Author Topic: question about hillary  (Read 13805 times)

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kimba1

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question about hillary
« on: January 11, 2008, 03:10:25 PM »
If anybody notice I tend not to talk about the election .
but my curiosity got the best of me due to the news

what did hillary do last week?
I mean this week all this anti-hillary stuff is popping up.
what did she do to upset people now?
it looks like it happened last week.
I never bother trying to choose a candidate this early in the game myself
I`m a 4th quarter kinda
p.s. if this is a campaign thing
it`s a dangerous one
it got george bush elected and it got bill clinton elected
the not hillary path traditionally means you might as well as swear her in now.


BT

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2008, 03:57:03 PM »
Quote
what did hillary do last week?

She cried
She won

and now the spotlight is back on her.

same old same old

hnumpah

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2008, 04:26:20 PM »
Quote
She cried
She won

Yep. After the boo-hoo, she got a little woo-hoo.
"I love WikiLeaks." - Donald Trump, October 2016

Plane

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2008, 05:56:14 PM »


http://dyn.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/archive.cfm/year/2007/month/2


Crying works better now than it used to.

Frankly I would not have been upset with Muskie for crying , considering what the nature of the insult was , Andrew Jackson would have shot the insult giver , so crying is not such a biggie.

I didn't mind Dean screaming either , there were things about Dean I didn't like , but I don't see complaining about him giveing up a yell at a pep rally as much of a problem.

These little things seem to make much more diffrence than they ought , is the process capricious this way ?

I really think that problems actually accrue untill one additional small one is too much , so that the last one might be the least one , it still gets the best remembered.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2008, 11:38:10 PM »
You can't get the same reaction to a woman who is thought of as some sort of iron magnolia getting slightly choked up with a six-foot tall man crying ob=ver an insult to his wife.

It wasn't fair to Muskie to do this: the man was totally worn out and hadn't slept for 20 hours, and he was prescribed something with ibogaine in it, and it affected him atypically. Muskie would sure as hell made a better president than Reagan, who was seriously impaired by Altzheimers at that time.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2008, 11:40:35 PM »
Xavier,

What do yo want in a president?
just curious....
Speak to this question honestly,please.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: question about hillary (are the clintons racist?)
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2008, 12:03:27 AM »
now the clintons have pissed off alot of blacks



Racial tensions roil Democratic race

By: Ben Smith
January 11, 2008

Comments from the Clintons and Clinton supporters are spurring a racial backlash.
A series of comments from Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, her husband and her supporters are spurring a racial backlash and adding a divisive edge to the presidential primary as the candidates head south to heavily African-American South Carolina.

The comments, which ranged from the New York senator appearing to diminish the role of Martin Luther King Jr. in the civil rights movement ? an aide later said she misspoke to Bill Clinton dismissing Sen. Barack Obama's image in the media as a "fairy tale" generated outrage on black radio, black blogs and cable television. And now they've drawn the attention of prominent African-American politicians.

A cross-section of voters are alarmed at the tenor of some of these statements, said Obama spokeswoman Candice Tolliver, who said that Clinton would have to decide whether she owed anyone an apology.

There's a groundswell of reaction to these comments and not just these latest comments but really a pattern, or a series of comments that we've heard for several months, she said. ?olks are beginning to wonder: Is this really an isolated situation, or is there something bigger behind all of this??

Clinton supporters responded to that suggestion with their own outrage.

To say that there is a pattern of racist comments coming out of the Hillary campaign is ridiculous, said Ohio Rep. Stephanie Tubbs Jones. All of the world knows the commitment of President Clinton and Sen. Clinton to civil rights issues and not only the commitment in terms of words but in terms of deeds.

Referring to the King quote, Sheila Jackson Lee, another Clinton supporter, said Clinton was trying to contrast King and Obama, not to diminish King: "It really is a question of focusing on the suggestion that you can inspire without deeds  what is well-known to the child who studies Dr. King in school is that yes, he spoke, but he also moved people to action."

But other black Clinton supporters found themselves wincing at the Clintons? words, if not questioning their intent.

