Author Topic: Wal-Mart pays itself rent  (Read 5347 times)

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Lanya

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Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« on: February 01, 2007, 07:51:20 PM »
Wal-Mart pays itself rent, gets large tax breaks

Michael Roston
Published: Thursday February 1, 2007
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Wal-Mart, the nation's largest employer and the world's biggest retailer, is regularly paying itself rent and using the transaction to decrease the taxes it pays to state governments, according to a report in this morning's Wall Street Journal.

The article by Jesse Drucker shows that Wal-Mart has saved hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes in 25 states, and may not be the only company using the practice. Drucker shows that state governments are finally getting wise and working to close a complicated tax loophole that the federal government discontinued years ago.

Wal-Mart is using a tax loophole involving "real-estate investment trusts" to call "rent" it pays to itself a tax-deductible business expense, Drucker explains. A Wal-Mart subsidary will pay rent to a real-estate investment trust, which is owned by another Wal-Mart subsidiary. The trust hands the rent to the second subsidiary in the form of a dividend, which cannot be taxed. Additionally, Wal-Mart counts the initial rental payment as a business expense, which is deducted from taxes in the state where the store is located. In one four-year period, Wal-Mart avoided $350 million in taxes using this strategy, which was developed by the accounting firm Ernst & Young LLP.

The loophole is getting attention in state governments. Newly installed New York Governor Elliot Spitzer said he would close the loophole in the hopes of adding $83 million to New York's state budget, and North Carolina is suing Wal-Mart for back taxes. Smaller companies using the same loophole, like Autozone and Fleet Funding, are also receiving more scrutiny.

The full article can be accessed by subscribers at the Wall Street Journal website. An excerpt is provided below.

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2007/WalMart_pays_itself_rent_get_large_0201.html
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Amianthus

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2007, 07:55:08 PM »
"Tax loophole"

So, in other words, Walmart is doing something that is legal. Or are you of the opinion that obeying the speed limit is a "loophole" in the speed limit laws that allows you to avoid paying your share of the fines?
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sirs

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2007, 07:57:16 PM »
I recall a story about Senator Edwards doing something similar.  I think it was something along the lines of paying himself a salary or some benefit, as if he was an employee to himself, and got some massive tax break as a result.  

And apparently it's all legal
« Last Edit: February 02, 2007, 01:40:42 AM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2007, 01:22:04 AM »
It is a if we were allowing millioaires to write these laws.

kimba1

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2007, 02:01:11 PM »
i think everbody should take advantage of all the tax loopholes available
but I also think the government has every right to shut them down.
it`s the governments responisiblilty to squeeze as much money out of us.
it`s not our fault their bad at this.
this year I`m writing off all my clothes,since I do evey one of them for work.
having a job with a dress code has advantages.

Brassmask

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2007, 02:58:17 PM »
Legal?  Sure.

Ethical?  Not really.

Total bullshit?  Absolutely.


Amianthus

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2007, 03:11:44 PM »
Legal?  Sure.

Ethical?  Not really.

Taking all the tax breaks that are legally available to you is not ethical?

Are you serious?

Going back to my speed limit analogy - do you consider travelling at or below the speed limit an "unethical" evasion of your fair share of the fines?
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2007, 03:26:31 PM »
Legal?  Sure.

Ethical?  Not really.

Taking all the tax breaks that are legally available to you is not ethical?

Are you serious?

Going back to my speed limit analogy - do you consider travelling at or below the speed limit an "unethical" evasion of your fair share of the fines?

Yes, I am totally serious.

Re: your speed limit analogy, the answer to your question is absolutely not but that is not relative to what Walmart is doing.  Within your analogy, what WM is doing would be keeping Mrs. WM pregnant constantly, putting their emergency flashers on, exceeding the speed limit whenever they want to and then when the cops stop them to ask what's the rush, saying that Mrs WM feels like she's having contractions.

Nothing illegal with keeping the wife knocked up?  Is there?


sirs

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2007, 03:36:48 PM »
Legal?  Sure.

And there in lies the rub
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Amianthus

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2007, 03:45:36 PM »
Re: your speed limit analogy, the answer to your question is absolutely not but that is not relative to what Walmart is doing.  Within your analogy, what WM is doing would be keeping Mrs. WM pregnant constantly, putting their emergency flashers on, exceeding the speed limit whenever they want to and then when the cops stop them to ask what's the rush, saying that Mrs WM feels like she's having contractions.

Nothing illegal with keeping the wife knocked up?  Is there?

The problem is that one part of that (exceeding the speed limit) is illegal.

What part of what Walmart is doing is illegal?
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2007, 03:49:34 PM »
Re: your speed limit analogy, the answer to your question is absolutely not but that is not relative to what Walmart is doing.  Within your analogy, what WM is doing would be keeping Mrs. WM pregnant constantly, putting their emergency flashers on, exceeding the speed limit whenever they want to and then when the cops stop them to ask what's the rush, saying that Mrs WM feels like she's having contractions.

Nothing illegal with keeping the wife knocked up?  Is there?

The problem is that one part of that (exceeding the speed limit) is illegal.

What part of what Walmart is doing is illegal?

Under the circumstances, would the speeding Mr. Walmart be given a citation or perhaps offered accompaniment by the officer?  Would that be illegal?

Amianthus

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2007, 03:52:18 PM »
Under the circumstances, would the speeding Mr. Walmart be given a citation or perhaps offered accompaniment by the officer?  Would that be illegal?

Again, speeding is illegal; what part of what Walmart is doing is illegal? My analogy equates to Walmart not exceeding the speed limit, but being castigated for not contributing their fair shares of the "speeding fines."
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2007, 05:28:42 PM »
Under the circumstances, would the speeding Mr. Walmart be given a citation or perhaps offered accompaniment by the officer?  Would that be illegal?

Again, speeding is illegal; what part of what Walmart is doing is illegal? My analogy equates to Walmart not exceeding the speed limit, but being castigated for not contributing their fair shares of the "speeding fines."

I'll give you that the man with the pregnant wife IS breaking the law but excusing it because he claims that he is rushing with his pregnant wife.  By the same token, Walmart is breaking the law that says you can deduct RENT from your taxes BUT isn't really paying RENT.  Walmart is contriving paying rent in the same way that the man is contriving a pregnancy scare in order to break the law against speeding.  They are both asking forgiveness with special circumstances.

Amianthus

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2007, 05:50:33 PM »
I'll give you that the man with the pregnant wife IS breaking the law but excusing it because he claims that he is rushing with his pregnant wife.  By the same token, Walmart is breaking the law that says you can deduct RENT from your taxes BUT isn't really paying RENT.  Walmart is contriving paying rent in the same way that the man is contriving a pregnancy scare in order to break the law against speeding.  They are both asking forgiveness with special circumstances.

What law is Walmart breaking? The original article claims that what Walmart is doing is legal to do.

The flipside is that Walmart is required to setup a corp to collect the rent, and that corp is required to pay taxes as well. It just turns out that the total paid is lower than the original taxes would have been, which makes it worthwhile to them.

Again, doing legal things that allow you to reduce your taxes is legal. It's also ethical. People have been known to buy houses solely to deduct the mortgage interest from their taxes, not intending to live in the house until it's paid off (note the continued popularity of "balloon mortgages," which are used to do this type of thing). According to you, this would be unethical.

Again, I say that what you are claiming is tantamount to claiming that people who do not speed are unethical for avoiding their fair share of speeding fines.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: Wal-Mart pays itself rent
« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2007, 06:12:21 PM »
Taxes are not fines.