Author Topic: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'  (Read 2174 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

The_Professor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1735
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« on: February 15, 2008, 08:42:13 PM »
Bloomberg Rips Government Over Failing Economy
NYC Mayor: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'

NEW YORK (CBS/AP) ― Mayor Michael Bloomberg has unleashed another flurry of jabs on Washington, ridiculing the federal government's rebate checks as being "like giving a drink to an alcoholic" on Thursday, and said the presidential candidates are looking for easy solutions to complex economic problems.

The billionaire and potential independent presidential candidate also said the nation "has a balance sheet that's starting to look more and more like a third-world country."

President Bush signed legislation Wednesday that will result in cash rebates ranging from $300 to $1,200 for more than 130 million people.

The federal checks are the centerpiece of the government's emergency effort to stimulate the economy, under the theory that most people will spend the money right away.

But Bloomberg does not believe it will do much good. And his harsh words at a news conference Thursday reflect the view among some of his associates that the country's economic woes present a unique opportunity for him to launch a third-party bid for the White House.

The theory among those urging him to run for president is that a businessman who rose from Wall Street to build his own financial information empire might be particularly appealing as the fiscal crisis worsens.

Publicly, Bloomberg says he is "not a candidate," and explained recently he is speaking out on national issues as part of an "experiment" to influence the dialogue in the race.

His tirade against the candidates and the economic stimulus package on Thursday began when he was asked how that experiment is going.

In his answer, he praised Democrat Barack Obama for the plan the Illinois senator outlined on Wednesday that would create a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank to rebuild highways, bridges, airports and other public projects. Obama projects it could generate nearly 2 million jobs.

Last month, Bloomberg and Govs. Arnold Schwarzenegger of California and Ed Rendell of Pennsylvania announced a coalition that would urge more investment in infrastructure.

"I don't know whether Senator Obama looked to see what I've been advocating, or not -- you'll have to ask him -- but he's doing the right thing," Bloomberg said.

But then the mayor went on to say that while the presidential candidates appear to be talking more about the economy now, they are looking for quick fixes to please voters instead of focusing on the roots of the problem.

"Nobody wants to sit there and say, 'Well there's no easy solution,"' Bloomberg said. "They want to send out a check to everybody to stimulate the economy. I suppose it won't hurt the economy but it's in many senses like giving a drink to an alcoholic."

A spokesman for the mayor said later that Bloomberg was trying to say Washington can't stop itself from spending, and was not insinuating that Americans who receive checks are part of the problem.

The mayor last month said the economic stimulus package was shortsighted, and presented his own views on where the federal government should be focusing its attention. Specifically, he said the government should adopt a capital budget to oversee long-term infrastructure spending, instead of the current year-to-year spending.

It should also offer financial counseling, modified loans, and in some cases, subsidized loans to homeowners who find themselves unable to afford their mortgages.

He says that the government should also think differently about immigration, and that bringing more workers in rather than keeping them out is the key to long term economic stability.
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2008, 10:12:30 AM »
<<He says that the government should also think differently about immigration, and that bringing more workers in rather than keeping them out is the key to long term economic stability.>>

I agree with that but "long-term" can make for a pretty painful short term.

Stray Pooch

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 860
  • Pray tell me, sir, whose dog are you?
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2008, 12:16:00 PM »
I agree with that but "long-term" can make for a pretty painful short term.

Yeah, but better a painful short-term followed by a prosperous long-term than vice versa.

I'm glad someone is finally talking about infrastructure with some concept of seriousness.  If the commies/mullahs/bug-eyed monsters ever invaded our country, they would try to disrupt lines of communication by taking out bridges, roadways, etc.  Without any help from the bad guys we could do that ourselves through simple neglect.

One of the actual GOOD things that FDR did was the WPA and CCC.  They were TEMPORARY programs to put people to work while building both infrastructure and service projects like the Skyline Drive and Shenandoah National Park here in Virginia.  Unlike Social Security and taxes, we are not still bearing the fiscal burden of those programs, but we are still reaping the benefits. 
Oh, for a muse of fire, that would ascend the brightest heaven of invention . . .

fatman

  • Guest
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2008, 12:29:49 PM »
"They want to send out a check to everybody to stimulate the economy. I suppose it won't hurt the economy but it's in many senses like giving a drink to an alcoholic."

You want to know what's like giving a drink to an alcoholic?  State and Federal intervention into this subprime mess, that's what.  Just because a lot of people thought home ownership was a right (it isn't), they eschewed the traditional methods of saving up a down payment and strengthening their credit and bought a house on a zero down ARM.  The key part of ARM is adjustable, did they not understand that?  If I'm going to drop $200,000+ on any kind of purchase, I'm going to want to know the ins and outs of that purchase.  This is beside the fact that in most of these cases the people bought far more house than they needed (or could afford).  And before some folks in here start saying, "Well, it was the bank's fault, a lot of time they didn't verify income blah blah blah", the bank shouldn't HAVE to verify your income if you know what you can afford and what you can't.  I mean really, how fricking stupid do you have to be?  There are first time home buyer's classes, minimally priced community college courses, and an array of info on the net and in your library on buying a home.  I know, I saved up and worked on my credit until I could get into a home with a decent mortgage, and I went to one of those classes and looked the info up, to see what my payment would be.  The first two houses I looked at were barely out of my price range, but guess what, they were out of my price range! 

