Author Topic: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)  (Read 2211 times)

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Christians4LessGvt

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White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« on: May 15, 2014, 11:49:05 AM »


SEGREGATION GAINS GROUND 60 YEARS AFTER BROWN

BY JESSE J. HOLLAND AND KIMBERLY HEFLING

ASSOCIATED PRESS

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Segregation is making a comeback in U.S. schools.

Progress toward integrated classrooms has largely been rolled back since the Supreme Court issued its landmark Brown v. Topeka Board of Education decision 60 years ago, according to a report released Thursday by the Civil Rights Project at UCLA. Blacks are now seeing more school segregation than they have in decades, and more than half of Latino students are now attending schools that are majority Latino.

In New York, California and Texas, more than half of Latino students are enrolled in schools that are 90 percent minority or more, the report found. In New York, Illinois, Maryland and Michigan, more than half of black students attend schools where 90 percent or more are minority.

Project co-director Gary Orfield, author of the "Brown at 60" report, said the changes are troubling because they show some minority students receive poorer educations than white students and Asian students, who tend to be in middle-class schools. The report urged, among other things, deeper research into housing segregation, which is a "fundamental cause of separate-and-unequal schooling."

Although segregation is more prevalent in central cities of the largest metropolitan areas, it's also in the suburbs. "Neighborhood schools, when we go back to them, as we have, produce middle-class schools for whites and Asians and segregated high-poverty schools for blacks and Latinos," Orfield said.

Housing discrimination - stopping or discouraging minorities from moving to majority-white areas - also plays a role in school segregation and "that's been a harder nut to crack," said Sherrilyn Ifill, president of the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, which argued the Brown case in front of the Supreme Court.

School performance can be entwined with poverty, too.

"These are the schools that tend to have fewer resources, tend to have teachers with less experience, tend to have people who are teaching outside their area of specialty, and it also denies the opportunities, the contacts and the networking that occur when you're with people from different socio-economic backgrounds," said Dennis Parker, director of the American Civil Liberties Union Racial Justice Program.

For students like Diamond McCullough, 17, a senior at Walter H. Dyett High School on Chicago's South Side, the disparities are real. Her school is made up almost entirely of African-American students. She said her school doesn't offer physical education classes or art, and Advanced Placement classes are only available online.

McCullough noted the school is named after a famous musician, Walter H. Dyett, and the school no longer has a band class. "We don't have a music chorus class," she said. "We barely have the basic classes we need."

Aquila Griffin, 18, said she transferred from Dyett to another high school 20 blocks away because she needed biology and world studies to graduate. The two traveled to Washington this week for a labor sponsored rally outside the U.S. Supreme Court in support of public education.

"Many blame the schools for failing, or teachers, but they never blame the bad policies put in place in schools," Griffin said. "A teacher can only teach to a certain extent with the resources. It's the policies put in place that's failing the students."

On May 17, 1954, the Supreme Court ruled: "In the field of public education, the doctrine of "separate but equal" has no place. Separate educational facilities are inherently unequal." In the aftermath of that ruling, scores of cities and towns implemented desegregation plans that often included mandatory busing, in some cases triggering an exodus of whites to private schools or less diverse communities.

John Rury, an education professor at the University of Kansas, said the work at UCLA has revealed how many of the advances in desegregating schools made after the Brown ruling have stopped - or been reversed.

While racial discrimination has been a factor, other forces are in play, Rury said. Educated parents with the means to move have flocked to districts and schools with the best reputations for decades, said Rury, who has studied the phenomenon in the Kansas City region.

In the South, many school districts encompass both a city and the surrounding area, he said. That has led to better-integrated schools.

Still, around the country, only 23 percent of black students attended white-majority schools in 2011. That's the lowest number since 1968.

Advocates point to rulings by federal courts that have freed many of the schools from Brown-related desegregation orders since the 1990s. That, they say, is leading the country back toward more segregated schools.

At the same time, there's been a demographic change in public schools. Between 1968 and 2011, the number of Hispanic students in the public school system rose 495 percent, while the number of black students increased by 19 percent and the number of white students dropped 28 percent, according to the Education Department.

Today, many Hispanic students are attending segregated schools, particularly in the West.

Chuck Brothers, a retired social studies and psychology teacher who taught in a low-income school in St. Lucie County, Florida, said the nation trips over how to solve these issues.