A Harlem-based consultant to the Clinton campaign, Bill Lynch, called the former president?s comments "mistake" nd said his own phone had been ringing with friends around the country voicing their concern.

"I've been concerned about some of those comments" and that there might be a backlash, he said.

Illinois State Senate President Emil Jones, a prominent Obama supporter, echoed those sentiments.

"It's very unfortunate that the president would make a statement like that," he said of Bill Clinton's criticism of Obama's experience, adding that the African-American community had "saved his presidency" after the Monica Lewinsky scandal.

"They owe the African-American community not the reverse," he said. "Maybe Hillary and Bill should get behind Sen. Barack Obama."

Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr., through a spokesman, used even stronger language. "Following Barack Obama's victory in Iowa and historic voter turnout in New Hampshire, the cynics unfortunately have stepped up their efforts to decry his uplifting message of hope and fundamental change.

"Regrettably, they have resorted to distasteful and condescending language that appeals to our fears rather than our hopes. I sincerely hope that they'll turn away from such reactionary, disparaging rhetoric."

Many analysts think Clinton won New Hampshire on the back of a feminist backlash against criticism from her rivals and the media, and now, after his own defeat, it's Obama's turn. Race is particularly complicated turf this year, however, in a contest that features two towering figures who pride themselves for breaking racial barriers in American politics.

The first is Bill Clinton, sometimes referred to as the first black president, who now finds himself on the same uncertain ground as any other white politician speaking dismissively of an African-American rival.

He was expected to call in to the Rev. Al Sharpton?s radio show, which airs in South Carolina, Friday afternoon, to explain his "fairy tale" comment.

And the second is Obama, whose 1995 book subtitled "A story of race and inheritance" was hailed as one of the most astute examinations of race in America. He has played the question of race with remarkable dexterity in this campaign, leaving little doubt among African-Americans that he's a member of their community, while delivering a message that excludes no one. To whites, he?s made clear that he's a bearer of racial redemption, not racial grievance, even extending public absolution during a televised debate to a rival, Sen. Joe Biden, for past racially charged remarks. Tolliver said Obama had no personal reaction to Clinton?s remarks and was focused on his own message of hope. But he's spoken in the past of the risk of falling into old narratives of racial division.

I think America is still caught in a little bit of a time warp: The narrative of black politics is still shaped by the '60s and black power, he told Newsweek this summer. That is not, I think, how most black voters are thinking. I don't think that's how most white voters are thinking. I think that people are thinking about how to find a job, how to fill up the gas tank, how to send their kids to college. I find that when I talk about those issues, both blacks and whites respond well.

Now, though, some of those old patterns are reasserting themselves.

The series of comments Clinton critics? cite began in mid-December, when the chairman of Hillary Clinton?s New Hampshire campaign, Bill Shaheen, speculated about whether Obama had ever dealt drugs. In the final days of the New Hampshire campaign, however, the discomfort of some black observers intensified as Bill Clinton dismissed the contrast between Obama?s judgment on the war and Clinton's as a "fairy tale" and spoke dismissively of his short time in the Senate. And the candidate herself, in an interview with Fox News, stressed the role of President Lyndon Johnson, over Martin Luther King Jr., in the civil rights movement.

I would point to the fact that Dr. King's dream began to be realized when President Lyndon Johnson passed the Civil Rights Act of 1964, when he was able to get through Congress something that President Kennedy was hopeful to do, the president before had not even tried, but it took a president to get it done, she said, in response to a question about how her dismissive attitude toward Obama's "false hopes" would have applied to the civil rights movement. That dream became a reality, the power of that dream became real in people's lives because we had a president who said we are going to do it and actually got it accomplished.

An aide later said Clinton didn't intend to diminish King, and later that day she went out of her way to stress his accomplishment and courage in leading a movement.

Then, when Obama lost New Hampshire, the first question on black media outlets like "The Tom Joyner Show" was whether white racism had defeated him, and when a Clinton supporter, New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, said  though not directly in connection to Obama "that politicians can't shuck and jive in early-primary states, it only added fuel to the fire.

Thursday, a key player in black South Carolina politics, Rep. Jim Clyburn, told The New York Times he?d consider endorsing Obama in response to what he considered a lack of respect in the Clinton campaign's approach to Obama.

