"It makes no sense . . . "

[Michael Tee]

from the "President's" speech regarding the veto:

<<This is a prescription for chaos and confusion and we must not impose it on our troops," Bush said in a nationally broadcast statement from the White House. He said the bill would "mandate a rigid and artificial deadline" for troop pullouts, and "it makes no sense to tell the enemy when you plan to start withdrawing.">>

If the U.S. has been defeated - - and it has - - then it doesn't matter what you tell the enemy.  You know they won and they know they won.  If the "President's" intention is to fight on indefinitely in hopes of ultimate victory with no end in sight, then it makes no sense to tell the enemy the date of the pull-out.

The real problem is that this man started and then lost a war.  Led the U.S.A. into battle against a tiny nation of only 23 million people and failed to subdue them.  And now lacks even the basic courage and decency to admit to his deluded followers:  "We lost."  He'll keep fighting till the end of his sorry regime so that the blame for the disaster can be laid at the feet of his successor.

[Lanya]

".........so that the blame for the disaster can be laid at the feet of his successor."

That's the plan.

I just read that there are 2,000 double amputees from this war.  I had no idea there were that many.

NPR : Reid: Iraq Problems Are Presidential, Not Military
We have 2000 double amputees from that war. ... The president needs to change the course of the war in Iraq. It's not working. ...
www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9783144 - Similar pages - Note this

[Plane]

They haven't won yet.


And they still might not.

The opposition has lost ten times as many soldiers as we have , you may think them cheaper than Amerians by a factor of ten , but their mothers don't.

If we do loose we will leave Iraq as a nurtureing environment for Al Quieda more than Afganistan ever was , for this reason it is important and desireablethat it be largely torn down as we leave.

[Michael Tee]

<<The opposition has lost ten times as many soldiers as we have  . . . >>

They can take it, you can't take even a tenth of it.  They live there, you don't.

<< . . .  you may think them cheaper than Amerians by a factor of ten , but their mothers don't.>>

Their mother is their country and their people.  Their mothers are proud and resolute to have sons who fight to the death against invaders and infidels and their collaborators.  Ask Cindy Sheehan how proud and resolute American mothers are to have sons who fight to the death for the greater glory of Halliburton and Exxon.

<<If we do loose we will leave Iraq as a nurtureing environment for Al Quieda more than Afganistan ever was . . . >>

Tough shit.  Beef up your airport security and you shouldn't have too many problems.

<<. . .  for this reason it is important and desireablethat it be largely torn down as we leave.>>

Yeah, like it couldn't be built up in a minute with the proceeds of sale of their own oil.  Without the foreigners taking their 90% cut.  Actually, I think you SHOULD tear it all down as you leave.  Gives the world a real good look at the true face of America.

BTW, if you're worried about providing a nurturing environment for al Qaeda, I think they'll find a nurturing environment anywhere they choose to settle down in.  Unofficially, of course.  They are the heroes of the Arab and Muslim world for the way they stood up to the Americans.  Your "President" and his criminal acts of aggression probably recruited more al Qaeda than Osama bin Laden could ever have dreamed of finding, with thousands more flocking in each day.  Since their real targets are the corrupt regimes of America's Middle East puppets, it's now just a short time before the rest of the edifice starts to crumble.

[Plane]

"Tough shit.  Beef up your airport security and you shouldn't have too many problems."


This is not true , Al Queda has attacked us in several diffrent ways and as long as they last they will attempt to be more inventive.

One of the advantages of fighting Al Queda in Iraq is that all of the Americans there are armed and this is the opposite of the situation Al Queda likes, if we leave them alone they will return to pusilanimous backstabbing.


".....the foreigners taking their 90% cut."


This is not true either, build a scale of the countrys most "exploited " by the US and European based companys and you will find a lot of coincidence with the most progress and increase in standard of liveing.

[sirs]

I'll tell you another thing that "makes no sense"....the Bush lied us into war crap, as well as this is all for the oil.   

If it were the former, Bush would have easily just had mass amounts of WMD planted for us to "find".  I mean, he is that diabolical. 