"I think we haven't taken the time, and it's across the board, politically and socially, to really understand what we really do want out of education and how are we really going to make it available for everyone," Brothers said.


http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_SCHOOL_SEGREGATION?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2014-05-15-03-35-17
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2014, 12:01:49 PM »
don`t forget other versions of white flight


http://www.yelp.com/topic/palo-alto-white-people-avoiding-asians

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2014, 01:17:16 PM »
don`t forget other versions of white flight

In my opinion....
in the big picture "fleeing from Asians" would be a very tiny exception in "White Flight".

I wish we had more Asian immigration and less from other places.
Asians tend do very well in school, learn the language, and become
successful entrepreneurs. I don't see Asians as an over-all "drain
on the system"....I think they are a plus to our country.

Most whites simply do not want to send their kids into
inner city schools where illegal and legal Latino students
are the dominating force within the school. Why would
I want to send my precious child into a school that
resembles a school in Guatemala? It's ridiculous
and it is just not going to happen... no matter
how hard the Left.... that wants to change our
country illegally... try to force the issue.
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2014, 01:53:44 PM »
but wouldn`t the tiny exception rule apply on this subject to begin with. most of the U.S. is not likely having this problem. this is more location driven.

but on the matter of education it does hit on a serious issue of what subject of education should be generally taught to all students. art and P.E. was brought up as a factor for students being taken out.

how does these subject which parents demand in private schools goes on the chopping block in public schools. I got doubts the policies leans towards these subject getting cut. seems like a very bad oversight issue is in play

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2014, 04:38:35 PM »
These days I think "White Flight" is not so much a flight from color,
but a "flight from ghetto".

"Ghetto" can mean thugs, crime, gangs, language deficient students dragging others behind,
non-motivated students, and just a general poor learning environment, ect....

In 2014 if the inner city schools were safe, great learning environments
I do not think Whites would be going to the trouble of moving way, way
outside of the cities and having long commutes to work...as well as
the cost of private schools.

I really don't think "White Flight" in 2014 is about color,
it may have been in the past....but today it is about fleeing
from the problems many minority dominated schools have.

This really isn't brain surgery, most parents are going to
try to avoid those ridiculous excuses for schools.

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2014, 04:57:17 PM »
hmm

honestly this the first time I`ve read of white flight is about people leaving ghetto conditions. white flight here is people complaining about the Asian kids are effecting the school course materials

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2014, 05:13:21 PM »
hmm - honestly this the first time I`ve read of white flight is about people leaving ghetto conditions. white flight here is people complaining about the Asian kids are effecting the school course materials

Sure Kimba there are isolated instances of unusual reasons,
but the vast majority of "White Flight" throughout this country's
history and currently has very, very, little to do with Whites
fleeing Asian's.

I really find it hard to believe you have never heard
of White Flight away from the inner cities and the problems
of the minority dominated inner city?

Why do you think all the suburbs of so called "White Flight"
pop up all around the big cities across the country?

It is because people want to flee from the problems....
crime, graffiti, gangs, and many time deteriorating schools
and neighborhoods...once they become "taken over" by illegals, blacks, ect....

Even Blacks, Hispanics try to get away from it if they can.
That's why it is not so much getting away from a color of people
as getting away from a nightmare.

The flight is not easy...it takes lots of time (commuting every single day)
lots of money, lots of commitment...
people don't flee because it is easy
it's hard as hell
but preferable for many....so they can avoid the nightmare

"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2014, 05:42:17 PM »
san Francisco/bay area is quite different in that regard. actually S.F. has black flight which is a incorrect name for the situation. the correct name is" responsible tax paying home owner flight" which happens the majority of them is black. the rising cost and lack of public services has really turned off the old residence.

people leaving the city for the suburbs is not a newsworthy thing so I would not notice such  thing. but people leaving because the school are too competitive for their kids to attend will be noticeable .the parents actually stated the Asian kids are too competitive.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2014, 06:05:02 PM »
people leaving the city for the suburbs is not a newsworthy thing

Well it is basically the topic of this article and thread I started
so the Associated Press feels it is newsworthy.

"triggering an exodus of whites to private schools or less diverse communities"

"....other forces are in play, Rury said. Educated parents with the means to move have flocked to districts and schools with the best reputations for decades"

people leaving because the school are too competitive for their kids to attend

And whats so odd about that?

If my kid could be "Top 5% of his Class" in a suburb very good school or
"not near the top" in a class full of brilliant Asians...
then what is the surprise if I decide to move?



