Who Would Jesus Vote For?

[BT]

I'm like an alternating current - - sometimes I think, "there's no fucking way," and sometimes it's "who the fuck knows?"  I don't know why I like to call myself an atheist bastard, except that it kind of appeals to my sense of humour, whereas "agnostic" sounds more like a humourless, self-referential prick.

Which do you think pisses off believers more?

Atheists or agnostics?

[Michael Tee]

<<Taxes are appropriated by congressional representatives. It's more a budget numbers thing than a referendum. >>

Well taxes are indirectly set through a democratic process, which was my point.  The people don't vote directly for or against a tax increase or decrease, they vote for candidates in general elections and the candidates stigmatize or promote one another as "fiscally conservative" or "tax and spend" guys.   One way or another, the voice of the people found its way into the tax laws.

[Michael Tee]

<<Which do you think pisses off believers more?

<<Atheists or agnostics?>>

I think a believer would see an agnostic as someone who had one foot on their property and one foot on the street, the atheist as someone who's already in the street and not coming in.  So they'd be more pissed off at the guy who's removed himself the further from them.  He needs twice the effort to convert, first to get him from atheism to agnosticism, then to get him from agnosticism to belief.  The agnostic requires only half the effort.

[The_Professor]

Actually, the opposite. Atheists at least demonstrate the ability to believe solidly in Something. Agnostics are fence-sitters and it can be dififcult to get them to believe in Anything.

Rev. 3:16: Since you are lukewarm and neither hot nor cold, I am going to spit you out of my mouth.

[Michael Tee]

<<Atheists at least demonstrate the ability to believe solidity in Something. Agnostics are fence-sitters and it can be dififcult to get them to believe in Anything.>>

Agnostics are like scientists.  They don't come to hold a belief until they can see solid evidence for it.  Since the arguments for and against the existence of God are equally balanced and equally non-convincing, the only intelligent response is to withhold belief in either.  A craving for certainty in the face of insufficient evidence is just plain foolish.  What you have is not a belief in solidity but a foolish choice between two alternatives in which the "believer" ("gambler" would be the more appropriate term) has a 50% chance of being right or wrong.

[Xavier_Onassis]

The historical record.  The Messiah is to usher in a time of peace, love and reconciliation and the universal love of man for God.  Jesus Christ ushered in an era of two thousand years of bloodshed, torture, war and the deliberate infliction of horrific violence on man by man on a scale that the world has never before seen.  THAT'S a Messiah?  Please.

==========================================================
Before Jesus there was bloodshed, torture, war and the deliberate infliction of horrific violence on man by man, but it was perceived of as normal.

Jesus said that he would return before the last of his disciples had died. It seems pretty clear that he didn't do this.
An actual Messiah should at a minimum, be truthful. I mean, if you are God, you are supposed to know everything, which includes the future and how to convince all of humanity that one is, in fact, the Messiah.

-----------------------------------------------
Who the Hell knows if there is really a God or not?

God would know that, assuming that there is one.
Also Jesus, the angels, the saints, and Mrs. God (if there is a Mrs God, which the Book of Mormon claims there is.)

I realize that this is a bit of a circular argument.

[hnumpah]

"When in comes to bullshit...bigtime, major league bullshit...you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims...religion. ... Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of 10 things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these 10 things he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever until the end of time...but he loves you."

George Carlin

[Xavier_Onassis]

He knows when you are sleeping,
He knows when you're awake.
He knows when you've been bad or good,
So be good, for goodness' sake!

Wait, that isn't God, that is Santa Claus. And there are a whole bunch more saints.

And I think most people who believe that the Great Sky-God knows all, also suspect that Satan knows it all as well.

The difference is that Satan has fewer Super Powers, isn't it?

Satan is Santa for many dyslexics, isn't he?

Most people think God knows the future. This does not jive very well with the theory of the Great Flood, or all the long wait to plunk Jesus down among us.

Does Santa know the future too, or does God just dispense this on a need-to-know basis?

Does Satan have foreknowledge? Does he even know you hate anchovies on your pizza?

[Michael Tee]

The Carlin quote was hilarious.  It reminds me (true story!)  of seeing two bumper stickers on the car in front of me in traffic:

1.  Smile.  God Loves You, and
2.  To Reject Jesus Is To Choose Hell (surrounded by little flame drawings)

[The_Professor]

<<Atheists at least demonstrate the ability to believe solidity in Something. Agnostics are fence-sitters and it can be dififcult to get them to believe in Anything.>>

Agnostics are like scientists.  They don't come to hold a belief until they can see solid evidence for it.  Since the arguments for and against the existence of God are equally balanced and equally non-convincing, the only intelligent response is to withhold belief in either.  A craving for certainty in the face of insufficient evidence is just plain foolish.  What you have is not a belief in solidity but a foolish choice between two alternatives in which the "believer" ("gambler" would be the more appropriate term) has a 50% chance of being right or wrong.

Hebrews 11:1: "Faith is the evidence of things not seen."

[The_Professor]

"When in comes to bullshit...bigtime, major league bullshit...you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims...religion. ... Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of 10 things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these 10 things he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever until the end of time...but he loves you."

George Carlin

This is hte same George Carlin who uttered unseemly things out of his mouth? Pleeeeese.

Colossians 3:8 -- But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.

[The_Professor]

The Carlin quote was hilarious.  It reminds me (true story!)  of seeing two bumper stickers on the car in front of me in traffic:

1.  Smile.  God Loves You, and
2.  To Reject Jesus Is To Choose Hell (surrounded by little flame drawings)

John 14:6 -- Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

It all comes down to Faith, doesn't it?

[sirs]

And apparently for some people, Professor, that faith really irks the hell out of them.

[The_Professor]

It's everyone's INDIVIDUAL decision. And, as adults, you are responsible for your decisions, good or bad.

[Universe Prince]

Professor, with all due respect, I don't think you understand the relationship of the Jews to God.  We have a covenant with the Lord which is sealed in each generation by the circumcision of every male Jew, even an atheist bastard like me.  That covenant is that the Lord is our God and we are His people.

Probably you have heard the phrase "The Lord thy God is a jealous God."  This means that every Jew since Abraham is bound by a sacred covenant to worship the Lord God and nobody else.  NOBODY else.  Which means no sons and no daughters, no nieces and no nephews.  For someone like me to start to worship another being as of Divine origin - - say Jesus Christ, the so-called Son of God - - would be the worst fucking blasphemy I could ever commit.  God will put up with a lot of bullshit from me, my atheism, my eating pork and bacon, my not going to visit Israel, etc., but one thing He would NOT put up with and that would be for me to worship a false God like Jesus.

A pharisaical atheist. That's funny.

You could worship a fucking Snake and He probably wouldn't give a shit.

We do, after a fashion. John 3:14.