Author Topic: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?  (Read 3666 times)

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The_Professor

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Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« on: January 26, 2008, 05:50:42 PM »
In many ways, it?s been a strange campaign up to this point. But it could get a lot stranger.

Consider this: What if we go through the Florida primary and Super Tuesday and the race between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama remains as tight as it?s been? For the primaries, Democrats have the same rules in every state: delegates are awarded in proportion to the vote ? meaning no winner-take-all. If Clinton and Obama continue to split the vote in many states, it?s possible we could get to late spring or early summer and neither candidate would have enough delegates to secure the nomination.

And that?s assuming they get that far without destroying each other with their increasingly nasty bickering. There just might be an opening for someone else to step in and unify the party. Oh, you know, like say maybe Al Gore.

Gore insists he won?t run despite a movement called ?draft-Gore-dot-com? that?s calling on him to ?transcend politics as usual and bring real hope to our country and to the world.? As recently as last month, the former vice president said he has ?no plans to be a candidate.? But being a politician he added, ?I see no reason to rule it out entirely.?

Also, it?s worth noting Gore has not backed either Clinton or Obama so far, and a recent report indicated that an endorsement by Gore is looking less likely. Former advisers suggest the Nobel Prize catapulted Gore to a new national and international standing that could possibly be tarnished by taking sides in the primary battle.

Here?s my question to you: If the Democrats have trouble picking between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, should Al Gore consider entering the race?

http://caffertyfile.blogs.cnn.com/2008/01/25/room-for-al-gore-in-the-race/
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modestyblase

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2008, 06:05:42 PM »
If Clinton and Obama continue to split the vote in many states, it?s possible we could get to late spring or early summer and neither candidate would have enough delegates to secure the nomination.

Yeah, thats why brokered conventions exist.  ::)

Al Gore isn't going to run, nor should he. He's accomplishing and doing what he wants now-being president would interfere with that.

Plane

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2008, 11:29:00 AM »
Al Gore could depend on getting the "Anybody but Bush " vote but so can they all , of course President Bush isn't running but his unpopularity will be a drag on the party anyhow.

Al Gore could also count on loseing the "Anybody but a Cliton" vote almost as badly as Hillary ,Bill is in the baggage.

I don't see where Al would have much advantage over Obama , as a caadate for "change" what does a lot of exprience and wonkishness count for?

Barak Obama is proveing to be an inspireing orator , this is highly valuable , there are a lot of apathetic voters who might become motivated if they could be reached and inspired success at that would be better than captureing any one voteing block or loseing any one voteing block , the apathetic non voter is a little less than half of the present electroate ruseing them would not be easy , it is worth a try tho.

Michael Tee

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2008, 11:41:31 AM »
Sorta reminds me of RFK jumping into the race after Eugene McCarthy had acquired some momentum as the Democratic candidate for change.  The difference being that RFK had a hundred times the charisma of Gene McCarthy and Algore would be coming in with a ton of Washington baggage.  I like Al, but his time has come and gone.  He could contribute to change by endorsing Obama, but I imagine that would be tough to do in view of the loyalty he undoubtedly feels for Bill at least, and very likely for Hillary as well.

The_Professor

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2008, 11:52:44 AM »
Al Gore could depend on getting the "Anybody but Bush " vote but so can they all , of course President Bush isn't running but his unpopularity will be a drag on the party anyhow.

Al Gore could also count on loseing the "Anybody but a Cliton" vote almost as badly as Hillary ,Bill is in the baggage.

I don't see where Al would have much advantage over Obama , as a caadate for "change" what does a lot of exprience and wonkishness count for?

Barak Obama is proveing to be an inspireing orator , this is highly valuable , there are a lot of apathetic voters who might become motivated if they could be reached and inspired success at that would be better than captureing any one voteing block or loseing any one voteing block , the apathetic non voter is a little less than half of the present electroate ruseing them would not be easy , it is worth a try tho.

However, an Obama win is really a win for McCain. Why? I really wonder if many people in this country (not only in the South!), will vote for a black for President, regardless what they say in the polls? I lived in the Northeast for twenty-fie years and racism exists there; it just exists in a different form than in many places in the Dixie South.

You can talk a "diversity line", but when the rubber meets the road, it simply won't happen, enough anyway.

