Author Topic: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.  (Read 2491 times)

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sirs

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2008, 05:05:05 PM »
Quote
He lied and is a hypocrite about very small and unimportant things.

You are a funny guy.  The centerpiece of his change mantra revolves around how Washington does business, and that includes campaign finance. He wants to extend public financing to senate and house races. Take pacs and special interests out of the equation.

But when his moment of truth came he did the exact opposite of not only what he pledged , but also went against the core of his campaign.


You could say nearly the identical with his choice for veep.  The absolute polar opposite to the mantra of change.  Does anyone for a nanosecond think that after a President Obama, a President Biden would facilitate the same "change" platform??  Then again, if "change" is simply the new PC label for a hard core liberal/socialist agenda, then perhaps Biden would continue such a platform (though doubtful Obama would even make it to a 2nd term, once the electorate sees a Carter II administration's policies manfiest themselves).  What was the unemployment rate, Inflation rate, and Misery index under Carter I, again?


Your guy is a hypocritical opportunist who has no core, no soul, no center.

I think that's been established now for a while.  Typical DC politician, saying whatever needs to be said (which includes an on record support by Tee, to do precisely that) to garner power, in this case, the Presidency.  Much like what Palin had referenced.....those (Failed Community Organizers) who use the rhetoric of change to advance their careers.



« Last Edit: September 13, 2008, 05:39:13 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Michael Tee

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2008, 05:56:17 PM »
<<You are a funny guy.

<<The centerpiece of his change mantra revolves around how Washington does business, and that includes campaign finance. He wants to extend public financing to senate and house races. Take pacs and special interests out of the equation.>>

Well, I guess the problem with vague promises and coded messages is that they mean different things to different people.  I can't tell you how Obama's other supporters read his message of change, but I can tell you how I responded to it, and I would bet that a lot of other folks who did respond did so pretty much in the same frame of mind as mine.

First of all, when I heard "change," the method of financing campaigns did not spring first to mind.  "Change" meant first and foremost a drastic reduction in the influence of the special interests that were directing the government:  the rich, the military-industrial complex and the Zionists, not necessarily in that order.  Obviously with some overlap, since the means of control was money.  It seemed to me that Obama had perfected a way of getting lots of little donations from average citizens and that campaign finanance reform would restrain the very rich from unduly influencing election outcomes or legislative and/or executive action.

The major effects of such change would be felt as follows: a "special relationship" with Israel would no longer be a cornerstone of U.S. foreign policy; the special interests of the medical, pharmaceutical and insurance industries would no longer drive U.S. health-care policy; and massive reductions in the military budget would partially counterbalance the necessary expenditures required to provide restitution to the living victims or heirs of American genocide, slavery and racism, further funding for which would come from radical amendments to the existing tax structure, forcing the rich to hand back significant portions of their ill-gotten gains.

I believe that Obama has made significant strides towards equalizing the influence, through campaign contributions, of the average citizens so that candidates across the board are less beholden than previously to fat-cat special interest donors, and he accomplished that largely through innovative internet fund-raising techniques.  This is a life-and-death struggle with the forces of pure evil, and if Obama - - in order to leverage himself into the White House against all the natural advantages of wealth, power, racism and criminality at the disposition of the GOP - - needs to take advantage of whatever assistance the system provides to him, he should do so, and be guided only by the principle that his campaign must maximize all opportunities to raise campaign money.

So except for clearly illegal fund-raising techniques like bank robbery, there is no fund-raising method adopted by Obama that I would criticize on any grounds other than efficiency.

<<But when his moment of truth came he did the exact opposite of not only what he pledged , but also went against the core of his campaign.>>

That's only how you want to spin it, by misinterpreting the core of the campaign.

<<Your guy is a hypocritical opportunist who has no core, no soul, no center.>>

It's possible he may turn out to be exactly that, but it hasn't been demonstrated so far, and we back him because we KNOW that McCain is everything you say Obama is, plus a lying weasel who betrayed his own marriage vows, lied to his wife, cheated on her and divorced her.  And when the truth comes out, lied about his "torture" as well.  Betrayed his oath of office by putting the special interests of Charles Keating above the interests of his own consitutuents and took bribes and special favours from him too.

<<Look at what they do.

<<Palin stopped the bridge to nowhere.>>

A pathetic half-truth.  The WHOLE truth is, she promoted it, took the money for it, and went public against it ONLY after it had become a national scandal.

<<Your guy takes fatcat money.>>

What's Charles Keating, a benefactor of humanity?  He was a fatter cat than Tony Rezko will ever be.

<<Who is the liar? That would be your guy. >>

No it wouldn't, it would be the guy who lied to, cheated on and walked out on his own wife, the mother of his own daughter.  It would be the guy who claims to have been tortured, without any supporting witness, whose own jailer denies the charges.  The guy who claims that Palin "fought against earmarks" when he knows God-damn well that she even hired a PR guy to get more of them for Wasilla, and later for the State of Alaska, the highest per-capita recipient in the entire nation.  THAT is who the liar is.

BT

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2008, 06:05:47 PM »
It's real simple Mikey.

Obama pledged to take public financing for his presidential campaign if his republican opponent did.

McCain is taking public financing. Obama reneged.

He is a liar.

I know it. You know it and the public knows it.

 


sirs

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2008, 06:11:02 PM »
It's real simple Mikey.  Obama pledged to take public financing for his presidential campaign if his republican opponent did. .....

Woa.....I knew Obama pledged to take Public financing, but I was unaware it had a precondition attached to McCain.  And that precondition was met, but.........

Yea, real "change" there     ::)    Say whatever, do whatever, lie wherever



"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Michael Tee

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2008, 06:14:26 PM »
It's real simple Mikey.

Obama pledged to take public financing for his presidential campaign if his republican opponent did.