"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2014, 07:39:36 PM »
I wouldn`t call them brilliant. yes the majority of the kids younger than me in the family did go to college and some had scholarships and other went to 1st tiered schools. but since I`ve seen 1st hand all of them growing up the only things that may make them standout compared to other kids is pretty much being able to finish their homework. I can`t say it`s intelligence but of a ability to stick it out and just get it job done. I`ve seen other kids just giveup too easily.

too much "it`s not important enough to do " attitude

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2014, 09:56:20 PM »
Whites flee city taxes and houses that do not appreciate in price. When I was looking for a house, I cannot remember how many real estate sales people kept saying "It's the biggest investment you will ever make." Which was certainly not a worthwhile approach, since real estate is an unreliable and often illiquid investment. Here in Miami, White Flight has meant fleeing both Hispanics and Blacks and moving north to Broward County.

This means paying out over a third of your income in house payments, high and ever rising taxes and long commutes.  I assumed a mortgage, paid zero in closing costs and had a lot more money to invest in IRA accounts.

Asians are basically invisible when it comes to such decisions. There are over 50,000 in Miami Dade County and they are scattered all over the place and attend all the public schools.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2014, 09:58:13 PM »
Ok Kimba....I see your point
I do think Asian's as a group tend to have high IQ
but yes many times it does come down to drive and working harder.


"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2014, 10:06:21 PM »
IQ may have something to do with it, but I think that Chinese do better in school because they see themselves as an extension of their family and parents and do not with to disgrace them by failing. White parents often see their kids doing poorly as just being individuals and "finding their way". American Black parents often see poor grades as related to racism. Black students from the British Caribbean and the Virgin Islands have a completely different  view of this and try harder to prove themselves to everyone. Haitians are rather a mixed bag, depending on whether they are from the city or the country.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

kimba1

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #13 on: May 15, 2014, 10:22:56 PM »
I`m betraying my people for saying this, I don`t like thinking my people in terms of high IQ. I truly think most people are comparably intelligent but the difference is a matter of effort . true some folks can figure stuff easier than others but I find those folks not exactly competitors I`ve always been able keep up with those. even without coffee

xo
the family thing is partially true , parent also put their kids in after school classes to supplement what the kids learn in school. I found it a surprise that rich white families think that`s a inferior way to teach kids and that`s how I found Asian are comparibly undereducated . it does answer how we lack certain skills.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: White Flight! (away from 3rd World)
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2014, 11:38:15 AM »
My experience is that Asian students are better at memorizing factual material, and often less adept at using that data to come up with innovations, new ideas and different perspectives.

The Japanese tend to focus on improving on solid, well established  plans, rather than coming up with creative innovations on those plans. You can see this in comparing Lexus cars with those engineered and built by Audi, Mercedes and BMW.  The German cars have more innovations, but sometimes they are over engineered and therefore expensive to maintain. All the car magazines pay more attention to the driving experience of a new car, and the Germans always beat out Lexus. But according to Consumer Reports, the Lexus will provide a very adequate and luxurious ride for a much longer period at a lower cost.

The E class and S class Mercedes are now built with computerized engine mounts: there is an air chamber and an oil chamber and a valve to add or remove air to minimize engine vibration. It is a very clever and innovative system and it is true that you cannot tell inside the car that the engine is running because of vibration, as there is none. You can hear the exhaust, and that is intentional.

The flaw in this is that there are three of these fancy engine mounts, and each is wired to the computer. The factory recommends changing these after 30K miles. Each engine mount costs $300 plus installation, which requires that the engine be propped up. This requires a special tool, so you will have to take the car to a MB dealership of someone who has the tools and expertise, and that will be around $125 an hour labor.

The odds are that the typical MBZ owner or lessee will get another car before this needs to be done. The odds are that those who buy these cars used will know nothing about engine mounts and will eventually just ignore paying $1200 or so on something like motor mounts. It is probable that my 1985 300D wagon will still be running strong on its hard rubber motor mounts when a third of these 2014 models have ceased to be on the road, due to the extreme cost of maintaining them. New cars have a feature that will disable the car if there is a serious problem, like a collapsed motor mount. It has no computer. Once started, it can run entirely without a battery.

I have owned 17 cars in my lifetime. Nearly all I have driven past 100K miles/ I have so far purchased two(2) motor mounts, only one of which was really necessary.

Engine vibration has only been annoying to me that one time when I swapped some plug wires. 
I doubt that Lexus has such a fussy design for its engine mounts, but I am not sure. Asking a salesman would be futile: most of them cannot tell you where the battery is.

So the point is that innovation CAN be a great thing (putting turn signals on the back of mirrors is a GREAT idea), but it can also be a pain.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."