The 2008 SOP Democrat stump speech

[R.R.]

We should tax Dick Cheney,  much more than we do currently.

Cheney probably paid more in taxes last year than you've ever made in your life.

As long as you are living in a dream world, using the IRS to go after your political enemies, I would love to see a 75% marginal rate slapped onto hypocrites like Rosie O'Donnell, Barbara Streisand and Micheal Moore. And watch them scream about how unfair it is. I would love it.

[Michael Tee]

<<Cheney probably paid more in taxes last year than you've ever made in your life. >>

Now why don't you tell us how much he "probably" avoided and/or evaded in taxes, which is undoubtedly more than you've ever made in your life.

[_JS]

You really want to know?  You realize Js that "poor people" don't employ many others.  They in fact are in need of "the rich" to provide the opportunities for those who don't have the initiative to go it alone.  Maybe we need a "let's appreciate the amount of taxes the rich pays" day.  The utter egregious distortions made with the class warfare garbage is enough to give a person a migraine.  The idea that the rich don't pay "their fair share" is utterly pathetic, when you look at the % amount they do, compared to "the poor".   It's a little like the conversation you were having with Prince regarding foreign employment situations.  Sticking it to "the rich" actually hurts "the poor", by taking jobs away, making more and more "poor".  Which of course feeds the notion of how the government is necessary to "fix the disparity", when in reality the greatest chance you can give "the poor" is to largely get Government out of the way.  Let the market work, let free enterprise work, let competition work. 

But playing this asanine jealousy game of emotion, and how terrible it is that there are rich people, and it's not fair that there are and we aren't, is simply immoral, in my book

First of all, it is not terrible that there are rich people and no one is jealous. The "emotional" aspects of this are entirely invented by you (and the right-wing). Ask Tee, Brass, XO if they are jealous. I suspect you already know the answer.

Second, this notion of "let the market work" and "get the government out of the way" has been tried. It was done in Chile in the 70's. It was done in Argentina, Uruguay, and Brazil at the same time. Government was cut in amazing amounts as quickly as possible. Public holdings were privatised like a fire sale at rock bottom prices. Social security was privatised, schools were turned over to the private sector, almost nothing was left for the people.

Do you know what the result was? Were the Chilean people suddenly wealthy? Were the poor suddenly better off?

No. Almost half fell below the poverty line. Half the population. Unemployment reached a third of the working population - 33%! Inflation was in the thousands of percent! The top 10% saw their wealth increase 83% during the time period of 1974 to 1990. The rest saw their wealth decrease in real terms.

That was the result of your "let the market work" and "get the government out of the way."

So forgive me if I don't believe that equality will come from Sir's theory on why the wealthy need their orifices licked. Today Chile, despite rolling back most of those ridiculous programs is still one of the worst ranking countries in terms of economic equality.

The best? Denmark, Norway, Sweden.

Are we somehow dumber than the Scandinavians? We cannot figure out how to have equality and a great quality of life? We like seeing desperately poor people? We like the concept of the rich getting richer and the poor falling by the wayside?

[R.R.]

Now why don't you tell us how much he "probably" avoided and/or evaded in taxes, which is undoubtedly more than you've ever made in your life.

Cheney didn't evade any taxes, unlike Marc Rich who the left's hero Bill Clinton pardoned.

I support a 15% flat tax that would probably make multi millions pay more in taxes than they do now. Rather than paying tax attorneys and accountants money to figure out all of the loopholes, it would be more cost effective just to pay the 15%.

[Michael Tee]

<<Cheney didn't evade any taxes . . . >>

You don't know that and I don't know that.  In any event, you didn't even address how much taxes Cheney "probably" avoided, willing though you were to hazard a guess of what he "probably" paid.

[R.R.]

You don't know that and I don't know that.

I know it because there is no evidence of it. There is evidence that Marc Rich evaded taxes, and he received a pardon from Bill Clinton, probably because Denise Rich waved her boobs in his face.

In any event, you didn't even address how much taxes Cheney "probably" avoided, willing though you were to hazard a guess of what he "probably" paid.

I avoided paying some taxes because I have a good accountant. Most people do and that isn't a big deal. It's the system we have.

Join with me and support a 15% flat tax and put accountants and tax attorneys out of business.

I stand by my original statement that Cheney probably paid more in taxes last year than JS ever made, and he gave more to charity too.

[R.R.]

Vice President Dick Cheney and his wife, Lynne, reported income of $36,086,635, on which they paid $14,295,058 in federal income taxes, or 39.6 percent.

-------------

This is from 2005. This is more than their fair share in my opinion. The Cheneys paid more in taxes in one year than JS would probably earn in 14 lifetimes.

[Michael Tee]

<<I know it [that Cheney didn't evade taxes] because there is no evidence of it.>>

According to that theory, all tax evasion is detected and evidence of it found by authorities.  There is no tax evasion that occurs without being found out.  With all due respect, that is nonsense.

<<There is evidence that Marc Rich evaded taxes, and he received a pardon from Bill Clinton, probably because Denise Rich waved her boobs in his face.>>

You don't know that, either.  You've never even seen Denise Rich's boobs.

<<Most people do [avoid paying taxes] and that isn't a big deal. It's the system we have.>>

So if it's no big deal, how come you avoided telling us how much tax Cheney "probably" avoided paying?