If it were the latter, we would have used our superior military assets, annexed all the Iraqi Oil fields, and proclaimed we're going to use that oil to pay for our bringing democracy to the Iraqis.

If Bush were as evil and this lying scumbag the foaming at the mouth left keep claiming he is, that's what would have happened.  Not so strangely, it hasn't, due in large part to that fact that these same foaming at the mouth leftists are actually the ones full of AMBE

[Michael Tee]

<<This is not true , Al Queda has attacked us in several diffrent ways >>

BFD -- so beef up your embassy security and your visiting warship security as well as your airport security.  Again, no problem.

<< . . . and as long as they last they will attempt to be more inventive.>>

Well, so far their "inventiveness" has been limited to suicide truck bombing, airplane hijacking and suicide speed-boading.  This doesn't exactly make them the Thomas Alva Edisons of international terrorism, as far as I can see.  Surely you're not going to claim that they are a match for American inventiveness?  I think you've probably figured out the solutions to all of their techniques to date.  Shouldn't be any more airplane hijackings, suicide speed-boatings or truck drivings.  I just don't believe that you live in such terror of their next move that it's worth half a trillion dollars to subdue one country of 23 million people which had no affinity whatsoever with them in the first place, just to prevent them from gaining a foothold there when there are so many other places they could just as logically operate from if Iraq was unavailable.  They never operated from Iraq anyway.  This whole theory is a crock - - obviously the U.S. is in Iraq for the oil not out of any exaggerated "fear" of al Qaeda.

<<One of the advantages of fighting Al Queda in Iraq is that all of the Americans there are armed and this is the opposite of the situation Al Queda likes, if we leave them alone they will return to pusilanimous backstabbing.>>

Oh, I think you have that all wrong.  Al Qaeda loves to fight armed Americans.  That's what draws them into Iraq.  That's what brings the new recruits into the business.  What other organization can promise a glorious martyrdom by going mano a mano with the minions of the Great Satan?  These guys aren't nearly as pusillanimous as you like to think.  If America had their balls, they'd draft a half-million men and send them all to Iraq but they need to restrict casualties to the army of hillbilly rejects and Green Card applicants who nobody gives a shit about, so they send these guys over there with a ton of firepower, kill half a million Iraqis "to bring them democracy" or whatever the nonsensical line of the day happens to be, and figure at the end of the day when they've killed maybe four or five million more, the place will start to quieten down.



<<This is not true either, [that foreigners are going to take a 90% cut of the oil ]>>

OK so it's probably not literally true, the original draft hydrocarbons law did propose a 90% max, but we all know how these things work, ask for 90, "settle" for 50 - - when under Saddam, the foreigners got zip and the country (till Kuwait) was a model of prosperity.

<<build a scale of the countrys most "exploited " by the US and European based companys and you will find a lot of coincidence with the most progress and increase in standard of liveing.>>

Yeah, I bet the next thing you're going to tell us is that China was a model of prosperity under the U.S.-backed KMT and was ruined when it shook off the parasites and went its own way.  Iraq under Saddam was doing fine without foreign hands in its till, and it's hard to imagine how it'd do any better with Halliburton and Exxon siphoning off their 90% or even 50%.  But I guess anything can be rationalized somehow.

[Michael Tee]

<<If it were the former, Bush would have easily just had mass amounts of WMD planted for us to "find".  I mean, he is that diabolical. >>

They probably realized that a hoax like that would be too easily exposed.  Easier to claim they believed "bad intel."  There's always somebody dumb enough to believe that because how do you know what really went on inside their heads?  Circumstantial evidence is apparently too complex an idea for everyone to understand, whereas fake planted evidence needs just one unwilling accomplice or disgruntled ex-employee to be exposed.

<<If it were the latter, we would have used our superior military assets, annexed all the Iraqi Oil fields, and proclaimed we're going to use that oil to pay for our bringing democracy to the Iraqis.>>

Isn't that what you've done?  Only ran into a little more resistance than expected, at the same time finding out that your "superior military assets" aren't really all that superior?