Don't get me wrong; this is a setback for the nation since the amount of melanin in a person's skin should not determine these issues. Even the Bible states this "There is neither Jew nor Greek..." If God looks at us all the same, then shouldn't we do the same toward each other?
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Michael Tee

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2008, 12:54:07 PM »
<<Don't get me wrong; this is a setback for the nation since the amount of melanin in a person's skin should not determine these issues. Even the Bible states this "There is neither Jew nor Greek..." If God looks at us all the same, then shouldn't we do the same toward each other?>>

Not so much a set-back as a snapshot in time.

White racism creates black racism.  Which creates more white racism, which creates more black racism.  The good news, I guess, is that the whole process is slowly losing steam.  White racism is probably the major curse of American society.  It's dying out, but not as fast as everyone would like, and the elections aren't really milestones in the process, they're just pulse-taking times.

Obama's candidacy, and the degree of success it's had to date, are an indicator of how far your country has come since, say, 1950, the mid-point of the last century.  It's like the old half-empty or half-full quandary - - look how far we've come in combating racism AND  awww, shit, why is there this big racial divide?

Plane

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2008, 12:57:21 PM »
I hope Obama looses , I hope it isn't because he is black that he looses.

Presents a quandry , what do you tell someone who is spending his vote the same way you are ,but for reasons you disagree with?

Michael Tee

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #7 on: January 27, 2008, 01:06:58 PM »
Congratulate him on his wisdom and perspecuity.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #8 on: January 27, 2008, 01:27:54 PM »
I hope Obama looses , I hope it isn't because he is black that he looses.

==========================================================
What would be your favorite reason for Obama to lose, then?

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

modestyblase

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2008, 01:39:30 PM »
However, an Obama win is really a win for McCain. Why? I really wonder if many people in this country (not only in the South!), will vote for a black for President, regardless what they say in the polls? I lived in the Northeast for twenty-fie years and racism exists there; it just exists in a different form than in many places in the Dixie South.

You can talk a "diversity line", but when the rubber meets the road, it simply won't happen, enough anyway.

Don't get me wrong; this is a setback for the nation since the amount of melanin in a person's skin should not determine these issues. Even the Bible states this "There is neither Jew nor Greek..." If God looks at us all the same, then shouldn't we do the same toward each other?

I really don't think it has as much to do with racism as most people would assume. It really is, odd as it sounds, a North/South issue.
Southern democrats are notoriously conservative. It is not unheard of for southern dems to assume that since that democrat is from the north, he "may be too liberal, and we aren't going to back him".

As for blatant racism between blacks&whites? I see that less and less. It exists, but now they are all keeping it in private(albeit, I've become very sheltered by choice, so this view may certainly seem limited to others). And any smart person, racist or not personally, isn't going to vote against someone *just* because of their race.

What do you mean by racism in a different form, to calrify? I don't like assuming(usually).

White racism creates black racism.  Which creates more white racism, which creates more black racism.  The good news, I guess, is that the whole process is slowly losing steam.  White racism is probably the major curse of American society.  It's dying out, but not as fast as everyone would like, and the elections aren't really milestones in the process, they're just pulse-taking times.

Obama's candidacy, and the degree of success it's had to date, are an indicator of how far your country has come since, say, 1950, the mid-point of the last century.  It's like the old half-empty or half-full quandary - - look how far we've come in combating racism AND  awww, shit, why is there this big racial divide?

Racism today is less "Whites/Blacks are superior" and more of "Well, we're all [insert race], we should stick together" sort. Sadly some of the most awful forms of racism I've witnessed in my lifetime are intraracial. Either way, tribalism and prejudice will *never* go away. It can become less bigoted, or more bigoted, but it will always remain.
I wouldn't say white racism is the worst curse, btw, espeically in this circumstance-I'd say irrationality is, and any mention of race in the "divisive" context stems from irrationality.

&why half-empty or half-full? I prefer thinking of it as halfway to another glass.

yellow_crane

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2008, 03:28:48 PM »



The Obama win in South Carolina, and the overwhelming numbers, were brought about by the actions of Bill Clinton in the last four or five days before the votes were cast.

Bill, often self-defeating in his ego's cavalier strut, and always unable to help himself when old buttons are touched (adult-child), tried to get real subtle in introducing racism into the mix.  It backfired.

As a side comment, I shall, as time goes on, look to see if his free pass in Harlem will be called in, due to new reports on his credibility payments.

What was entirely refreshing was to see South Carolina reject such sleazy puppeteering by the Clinton campaign.

The Clinton's campaign tactics, which pivot on creating and utilizing divisiveness, have come neck and neck to the other front runner in that particular genre--Karl Rove.  Democrats and their advocates shall have to think twice before raising the spectre's of Rove's ruthlessness and divisiveness from now on--post Bill's frenzied patrician miscalculations. In trying to edge open the door just a little, he let in too much light.

