Iran is going to do us in

[Cynthia]

Period. Powerless oil mongers, ripe from the Persian Empire...not lost in translation just a decade plus centuries ago.

Iran isn't going to play nice...wait and see..

My opinion.
sadly....but there wasn't going to be a way to escape the game even if we had not entered the Iraqi stage...Iran is dead centered on the end of the west...

Now they just have more support...

and damn it, it's not our fault.
When will it be time to say....we must stop bitching and start wanting our life the way it is.

This is what I feel...no URL. ....
CYN.

[The_Professor]

There are many of us who feel Iran, and Islam, is probably the greatest threat to the West. But, America just does nothing about it and so Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover...sigh.

[BT]

Don't let it get you down.

It's only castles burning.

[Michael Tee]

<<There are many of us who feel Iran, and Islam, is probably the greatest threat to the West. But, America just does nothing about it and so Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover...sigh.>>

And yet in the meantime, it's the Americans who invaded Afghanistan, the Americans who invaded Iraq, the Americans who are threatening to invade Iran, the Americans who overthrew the democratically elected government of Iran, the Americans who support the Israelis' 40-year occupation of the West Bank and the Americans who intervened on the Christian side in the Lebanese civil war.

If I knew a little more about psychology, Professor, I might want to say that you were engaging in a little projection there.  All the aggression in the real world seems to be flowing from West to East, but in your mind you are still focused on the "threat" from the East.

[The_Professor]

As you know, I disagree with this Iraqi incursion.

Afghnaistan, however, is a different matter. I see that as a reaction to radical Islam, e.g. 9-11. I would invade Afghanistan again, if need be if the same set of events were to occur.

I see Islam as a disease trying to infect the West.

I know we diasgree and that is fine. That is what forums like these are good for.

[Xavier_Onassis]

You are not thinking critically.

Suppose some Islamic country invaded Mexico or Canada. How could the US NOT get involved?
And yet, you expect Iran to take no part in the big, whacking MESS Juniorbush has make of Iraq.

The US will leave Iraq, eventually. It will never have the same influence in Iraq as Iran has, just as Iran or Iraq cannot possibly have the same influence on Mexico that the US has had.

If the US policy considers Islam as some sort of disease, it will lose. If it backs down, the US will be seen as weak. If it kills Muslims, they will become martyrs.

This is what is happening now. There have been more suicide bombers in Iraq since 2003 than in Israel since forever.

I am glad that fanatics with no vision of the world will soon lose their control of the US. Even Juniorbush's inept regime has a better understanding of the Middle East than you seem to.

[_JS]

There are many of us who feel Iran, and Islam, is probably the greatest threat to the West. But, America just does nothing about it and so Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover...sigh.

"Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover"

Isn't that what al-Qaeda says?

By the way, al-Qaeda are Sunnis. Osama bin-Laden is a Sunni. The Taleban are Sunni. The Wahhabi are Sunni. Most of the violence in Iraq is being caused by Sunni insurgents. All of the 9/11 hijackers were Sunni.

Iran is Shi'a.

We better focus on Iran.

[Lanya]

If I can use infantile language for a minute, all of these "bad" people are Sunni, and so we better focus on the Shi'a?  Why?

[The_Professor]

There are many of us who feel Iran, and Islam, is probably the greatest threat to the West. But, America just does nothing about it and so Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover...sigh.

"Western civilization further declines and is ripe for takeover"

Isn't that what al-Qaeda says?

By the way, al-Qaeda are Sunnis. Osama bin-Laden is a Sunni. The Taleban are Sunni. The Wahhabi are Sunni. Most of the violence in Iraq is being caused by Sunni insurgents. All of the 9/11 hijackers were Sunni.

Iran is Shi'a.

We better focus on Iran.

I am more concerned with anyone who uses Islam as a reason to attack "The Great Satan"; regardless which sect they come from.

[Michael Tee]

<<I am more concerned with anyone who uses Islam as a reason to attack "The Great Satan"; regardless which sect they come form.>>

Well, then rest easy, Professor.  Most Muslims who attack America have a pretty concrete list of reasons, all of them rooted in one injustice or another in how America has been fucking with the Muslim world for years.