<<If Bush were as evil and this lying scumbag the foaming at the mouth left keep claiming he is, that's what would have happened. >>

Well, that IS what happened.

<< . . . , it hasn't, due in large part to that fact that these same foaming at the mouth leftists are actually the ones full of AMBE >>

OK, you got me there.  AMBE?  All Motherfucking Bush Enemies?  America Must Be Evil?  I give up.

[Amianthus]

OK, you got me there.  AMBE?  All Motherfucking Bush Enemies?  America Must Be Evil?  I give up.

You really do have a poor memory.

You have been told 3 times that I can remember that AMBE is an acronym for Adult Male Bovine Excrement.

[Plane]

<<This is not true , Al Queda has attacked us in several diffrent ways >>

BFD -- so beef up your embassy security and your visiting warship security as well as your airport security.  Again, no problem.

<< . . . and as long as they last they will attempt to be more inventive.>>

Well, so far their "inventiveness" has been limited to suicide truck bombing, airplane hijacking and suicide speed-boading.  This doesn't exactly make them the Thomas Alva Edisons of international terrorism, as far as I can see.  Surely you're not going to claim that they are a match for American inventiveness?  I think you've probably figured out the solutions to all of their techniques to date.  Shouldn't be any more airplane hijackings, suicide speed-boatings or truck drivings.  I just don't believe that you live in such terror of their next move that it's worth half a trillion dollars to subdue one country of 23 million people which had no affinity whatsoever with them in the first place, just to prevent them from gaining a foothold there when there are so many other places they could just as logically operate from if Iraq was unavailable.  They never operated from Iraq anyway.  This whole theory is a crock - - obviously the U.S. is in Iraq for the oil not out of any exaggerated "fear" of al Qaeda.

<<One of the advantages of fighting Al Queda in Iraq is that all of the Americans there are armed and this is the opposite of the situation Al Queda likes, if we leave them alone they will return to pusilanimous backstabbing.>>

Oh, I think you have that all wrong.  Al Qaeda loves to fight armed Americans.  That's what draws them into Iraq.  That's what brings the new recruits into the business.  What other organization can promise a glorious martyrdom by going mano a mano with the minions of the Great Satan?  These guys aren't nearly as pusillanimous as you like to think.  If America had their balls, they'd draft a half-million men and send them all to Iraq but they need to restrict casualties to the army of hillbilly rejects and Green Card applicants who nobody gives a shit about, so they send these guys over there with a ton of firepower, kill half a million Iraqis "to bring them democracy" or whatever the nonsensical line of the day happens to be, and figure at the end of the day when they've killed maybe four or five million more, the place will start to quieten down.



<<This is not true either, [that foreigners are going to take a 90% cut of the oil ]>>

OK so it's probably not literally true, the original draft hydrocarbons law did propose a 90% max, but we all know how these things work, ask for 90, "settle" for 50 - - when under Saddam, the foreigners got zip and the country (till Kuwait) was a model of prosperity.

<<build a scale of the countrys most "exploited " by the US and European based companys and you will find a lot of coincidence with the most progress and increase in standard of liveing.>>

Yeah, I bet the next thing you're going to tell us is that China was a model of prosperity under the U.S.-backed KMT and was ruined when it shook off the parasites and went its own way.  Iraq under Saddam was doing fine without foreign hands in its till, and it's hard to imagine how it'd do any better with Halliburton and Exxon siphoning off their 90% or even 50%.  But I guess anything can be rationalized somehow.

     Al Queda depends on metaphics to have honor , their attacks have been craven almost entirely what have they ever done to deserve our respect ? Kidnap , extort,suicide attck , booby trap, robbery, hijack? There is not anything that Al Queda can defend, not an inch of territory or a sinle innocent person, they rely comletely on our being much less craven than they for the security of their homes.

You ae going to have to admit that you have not the foggyest idea of what the cut is in such an oil deal , this seems to me to be an admission that yo actually know it is an unimporant detail.