South Carolinians rejected Bill's manipulation, even to the extend that they surprised themselves in actually marking their x in the Black man's box.

A paradigm shift occured here.  All of a sudden, racism in American politics seems to no longer be defined by William Jefferson Clinton.

Unless Hillary retires her lifetime love and, lately, sometimes liability, his
proxy MEisms, she will be the final collateral damage in his misguided efforts.

His relentless efforts to repair in the last minute the threat from Obama now leave little doubt as to how neutral and uninvolved he plans to be should she be elected.  That now will cost Hillary, as fewer will buy now his claims of nonparticipation in the affairs of state.

The tidal wave that shall win this election is the same wave that sent new Democrats and retired old Republicans in the last house race.

That tidal wave was rebuffed and insulted by those they elected, and Pelosi and others now have their credibility in the toilet.

Obama, though, seems to have connected with the voters that fundamental change is needed, and he--unlike those Democratic shills who quickly became dysfunctional the minute the remaining clout of the Republican/Abramoff stronghold proved it still had the sand to control criticism of the war, which is a subset to the imperialistic standard now carried by the invisible powers that now control our country--seems to have convinced Americans that their tidal wave deserves a second chance.

I myself am elated that the Clinton machine has run itself on the beach.   It will again unless they retire the unofficial captain of their ship.

I have no doubt they will be back in the water, but their tactics, now introduced into the sunlight of joe sixpack's comprehension, will either change or prove a deathknell for their hopes at regaining the White House.

That is possibly the only good gain to come from Bill's too-crafty political smugness.




Michael Tee

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2008, 03:40:48 PM »
<<That tidal wave was rebuffed and insulted by those they elected, and Pelosi and others now have their credibility in the toilet.>>

Very true, but where is Obama's pledge to pull all troops out in the first 90 days?

The_Professor

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2008, 03:43:59 PM »
Excellent analysis, Crane.

But, is Bill Clinton's shenanigans enough to get Obama the nod? OR, just a major bump in the road?
« Last Edit: January 27, 2008, 04:38:31 PM by The_Professor »
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                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

modestyblase

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2008, 03:52:02 PM »
Quote
Bill, often self-defeating in his ego's cavalier strut, and always unable to help himself when old buttons are touched (adult-child), tried to get real subtle in introducing racism into the mix.

Didn't seem too subtle to me. How do you know it wasn't done purposely? Have you considered how it may benefit Hilde in the long run?

Quote
As a side comment, I shall, as time goes on, look to see if his free pass in Harlem will be called in, due to new reports on his credibility payments.

Yep, he used a tactic. Ever read the 36 Strategies? He carried a few out quite well with this. I'm duly impressed, haha, but yeah they may outright discriminate against him because of his strategic savvy.

Quote
What was entirely refreshing was to see South Carolina reject such sleazy puppeteering by the Clinton campaign.

Oh, I'd venture to say the Clintons got exactly what they wanted.

Quote
Unless Hillary retires her lifetime love and, lately, sometimes liability, his
proxy MEisms, she will be the final collateral damage in his misguided efforts...That now will cost Hillary, as fewer will buy now his claims of nonparticipation in the affairs of state.

How so? Nonparticipation, ha. Everyone banking on Hilde getting in office wants that outcome because he will be just as influential with her presidency as she was with his. Not bad years, as I recall.

Quote
Obama, though, seems to have connected with the voters that fundamental change is needed

Yes, I hear that all the time. Odd that not even his supporters can discuss how he could bring change, what in his past leads them to believe he can bring change, etc. Nearly all the ones I have spoken to allude to his race within the first three minutes when challenged by my "OK, sell him to me. Make your case. Why should I support him?" statements. Damn poor way to judge a man, imo.

The_Professor

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Re: Should Al Gore Enter the Race?
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2008, 04:42:38 PM »
"Yes, I hear that all the time. Odd that not even his supporters can discuss how he could bring change, what in his past leads them to believe he can bring change, etc. Nearly all the ones I have spoken to allude to his race within the first three minutes when challenged by my "OK, sell him to me. Make your case. Why should I support him?" statements. Damn poor way to judge a man, imo."

Well, if nothing else, voting for him votes AGAINST the Part's apparatus, aka the backroom deals from The Man.

Never give up an opportunity to ZIP The Man, I always say.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2008, 05:06:31 PM by The_Professor »
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D