It's time people stopped worrying about status objects and started living within their means.  If your means aren't enough, go back to school so that you can get a better job.  I did that too.  Now because some people were either A) stupid  B) lazy or C) ignorant, the Fed and states want to intervene on their behalf, using the public dollar.

Now that's giving a drink to an alcoholic.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2008, 01:48:36 PM »
When I first went out house-hunting in 1977, I told the realtor that every house theat I would look at would have to be for under $32K. In a week, she gave me a list of houses between $34K and $45K, because she had decided that I could afford them. I ditched her and tried two more realtors, with the same result. The median home price in the county at that time was $35K, and I only wanted a two-bedroom detached house with a carport, so I knew they were full of it.

Finally I assumed a loan on a house priced at $31.5, with a garage apartment I rented out for 15 years.

It's hard as hell to get any sort of cooperation from real estate clowns. Not one could tell me the school district or the square footage of any house.

I imagine that a large number of people just cave in and buy houses they can't afford. True, it's their fault in the long run, but they are guided every step of the way to their doom.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

fatman

  • Guest
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2008, 01:53:21 PM »
I had a similar experience XO, I was looking for raw land or land with utilities that I could build on, figuring that building a smaller house myself (or most of it anyway, I didn't do the foundation or electrical) would be cheaper than buying.  Some of the agents I worked with wouldn't listen to what I wanted, simply tried to sell me something higher because they thought I could afford it.

And yes, it is the buyer's fault for falling for it.  If you're going to spend that kind of money, often the single most important purchase of a person's life, you should know what you want and can afford and settle for nothing less.

The_Professor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1735
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2008, 01:55:40 PM »
Let's regain some sense of history and perspective, shall we? In days past, not ALL that many days, it was safe to purchase a home and reasonably expect it to increase dramatically in value and sell it five years down the road for a significant increase.

Now it is not. People may just be a little slow to catch on to that fact.
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2008, 02:01:41 PM »
In any event, it is still cheaper to buy a home with 10% down and sell it in 5 years than to rent one in most of the country.
Homeowners can deduct their interest, landlords cannot, and in many places there are other tax incentives to buy a home.

It is unwise to buy a too-big home as some sort of 'investment'. It is a lot wiser to buy what you need, and invest the rest in a Roth IRA.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

The_Professor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1735
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2008, 02:05:03 PM »
So true, XO.

People do this all the time when they purchase cars too expensive for them. Consumerism run amok?
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

The_Professor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1735
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2008, 02:17:19 PM »
"They want to send out a check to everybody to stimulate the economy. I suppose it won't hurt the economy but it's in many senses like giving a drink to an alcoholic."

You want to know what's like giving a drink to an alcoholic?  State and Federal intervention into this subprime mess, that's what.

PRECISELY........absolutely asanine      >:(

 
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Rich

  • Guest
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2008, 02:20:31 PM »
>>It's hard as hell to get any sort of cooperation from real estate clowns.<<

Once again, somebody else's fault.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2008, 03:11:23 PM »
>>It's hard as hell to get any sort of cooperation from real estate clowns.<<

Once again, somebody else's fault.

==============================================
Most people cannot find a house without real estate clowns. They have exclusive contracts on nearly all the houses available. They generally refuse to show any house below what they have determined is the highest price you can afford. And they add from three to eight percent to the price of the house in commissions.

I managed to avoid them, but I am the only person I know who has in dozens of cases.

Go ahead, try it. I double-dog dare you.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2008, 03:14:58 PM »
Can't help but notice how self promoting elitists are somehow able to handle the stresses and pitfals of life, but for others.....well, liberal elites simply know better, and so Government is necessary to take care of it, because obviously you can't          :-\
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

fatman

  • Guest
Re: U.S. Resembling A 'Third-World Country'
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2008, 03:43:32 PM »
They generally refuse to show any house below what they have determined is the highest price you can afford

One of the most helpful things that I found is that you can get the MLS #'s online and go from there, that's pretty much what I ended up doing (although I bought unlisted acreage next to the acreage I was looking at, instead of the acreage I was looking at).  Now I'm looking at buying a piece of property in Eastern Washington, for when I retire 35 years (hopefully) down the road.  I can go online, get pictures of the properties, find out what improvements they have, etc.  This is a major help.

Let's regain some sense of history and perspective, shall we? In days past, not ALL that many days, it was safe to purchase a home and reasonably expect it to increase dramatically in value and sell it five years down the road for a significant increase.

And this is part of the problem.  A first home should be not only an investment, but a home.  Too many people think, "Oh, I can afford this, I'll just sell when my payment adjusts, etc.".  That is seriously flawed and ignorant thinking.  I think that it was also the fuel behind the fire of the rapidly increasing housing prices, which also tanked in some places (they haven't yet here in WA, although they've slowed).

Now it is not. People may just be a little slow to catch on to that fact.

And the government should bail them out because they were slow to catch that? (I'm asking a question because I don't know your position).