Author Topic: Maybe I Should Move to California  (Read 11843 times)

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kimba1

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2008, 05:14:58 PM »
arnold was the only known candidate who actually did well in most things he put his mind into
d to z list celebrities tend not to be in that catagory
alot of people don`t care for arnold .but he does show results

sirs

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2008, 05:36:57 PM »
What results, Kimba?  Besides a budget deficit thats exponentially worse than what Gray Davis was recalled for, what results would you be referring to??
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2008, 06:44:25 PM »
Arnold is exciting. Gray Davis was dull.
If we judge politics as entertainment, then Arnold is superior. Perhaps the best governor anywhere.
I think he's more exciting than Jesse Ventura.
If a film is a bit overbudget, that is not really seen as a disadvantage. It's all a matter of perspective, isn't it?

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kimba1

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2008, 07:07:01 PM »
results is a inaccurate word
I meant he`s comparative more action oriented.
meaning his actions are more public.
he has for a few year tried to keep the film industry in california to his failure.
it`s doubtful anyone else would be this noticable.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2008, 10:37:07 PM »
I would prefer that this not be on the same ballot as the presidential race.

LOL, I can certainly understand that since it goes against the people's will
I hope the democrats make this a central theme of the Fall campaign.
Lets see how well gay marriage sells?
Put your money where your mouth is.
However I notice both Democratic Presidential candidates Hillary & Obama claim they do not support same sex marriage.
They can read polls.
Wow are they homophobes too?
 ::)
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Universe Prince

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2008, 11:10:14 PM »
What I find interesting about the ruling is that the judges compare this ruling on same-sex marriage to the ruling that, decades ago, allowed interracial marriage in California. One hopes this is a sign of things to come.
Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.
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fatman

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2008, 11:11:52 PM »
LOL, I can certainly understand that since it goes against the people's will

The people's will isn't everything.  If it were we would probably still have bans on interracial marriage.  The judiciary has many jobs, one of them is to protect the rights of the minority against the tyranny of the majority.

I hope the democrats make this a central theme of the Fall campaign.

They probably won't, but I'd lay money that some Republicans will.

Lets see how well gay marriage sells?

That's why CA will have a ballot initiative.

Put your money where your mouth is.


I just did.  I wrote a large check to Lambda Legal.  Anything else?

However I notice both Democratic Presidential candidates Hillary & Obama claim they do not support same sex marriage.

They say no such thing.  They believe the matter should be left to the states, and out of the Federal Government's rather incompetent hands.  Anything else you want to misquote?

They can read polls.

Polls have what to do with this?  Most Americans don't support the war in Iraq.  How's that working out?

Wow are they homophobes too?

Who called anyone a homophobe?  Or are you just talking out of your rather unintelligent ass again?


fatman

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2008, 11:17:53 PM »
What I find interesting about the ruling is that the judges compare this ruling on same-sex marriage to the ruling that, decades ago, allowed interracial marriage in California. One hopes this is a sign of things to come.

Actually Prince, the thing that interested me the most is how the Justices (three of the four voting for the majority were Republican appointees) turned the argument around on the anti-gay marriage folks.  The judges pretty much blew their argument against gays raising children and having committed relationships out of the water (see my bold reference in the original article).  That in itself gives me a lot of hope on the matter.  And the previous ruling by the SCOC on interracial marriage is what they based this decision on.

I too hope this is a sign of things to come, though I realize that progress will be slow.  I do believe though, as Newsom said, that it is inevitable.  40 years ago gays were being hospitalized for homosexuality.  We've come a long ways in the past 40 years.

Amianthus

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2008, 11:31:49 PM »
However I notice both Democratic Presidential candidates Hillary & Obama claim they do not support same sex marriage.

They say no such thing.  They believe the matter should be left to the states, and out of the Federal Government's rather incompetent hands.  Anything else you want to misquote?

[snip]

Wow are they homophobes too?

Who called anyone a homophobe?  Or are you just talking out of your rather unintelligent ass again?

When a Republican candidate made a claim that this matter should should be left to the states, it was widely touted around here as a clear sign that said candidate was a homophobe. Because, after all, the states can't make a good decision, it requires federal action...
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

fatman

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #24 on: May 16, 2008, 11:39:37 PM »
When a Republican candidate made a claim that this matter should should be left to the states, it was widely touted around here as a clear sign that said candidate was a homophobe. Because, after all, the states can't make a good decision, it requires federal action...

I can't speak for the people that said that, because I wasn't one of them.  Nor do I agree with that sentiment at all, with the exception that the Federal Govt should recognize that union (if the state does) for taxation purposes.

I do find it funny that CU4 can't even be bothered to do a google search on the candidate's positions before he opens his yap.  I find it even funnier that he throws out the homophobe slam before I (as far as I know, the sole gay person in this forum) does.  Well, I guess that's not really funny, because I don't call people who disagree with me homophobes, unless their beliefs merit that term.  I've never used it here, and to have someone else ascribe it to a candidate because of a misquote or flat out untruth is offensive.

No offense.