?For him to go after Obama, using a "fairy tale," calling him as he did last week, it's an insult. And I will tell you, as an African-American, I find his tone and his words to be very depressing, Donna Brazile, a longtime Clinton ally who is neutral in this race, said on CNN earlier this week.

Asked in an e-mail from Politico about the situation Friday, she responded by sending over links to five cases in which the Clintons and their surrogates talked about Obama, along with a question:
Is Clinton using a race-baiting strategy against Obama?

Brazile later said she wasn't intending to raise the question herself, just to pass on a question that was being asked by others.

The black blogosphere was even less diplomatic, with the widely read site MediaTakeOut calling Clinton?s comment on King "explosive" and the blog Jack and Jill Politics saying it pretty much solidified the image that, whatever happened in the '90s, you are now some out-of-touch rich white folks.

There's a concern about that kind of stuff especially in the black community, said Bill Perkins, a New York state senator who is among Obama's leading supporters in Clinton's home state. The dynamic changed in New Hampshire, and all these little mistakes contribute to the general sense that this isn't a mistake.

Clinton's supporters dismiss the hubbub as the Obama campaign's strategy to woo African-American supporters in South Carolina.

?Some of the Obama people are clearly trying to use Hillary's comments about Martin Luther King and distort them into something she did not say, which is outrageous, said former Pennsylvania Rep. William Gray. It's a hot issue in South Carolina, and they're spreading the word all over. I hope that the good senator will make sure that none of his people are doing that. We don?t need to have a debate about race or gender.

Obama's national spokesman, Bill Burton, wouldn't comment on Gray's assertion.

Voters have to decide for themselves what they think about those comments, he said.

Clinton's campaign also released a statement from a deputy campaign manager, Bob Nash, defending the senator.

The stress of the political season can lead people to say outlandish things, and we assume that this was the case here. With Dr. King's birthday upon us, it's important to keep in mind that his legacy is about the things that bring us together as one people, he said.

But Lynch, the Clinton consultant who is advising Clinton's South Carolina campaign, said he wouldn't advise Clinton to fight on this terrain.

The more you kind of defend it, the worse it gets, said Lynch.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0108/7845.html
 


 
« Last Edit: January 12, 2008, 12:18:44 AM by ChristiansUnited4LessGvt »
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2008, 12:32:24 AM »
What do yo want in a president?
just curious....
Speak to this question honestly,please.

=================================
Why would I answer dishonestly?

I want an end to the stupid war in Iraq and an expos? of the profiteering that resulted from it, and an end to the oligarchy making foreign policy forever.

I want a government that will work towards more equitable incomes, and less disparity between the mega-rich and everyone else.

I want a government that does not lie, cheat and steal.

I want a fair assessment of what is happening with Medicare and Social Security and a sincere attempt to keep benefits from slipping.

I want my country to stop borrowing from China ( and others) and squandering on military and secretive plotting, dirty tricks and meddling in the affairs of other countries.

I want government funded research in sustainable energy and resource management. Solar, Tidal, Wind, Geothermal, Biomass energy should be amply funded and even susidized until it can compete. Alcohol from corn is silly, and everyone knows this.

I want a stable dollar, not one that constantly spirals down in value against the Euro, Pound and Yen.

I want decent medical care for all Americans, I am f*cking tired of hearing that we can't afford to fund cures for drugs, treatments and diseases while they piss away millions per minute in Iraq. Amei=ricans deserve the benefits of their own taxes.

I want equal treatment for Israel and the Palestinians. Israel is NOT our best ally, it is an annoying embarrassment the way he Israeli lobby steals our money to harass Palestinians, which in turn makes the rest of the world loathe us. We should realize that Israel is no more important than any other country with 4,000,000 people, and does not deserve an annual subsidy of $1,000 per head. I am not for subsidizing any other country in this amount, either.

I want a government that encourages children to learn, to be intellectually curious and to have questioning minds. More government-funded TV and radio stations could do this at a minimal cost, and DVD's and such could be distributed to those who pay a minimal fee and show promise in learning beyond the curriculum.