[sirs]

<<If it were the former, Bush would have easily just had mass amounts of WMD planted for us to "find".  I mean, he is that diabolical. >>

They probably realized that a hoax like that would be too easily exposed.  Easier to claim they believed "bad intel."  There's always somebody dumb enough to believe that because how do you know what really went on inside their heads?  Circumstantial evidence is apparently too complex an idea for everyone to understand, whereas fake planted evidence needs just one unwilling accomplice or disgruntled ex-employee to be exposed.

So, what's perfectly reasonable and much easier to lie about, just isn't possible, but trying to perpetuate "bad intel", that was apparently agreed on by everyone else, the French, the Germans, the Russians, the UN, to all diabolically get together and agree with Bush, to pull the wool over the rest of us....now that's more believable       

<<If it were the latter, we would have used our superior military assets, annexed all the Iraqi Oil fields, and proclaimed we're going to use that oil to pay for our bringing democracy to the Iraqis.>>

Isn't that what you've done?

No

<<If Bush were as evil and this lying scumbag the foaming at the mouth left keep claiming he is, that's what would have happened. >>

Well, that IS what happened.

No, but keep fantasizing.  It's entertaining for the rest of us

<< . . . , it hasn't, due in large part to that fact that these same foaming at the mouth leftists are actually the ones full of AMBE >>

OK, you got me there.  AMBE?  All Motherfucking Bush Enemies?  America Must Be Evil?  I give up.

Tee, you gave up rational dialog, LONG ago

[Michael Tee]

<<You have been told 3 times that I can remember that AMBE is an acronym for Adult Male Bovine Excrement.>>

Sorry, teach.  I only remember the big stuff, guys like you can keep track of the small stuff.

[Michael Tee]

<<Al Queda depends on metaphics to have honor . . . >>

Whereas America doesn't even have metaphysical honour.

<< . . .  their attacks have been craven almost entirely what have they ever done to deserve our respect? >>

Why don't you teach them how to fire bunker-busters into shelters filled with cowering women and children?  That's sure to earn lots of respect, in America anyway.  Or how to wire up a naked prisoner and sic some attack dogs on him for the cameras?  Another sure-fire respect builder, in the eyes of any American.  How about laying down some white phosphorus in a residential area, think that'll get 'em some respect?  Or even better, why not rape a 14-year old and then kill her and her whole friggin family?  Why the U.S.A. is just FULL of ways for their fighting men to earn respect.  Hey here's a great idea - - instead of trying to teach Iraqis the finer points of democracy, which they don't seem to be too anxious to learn anyway, why don't you teach them instead how fighting men earn respect in the world?  America's a real expert in that.

<<Kidnap , extort,suicide attck , booby trap, robbery, hijack? There is not anything that Al Queda can defend, not an inch of territory or a sinle innocent person, they rely comletely on our being much less craven than they for the security of their homes.>>

Mr. Pot, meet Mr. Kettle.

<<You ae going to have to admit that you have not the foggyest idea of what the cut is in such an oil deal , this seems to me to be an admission that yo actually know it is an unimporant detail.>>

Actually the original draft hydrocarbons law DID contain a 90% proposal. The law was never finalized to my knowledge but from my vast understanding of how the world works, I'd say it would be fairly reasonable to assume that draft laws get debated, some objections are made, revisions are effected and a law is ultimately passed.  In the case of a 90% cut originally proposed, it's entirely reasonable to expect that the final result could be 66.7%, 50% or even 25%.  When the foreigners' cut under Saddam was zero, the actual percentage is immaterial to my main point, which is that a humungous whack of oil profits is gonna wind up in the hands of foreigners and that under Saddam they wouldn't have gotten one penny of it.  THAT'S the "unimportant detail" behind the new hydrocarbons law.

[Amianthus]

Sorry, teach.  I only remember the big stuff, guys like you can keep track of the small stuff.

Considering the number of times that that acronym is used around here, it's not "small stuff."

Besides, I have a functioning memory. I am capable of remembering small stuff and big stuff.

[Michael Tee]

<<Besides, I have a functioning memory. I am capable of remembering small stuff and big stuff.>>

Fascinating.  Just.  Plain.  Fascinating.