Universe Prince

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #25 on: May 17, 2008, 02:00:41 AM »

LOL, I can certainly understand that since it goes against the people's will


While I understand the use of it, to a degree anyway, I find I'm getting a little tired of people talking about what is supposedly "the people's will" or "the will of the people". What that usually seems to mean is, if you're not in the supposed majority, then your opinion, your voice, your will does not matter. Notice, it isn't "the will of the majority" or "the will of a lot of people". It's "the will of the people". Now I understand this is a common term, and I would never say that use of it necessarily means the user intended it to mean that other people's opinion doesn't count. Still, I find the commonality of the term troubling.

Anyway, I also find the use of the term in this matter somewhat silly. The public debate on same-sex marriage continues, clearly indicating that the supposed "will of the people" is only the will of some people. Perhaps a majority, but perhaps not. But the other thing about the use of the term "the will of the people" is that as a libertarian, I don't believe that a majority of people should be allowed to interfere with the rights of other people. (No, not talking about stopping people who perform criminal acts that violate the rights of other people, like murder and all that jazz; and you, O reader, know that by now, but I still have to say this before someone tries the old "do anything they want" routine.) So as far as I am concerned "the will of the people" comment is one of the weakest possible arguments that could be used on this issue.



Lets see how well gay marriage sells?


Actually, by the time opposition gets around to doing much about this, it might just be seeing how well the breaking up the marriage of homosexual friends sells. And I imagine it would not sell very well.


Wow are they homophobes too?


Tad bit defensive there?
Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.
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Christians4LessGvt

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #26 on: May 17, 2008, 11:30:02 AM »
"However I notice both Democratic Presidential candidates Hillary & Obama claim they
do not support same sex marriage". They say no such thing.  They believe the matter should
be left to the states, and out of the Federal Government's rather incompetent hands. 
Anything else you want to misquote?


 ::)


Hillary Clinton:
Opposes same-sex marriage but supports civil unions.
Barack Obama
Opposes same-sex marriage, but also opposes a constitutional ban.
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/issues/issues.samesexmarriage.html



WASHINGTON : Gay marriage is an issue on which the three major presidential candidates
John McCain, Barack Obama and Hillary Rodham Clinton  are pretty much in agreement.
All oppose it, while saying at the same time that same-sex couples should generally
be entitled to the legal protections afforded married couples. All think the decision should be left to the states.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/16/us/politics/16gay.html?bl&ex=1211169600&en=a764d9dbcd4dcc63&ei=5087%0A



......the gays who stage those weddings will still be filing separate 1040s.
That's not going to change any time soon, since both John McCain and Barack Obama
(and, for that matter, Hillary Rodham Clinton) share the same position on equality for gay couples:
they oppose it
. Neither candidate would end federal discrimination against gays who want to marry.
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1807109,00.html




Democratic presidential candidates Senator Hillary Clinton of New York and
Senator Barack Obama of Illinois oppose same-sex marriage while supporting civil unions.
McCain opposes gay marriage.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aKQQVVk7kdXc&refer=home




"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

The_Professor

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #27 on: May 17, 2008, 11:51:51 AM »
Given the current financial black hole it's sinking into.....I wouldn't recommend it
----------------------------

I doubt that living in a state whose government is in some sort of deficit is any sort of major problem for anyone not dependent on the state. All they can do is tax you.
I thought Arnold was going to save the day for California , being a fiscally responsible Republican and all...

A bad day on the beach in the winter in CA is better than a good day in ND, after all.

He's tried...but the level of expectations (from the government coffers) of the common man is simply unsustainable. The money is simply not there.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2008, 04:02:44 PM by The_Professor »
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Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #28 on: May 17, 2008, 10:27:26 PM »
The money is there, alright. It is holing up in numerous banks in Orange County and Malibu.
The legislature is just having trouble getting it to come out and play.


Even so, the state of California's budget is probably not likely to cause fatman any major problems, should he choose to immigrate to the Golden State.


"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: Maybe I Should Move to California
« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2008, 02:14:59 AM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erica-jong/hurrah-for-gay-marriage_b_102312.html



I am disappointed and conflicted, I can produce a non biblical argument against  homosexuality when I am in the mood to argue , but to be frank , for myself the biblical argument trumps the other arguments anyway.

I don't really want religious issues to be subject to legislation or to be supported by legislation but I don't understand what is going to replace the guidance of scripture in our society .


Without the Judeo Christian tradition what will justice and right be like?
Will there be no standard of decency at all?
What sort of Frankenstien's monster will be considered wrong to cobble together ?

What have we already lost when divorce has become so common?
Out of wedlock pregnancy has become common , abortion has become common.

The addition of Homosexuality to the institution of Marrage seems like just another small step in the same direction , to define the matters of sexuality  , reproduction and childrearing less and less as subject to any standard, more and more as rules optional .

If fifteen guys wanted to marry and build their children in the manner of Doctor Frankenstein or Doctor Moreau , then raise them in the laboratory where every novel and new experimental method of child rearing would be tried in sequence , how would they be criticized?

I am not just a homophone , I am that ,and also I fear that all of our limits and guidelines are fading.






http://www.creationism.org/books/TaylorInMindsMen/TaylorIMMo15.htm