I want it to be easier for students from abroad to come to the US and study. We need more scientists, researchers and engineers and the post-9-11 laws are making it too hard for them to come here.

We need to do something to intellectualize the culture, which is being constantly dumbed down by the media.

I would like to see an end to infomercials, telemarketers, billboards and deceptive advertising.


That's a start. A good president could figure out how to get most of this done within the Constitution.

Also, Dick Cheney behind bars if there is any way to convict him, just to show that we aren't going to put up with assholes like him any more.



"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2008, 10:40:43 AM »


"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Cynthia

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2008, 02:40:18 PM »
What do yo want in a president?
just curious....
Speak to this question honestly,please.

=================================
Why would I answer dishonestly?

I want an end to the stupid war in Iraq and an expos? of the profiteering that resulted from it, and an end to the oligarchy making foreign policy forever.

I want a government that will work towards more equitable incomes, and less disparity between the mega-rich and everyone else.

I want a government that does not lie, cheat and steal.

I want a fair assessment of what is happening with Medicare and Social Security and a sincere attempt to keep benefits from slipping.

I want my country to stop borrowing from China ( and others) and squandering on military and secretive plotting, dirty tricks and meddling in the affairs of other countries.

I want government funded research in sustainable energy and resource management. Solar, Tidal, Wind, Geothermal, Biomass energy should be amply funded and even susidized until it can compete. Alcohol from corn is silly, and everyone knows this.

I want a stable dollar, not one that constantly spirals down in value against the Euro, Pound and Yen.

I want decent medical care for all Americans, I am f*cking tired of hearing that we can't afford to fund cures for drugs, treatments and diseases while they piss away millions per minute in Iraq. Amei=ricans deserve the benefits of their own taxes.

I want equal treatment for Israel and the Palestinians. Israel is NOT our best ally, it is an annoying embarrassment the way he Israeli lobby steals our money to harass Palestinians, which in turn makes the rest of the world loathe us. We should realize that Israel is no more important than any other country with 4,000,000 people, and does not deserve an annual subsidy of $1,000 per head. I am not for subsidizing any other country in this amount, either.

I want a government that encourages children to learn, to be intellectually curious and to have questioning minds. More government-funded TV and radio stations could do this at a minimal cost, and DVD's and such could be distributed to those who pay a minimal fee and show promise in learning beyond the curriculum.

I want it to be easier for students from abroad to come to the US and study. We need more scientists, researchers and engineers and the post-9-11 laws are making it too hard for them to come here.

We need to do something to intellectualize the culture, which is being constantly dumbed down by the media.

I would like to see an end to infomercials, telemarketers, billboards and deceptive advertising.


That's a start. A good president could figure out how to get most of this done within the Constitution.

Also, Dick Cheney behind bars if there is any way to convict him, just to show that we aren't going to put up with assholes like him any more.





Thank you, Xavier.
This is why I admire your posts. You get right to the point, educate, inform (no matter your side of politics) and keep your anger at a minimum...sure...ha! you're the sarcastic prince 'round here....that's true..but not anger/ frothing ranter, imo. (Henny might remind me otherwise).
 We all have *anger points* with administrations, that's for sure.
But, I think if we would all start to discuss the issues, issues that you've precisely mentioned here, instead of bitch/pitch to one another,then our nation might start to see some changes in a positive direction. I am not saying your way is the best way...but at least you have hit critical points.


Xavier, I didn't mean to imply that you wouldn't be "honest". I used the wrong word. I meant please be specific and detailed and do not hold back. It was late when I posted that....and I was a bit tired. The question just came from a hip shootin' gal. But, as an educator, I knew you would rally and help me out with answers. Thank you.
I am going to print your post and keep it for reference.... Seriously.... I think critical thoughts, wishes, and ideas need to be saved and explored instead of spit out and back to status quo anger rants. (not you...folks in general)
The one thing that stood out in my mind about your list is that the government would be doing a lot of monitoring?? Am I wrong? What is the difference between a great deal more government involvement, such as you have explained here..... and giving more power, decision making etc...the individual states?
What about the fact that income for "theater people";), and athletes is so very high, and  teachers are paid pennies in comparison?

