may have paid national insurance for 25 years but if you lose your job you qualify for jobseekers? allowance for just six months at  ?67.50 a week, after that if you have ?16,000 or more of savings you get nothing.

In a recent focus group on welfare reform organised by Demos, my think-tank, a librarian called Philip reported that when he was made redundant he spent his savings on a car so that he would qualify to get his mortgage paid and other benefits.

We are asking our battered and unloved social security system to do too many conflicting things: to provide a decent standard of living for the genuinely needy and unlucky without damaging incentives to work or save or costing too much, or offending peoples? sense of fairness.

The Tory reform has failed to square these various circles. It has introduced some caps on benefit that are popular. And from next year it is also planning to simplify the system by rolling up six different means-tested benefits into one universal credit, though this requires an ambitious computer system to function properly.

However, the Tory reform is no more contributory than the current system and at various points penalises savers - Philip will still have an incentive to buy a car.

Making a system more contributory is much easier said than done. It did not grow less contributory by accident but rather because of the end of full employment, the fact that many women work only intermittently and less caring was done within extended families. To penalise those groups that find it hard to contribute would require a degree of ruthlessness foreign to modern politics.

The alternative of paying extra to those who have contributed more is a more realistic option. Labour, which also grappled unsuccessfully with welfare problems when in office, talks about rewarding good behaviour - or those who work, care and save - and increasing the employment rate for women and young people to expand the tax base and therefore to make welfare more affordable.

But the reality is that as societies get richer and more diverse the public welfare system will inevitably become more fragmented and more residual. The clever people in all parties who care about preserving some aspects of social solidarity and redistribution in the system should be thinking about how best to combine state and private insurance - in salary protection schemes, for example - that provide the security middle-income voters want at tax levels they can bear.

The writer is director of the think-tank Demos and editor at large of Prospect

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/034b4d28-089b-11e2-b57f-00144feabdc0.html#axzz27sxQz6f8
« Last Edit: September 30, 2012, 02:51:15 AM by Religious Dick »
I speak of civil, social man under law, and no other.
-Sir Edmund Burke

Christians4LessGvt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11139
    • View Profile
    • "The Religion Of Peace"
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #1 on: September 30, 2012, 01:47:49 PM »
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #2 on: September 30, 2012, 06:22:14 PM »
I am all for the British settling their own social issues among themselves.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2012, 09:02:21 PM »
There is a point to consider.

English medicine is several steps down the path we are starting, if they find it unsupportable , won't we?

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2012, 11:13:55 PM »
The British have shown no desire whatever to revoke NHS. Everyone is covered, and they live as long ort longer than we do.

British welfare is a different entity, and the quoted a
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2012, 11:17:54 PM »
The British NHS is quite popular and there is no serious movement to replace or abolish it.

This right wing article is about the welfare system, a different program.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2012, 01:19:09 AM »
Quote
The health minister, Norman Lamb, said it would be madness for Labour to repeal the coalition's Health and Social Care Act: "To say repeal the act, effectively, is telling the NHS we're going to go through another complete restructuring. It would be madness to do that."

Ok it is seaprate, but I think it relates because it is one of the ropes in their tug of war.

The recent restructureing of the NHS did not change it into something new, and the Labor party might just change it back anyway, if that wins them enough support to controll.

But if there is not enough hay to go around , the heard of sacred cows will have to be thinned.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2012, 12:07:58 PM »
But if there is not enough hay to go around , the heard of sacred cows will have to be thinned.

=================================================\
Helping people to avoid starvation and eviction is NOT a "sacred cow".

In the UK, support for the Church of England is the sacred cow.

The British can figure out how to best spend their resources without US help.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2012, 09:26:50 PM »
But if there is not enough hay to go around , the heard of sacred cows will have to be thinned.

=================================================\
Helping people to avoid starvation and eviction is NOT a "sacred cow".

In the UK, support for the Church of England is the sacred cow.

The British can figure out how to best spend their resources without US help.

You arn't exaggerating?

Half as much program would house and feed the needy, if only the needy.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2012, 11:32:39 PM »
I think I will let the British figure out solutions to their problems, as I said. Some rightwing screed seems inadequate to understanding the problems in any worthwhile way.

When I have lived in Manchester or Liverpool council flats for several years, then I might have enough expertise to know how people might live on zero income.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2012, 11:48:07 PM »
There is good reason for us to observe what works and what doesn't in England, even if we don't help at all.

They are diffrent , but no so diffrent that their adventures can't be instructive to us.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Goodbye Beveridge: welfare's end nears
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2012, 12:08:42 AM »
I agree that we can learn from what happens in other countries.

I do not agree that editorials in British newspapers are where one needs to look for facts.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."