Probably the best way to look at this is simply to ask yourself the following questions:

1.  How many times have the English, French and Americans intervened in Muslim lands, by setting up or overthrowing governments, invading territory and killing Muslims?

2.  How many times have the Muslims intervened in American, English or French lands, by setting up or overthrowing governments, invading territory and killing Americans, British or French?

A little bit of realism, Professor, rather than instinct or emotion, and you will soon see where the aggression is coming from in the first place, as well as the best way to defuse Muslim anger and reduce attacks against the West.

[Plane]

<<I am more concerned with anyone who uses Islam as a reason to attack "The Great Satan"; regardless which sect they come form.>>

Well, then rest easy, Professor.  Most Muslims who attack America have a pretty concrete list of reasons, all of them rooted in one injustice or another in how America has been fucking with the Muslim world for years.

Probably the best way to look at this is simply to ask yourself the following questions:

1.  How many times have the English, French and Americans intervened in Muslim lands, by setting up or overthrowing governments, invading territory and killing Muslims?

2.  How many times have the Muslims intervened in American, English or French lands, by setting up or overthrowing governments, invading territory and killing Americans, British or French?

A little bit of realism, Professor, rather than instinct or emotion, and you will soon see where the aggression is coming from in the first place, as well as the best way to defuse Muslim anger and reduce attacks against the West.

Going back to Napoleon , the invasions seem mostly to be West vs East , but if one goes back a little further it looks more even , since Spain, France, Hungary , Austria , Poland , Greece, etc, etc, have all had important periods of conflict with Islam , including invasions.

Has Islam changed since the days that all of Europe was in fear of Suleiman the Great?

[Michael Tee]

<<Going back to Napoleon , the invasions seem mostly to be West vs East , but if one goes back a little further it looks more even , since Spain, France, Hungary , Austria , Poland , Greece, etc, etc, have all had important periods of conflict with Islam , including invasions.>>

Well, plane, in view of the relative scarcity of living survivors of Napoleonic times, my questions were actually aimed at 20th and 21st century events which people living today (or the parents and grandparents who raised and educated them) can remember.  If you want  to go back to the days of Suleiman the Great (the 16th century, according to Wikipedia,) I would think your God-fearing Protestant ancestors, God bless them, would have had a lot more to fear from the good Christians of the Spanish Inquisition than from Suleiman.  At least that's how Good Queen Bess saw it, and who the hell are we to argue with her?

<<Has Islam changed since the days that all of Europe was in fear of Suleiman the Great?>>

I dunno.  If you want to use as a yardstick the change in Christianity from the Spanish Inquisition to the Holocaust, I'd say it's probably changed about as much or as little as Christianity.

[Plane]

<<Going back to Napoleon , the invasions seem mostly to be West vs East , but if one goes back a little further it looks more even , since Spain, France, Hungary , Austria , Poland , Greece, etc, etc, have all had important periods of conflict with Islam , including invasions.>>

Well, plane, in view of the relative scarcity of living survivors of Napoleonic times, my questions were actually aimed at 20th and 21st century events which people living today (or the parents and grandparents who raised and educated them) can remember.  If you want  to go back to the days of Suleiman the Great (the 16th century, according to Wikipedia,) I would think your God-fearing Protestant ancestors, God bless them, would have had a lot more to fear from the good Christians of the Spanish Inquisition than from Suleiman.  At least that's how Good Queen Bess saw it, and who the hell are we to argue with her?

<<Has Islam changed since the days that all of Europe was in fear of Suleiman the Great?>>

I dunno.  If you want to use as a yardstick the change in Christianity from the Spanish Inquisition to the Holocaust, I'd say it's probably changed about as much or as little as Christianity.

No, the have not had  a Reformation. Seeing as they are six hunded years younger, this is just about due.

[Michael Tee]

<<No, the have not had  a Reformation. Seeing as they are six hunded years younger, this is just about due.>>

Oh, yeah.  The Reformation.  Who's gonna write the equivalent of Martin Luther's "The Jews and Their Lies" for the their Reformation?  Ahmedinejad?  That's gonna be some wholesome change.

[_JS]

If I can use infantile language for a minute, all of these "bad" people are Sunni, and so we better focus on the Shi'a?  Why?

Lanya. That's a damn good question.

I have no idea.