How can government take care of the entire nation?......unfortunately, it's too late to get back all that money Bush has spent on the war.)  A war I supported  to an extent, but sadly, I have to say that the realization that democracy will stand tall in the middle east in my lifetime probably won't happen. Iran won't let it happen. Iraq will be under fire, as Israel has been for decades. One size doesn't fit all. Hate to call Bush a sucker...but perhaps he is.

« Last Edit: January 12, 2008, 03:44:53 PM by Cynthia »

Plane

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2008, 04:21:58 PM »
Quote
Then, when Obama lost New Hampshire, the first question on black media outlets like "The Tom Joyner Show" was whether white racism had defeated him, .....





Only if there are a lot of racist Democrats in a New England state.

_JS

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2008, 10:40:16 PM »
What do yo want in a president?
just curious....
Speak to this question honestly,please.

=================================
Why would I answer dishonestly?

I want an end to the stupid war in Iraq and an expos? of the profiteering that resulted from it, and an end to the oligarchy making foreign policy forever.

I want a government that will work towards more equitable incomes, and less disparity between the mega-rich and everyone else.

I want a government that does not lie, cheat and steal.

I want a fair assessment of what is happening with Medicare and Social Security and a sincere attempt to keep benefits from slipping.

I want my country to stop borrowing from China ( and others) and squandering on military and secretive plotting, dirty tricks and meddling in the affairs of other countries.

I want government funded research in sustainable energy and resource management. Solar, Tidal, Wind, Geothermal, Biomass energy should be amply funded and even susidized until it can compete. Alcohol from corn is silly, and everyone knows this.

I want a stable dollar, not one that constantly spirals down in value against the Euro, Pound and Yen.

I want decent medical care for all Americans, I am f*cking tired of hearing that we can't afford to fund cures for drugs, treatments and diseases while they piss away millions per minute in Iraq. Amei=ricans deserve the benefits of their own taxes.

I want equal treatment for Israel and the Palestinians. Israel is NOT our best ally, it is an annoying embarrassment the way he Israeli lobby steals our money to harass Palestinians, which in turn makes the rest of the world loathe us. We should realize that Israel is no more important than any other country with 4,000,000 people, and does not deserve an annual subsidy of $1,000 per head. I am not for subsidizing any other country in this amount, either.

I want a government that encourages children to learn, to be intellectually curious and to have questioning minds. More government-funded TV and radio stations could do this at a minimal cost, and DVD's and such could be distributed to those who pay a minimal fee and show promise in learning beyond the curriculum.

I want it to be easier for students from abroad to come to the US and study. We need more scientists, researchers and engineers and the post-9-11 laws are making it too hard for them to come here.

We need to do something to intellectualize the culture, which is being constantly dumbed down by the media.

I would like to see an end to infomercials, telemarketers, billboards and deceptive advertising.


That's a start. A good president could figure out how to get most of this done within the Constitution.

Also, Dick Cheney behind bars if there is any way to convict him, just to show that we aren't going to put up with assholes like him any more.

All I can say is - damn good post!
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   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
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Xavier_Onassis

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2008, 10:46:37 PM »
Then, when Obama lost New Hampshire, the first question on black media outlets like "The Tom Joyner Show" was whether white racism had defeated him, .....





Only if there are a lot of racist Democrats in a New England state.

===============================================
No doubt there are some White racists in New Hampshire, but it seems to me that Hillary Clinton, a senator from neighboring New York, and John Edwards, who has had more exposure than Obama simply managed to draw more votes than Obama. Not every vote for a White politician is of necessity a vote against a Black one, nor vice versa.

Obama has less experience than Edwards or Clinton, at least at campaigning, and he is from the Midwest. I think those are the main reasons he did not win. But still, he did get a lot of votes, If he is the Democratic candidate for President, most of those who voted for Hillary and Edwards will vote for Obama, I think.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2008, 10:47:00 PM »
"All I can say is - damn good post"

yeah lets jail political enemies because we think they are "assholes".....how fascist of you to agree JS.

pathetic!

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Re: question about hillary
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2008, 10:52:48 PM »
Should Cheney go to jail if he did indeed break the law?