<<Join with me and support a 15% flat tax and put accountants and tax attorneys out of business. >>

You don't need a flat tax, you just need a tax that'll make the rich pay more; and you'd never put accountants and tax attorneys out of business, even with a flat tax on income - - they'd be up all night, figuring out the new basics - - what's "flat" mean, what's "tax" mean, what's "flat tax" mean, what's income, what's tax, how many way does the flat tax violate the Constitution , what other statutes does it violate, etc., etc., etc.  It never ends.


<<I stand by my original statement that Cheney probably paid more in taxes last year than JS ever made, and he gave more to charity too.>>

That's OK, I stand by the idea that he probably avoided and/or evaded more tax than YOU ever made in YOUR life and that he never gave a nickel in charity that didn't earn him a further tax break.  This clown doesn't even want to give his own daughter the same civil rights that every other American enjoys, and he's suddenly a great philanthropist?  What's his favourite charity, Fags Fry in Hell?

[Michael Tee]

<<Vice President Dick Cheney and his wife, Lynne, reported income of $36,086,635, on which they paid $14,295,058 in federal income taxes, or 39.6 percent.>>

What?  This guy pockets $22 MILLION after taxes, for a good year's work, and that's FAIR?  45 (or is it now 47) million Americans without health care, and Cheney and thousands of guys like him get to pocket $22 million, or just under $450,000 per week for a good week's work.  You show me anybody whose work is worth $450,000 per week.  This is positively obscene.  His tax rate oughtta be 98%, but what the hell, let it be 96%, THAT is a fair tax rate.

It's unbelievable what kind of shit you people are willing to put up with from your ruling class.  You have to be the biggest suckers the world has ever known.

[_JS]

Vice President Dick Cheney and his wife, Lynne, reported income of $36,086,635, on which they paid $14,295,058 in federal income taxes, or 39.6 percent.

-------------

This is from 2005. This is more than their fair share in my opinion. The Cheneys paid more in taxes in one year than JS would probably earn in 14 lifetimes.

Erm...so what?

This makes Dick Cheney somehow a better human being? The fact that Cheney is wealthier is supposed to upset me, or something, I think it is rather common knowledge that Cheney is in the top 1%.

And that means what exactly?

By the way RR, don't come on here and make shit up.

VICE PRESIDENT DICK CHENEY AND MRS. CHENEY

RELEASE 2006 INCOME TAX RETURN


Vice President and Mrs. Cheney filed their federal income tax return for 2006 today.

The income tax return shows that the Cheneys owe federal taxes for 2006 of $413,326 on taxable income of $1,614,862. During the course of 2006 the Cheneys paid $464,789 in taxes through withholding and estimated tax payments. The Cheneys elected to apply the resulting $51,463 tax overpayment to their 2007 estimated tax payments.

The wage and salary income reported on the tax return includes the Vice President?s $208,575 government salary. In addition, the tax return reports a pension benefit of $27,500, which the Vice President received as a former director of Union Pacific Corporation. The Vice President became eligible for this benefit in 2006 when he turned 65. The tax return also reports Mrs. Cheney?s book royalty income, which includes a partial royalty advance on a book she is writing about growing up in Wyoming. It also reports wage and salary income from her continuing work at the American Enterprise Institute and a pension benefit of $32,000, which she received as a former director of Reader?s Digest. The amounts of the pension benefits received by the Vice President and by Mrs. Cheney are fixed and will not increase or decrease based on changes in the earnings or revenues of either company.

That is a total tax percentage of 25.6%, not 39.6%. Do you even know how income tax works?

[R.R.]

According to that theory, all tax evasion is detected and evidence of it found by authorities.  There is no tax evasion that occurs without being found out.  With all due respect, that is nonsense.

Unless you have some type of proof that Cheney evaded taxes, you are lying. With all respect.

You don't know that, either.  You've never even seen Denise Rich's boobs.

Yes I have. They are probably behind Marc Rich's pardon.

So if it's no big deal, how come you avoided telling us how much tax Cheney "probably" avoided paying?

It's no doubt less than John Kerry and his wife "probably" avoided.

You don't need a flat tax, you just need a tax that'll make the rich pay more;

How much should Cheney pay? He's already paying close to 40%.

and you'd never put accountants and tax attorneys out of business, even with a flat tax on income

There would be no use for their services because you could fill out your own taxes on an index card.

"That's OK, I stand by the idea that he probably avoided and/or evaded more tax than YOU ever made in YOUR life and that he never gave a nickel in charity that didn't earn him a further tax break."  

Cheney already paid his fair share in taxes.

This clown doesn't even want to give his own daughter the same civil rights that every other American enjoys, and he's suddenly a great philanthropist?  What's his favourite charity, Fags Fry in Hell?

Cheney supports civil unions.

[_JS]

How much should Cheney pay? He's already paying close to 40%.

No, he's paying 25.6%.

[R.R.]

The fact that Cheney is wealthier is supposed to upset me, or something

I think is does upset you. You are probably jealous.

[R.R.]

No, he's paying 25.6%.

He paid close to 40% in '05. He paid millions of dollars in taxes that year. He paid close to $500k last year. He paid more money in taxes than you could ever dream of earning.

He should pay no more than 15% and neither should you.

[_JS]

No, he's paying 25.6%.

He paid close to 40% in '05. He paid millions of dollars in taxes that year. He paid close to $500k last year. He paid more money in taxes than you could ever dream of earning.

He should pay no more than 15% and neither should you.

Again you are just making things up. Don't lie about public information.

Here is the Cheney's tax return for 2005:

Tax Document

The Cheney's earned $8.824 million and paid $529,636 in taxes. They actually qualified for a $1.79 million refund.

Got any more bullshit?