McCain is taking public financing. Obama reneged.

He is a liar.

I know it. You know it and the public knows it.

================================================================
****************************************************************

That's a valid point, BT.  If I were a voter, I'd take that into account and I wouldn't like it.  But I'd balance it against the lies of McCain and Palin, against the horrendous lies of the Bush administration that neither one can escape from because they supported them and because they're all Republicans all serving the same interests, I'd consider what Obama could or might stand for (hard to tell when most of the key promises have to be in code in the first place) and I'd consider what McCain stands for and what interests he serves, and I'd consider character - - a solid, respectable family man versus a lying cheating weasel, a war criminal, a Keating Five crooked legislator -- and I'd have to figure, nobody's perfect, but this choice is a real no-brainer.  Oh yeah, and I'd also compare brain-power. 

No-brainer, really.  McCain oughtta just stand down now.

BT

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2008, 06:21:13 PM »
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I'd consider what Obama could or might stand for (hard to tell when most of the key promises have to be in code in the first place)

WTF?

No wonder Obama isn't focused in voters minds. He campaigns in code.

Jeez.


Knutey

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2008, 08:32:56 PM »
It's real simple Mikey.

Obama pledged to take public financing for his presidential campaign if his republican opponent did.

McCain is taking public financing. Obama reneged.

He is a liar.

I know it. You know it and the public knows it.

 



Actually this is not lying . It is changing ones mind about a crucial decision that one was wrong about. RW moron's like the Bushidiot and McSameastheBushidiot are incapable of admitting mistakes which is what has fucked up the world and our economy royally.

Lying is when you purposefully mislead like you Repubs.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2008, 08:40:25 PM by Knutey »

BT

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2008, 09:50:21 PM »
So when Palin switched course on the bridge to nowhere she was well within her rights.

So she didn't lie.

And why is it that public financing for elections is wrong?

Does that mean Obama is in favor of fat cats buying elections?

I mean since he chanded his mind about
Quote
a crucial decision that one was wrong about.

Michael Tee

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2008, 10:16:34 PM »
WTF?

No wonder Obama isn't focused in voters minds. He campaigns in code.

Jeez.

========================================================

Jeez, eh?  The only thing you missed is that an awful lot of people seem to "get" the code.  Sorry about the rest of you.  It's really not that difficult.

Here's a clue.  People want change because they're fed up.  What are they fed up with?  Not the bullshit issues you right-wing wack-jobs pretend are the issues.  Think about real people in a real world who are under 65 if you can, and ask yourself what they might possibly be fed up with.  And when you have the answer to what they're fed up with, you've cracked the code.  You'll know what changes Obama has promised.

Whether he delivers is an entirely different matter, but I say "trust him," because all that McCain is offering is four more years of the last eight.  If later it turns out that he's fucked his supporters, it wouldn't be the first time, and the country couldn't possibly be any worse off than it would have been under McCain.

BT

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2008, 10:47:49 PM »
You are admitting Obama is nothing more than a coke commercial. He doesn't offer specifics.

Because he would have to deliver.

Knutey

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2008, 11:01:55 PM »
So when Palin switched course on the bridge to nowhere she was well within her rights.

So she didn't lie.

And why is it that public financing for elections is wrong?

Does that mean Obama is in favor of fat cats buying elections?

I mean since he chanded his mind about
Quote
a crucial decision that one was wrong about.
Palin said she was against but never that she was for it so she lied by omission.

Obama is not for YOUR fat cats buying the elections as they have for the last  8  years.

Michael Tee

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2008, 11:18:16 PM »
<<You are admitting Obama is nothing more than a coke commercial. He doesn't offer specifics.>>

He does - - to the people who understand him.

<<Because he would have to deliver.>>

Wrong - - because he would not get elected on the specifics he is promising.  He may or may not deliver.  Not every President delivers once he is in office.  Obama can't prove at this point in time if he is the delivering or the non-delivering kind.  Whoever believes in him is making a leap of faith.

BT

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2008, 11:37:56 PM »
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Wrong - - because he would not get elected on the specifics he is promising.   Whoever believes in him is making a leap of faith.

That probably explains his crash in the polls.






Michael Tee

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2008, 07:48:02 AM »
<<That probably explains his crash in the polls.>>

All you did was move the question one link back up the chain.  If the crash in the polls is a result of belief in Obama being a leap of faith, the question becomes, why now the apparent loss of faith?

IMHO, Obama has disappointed a lot of his followers by: (a) admitting on The O'Reilly Factor that the surge "succeeded beyond our wildest dreams," one of the stupidest, dumbest political admissions I have ever seen in my life and indicative of the fact that whatever else Obama may be, he is no street fighter in the political arena, (b) his desire to put 10,000 more troops into Afghanistan, which is just a part of his general pandering to the right wing going way beyond what he needs to say to get elected.

I personally would have stayed with Obama even through all this because I realize the dangers of an unstable, violent nut like McCain in the White House and I really despise him as a lying, cheating, sleazy individual, but Obama sure has lost a lot of appeal over the past weeks.  Makes ya realize how far style and flash will take a politician when you consider Kucinich, the real thing, and still what short shrift he got from his own party.

If I were an al Qaeda leader, I'd be happy with McCain, or anyone else who promises to keep the pot boiling.  If I were an American, I'd hunker down for another four years of Bush administration neo-con foreign policy, with huge military appropriations increases, because when the AVF is stretched to the limits and a draft is politically out of the question, the manpower can only come from two places - - bribed Third World "allies" or mercenaries, not necessarily American.


Xavier_Onassis

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Re: John McCain: Still Lying. Again.
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2008, 08:03:45 AM »
I would think that going on O'Reilly's show was the blunder.

O'Reilly is a primadonna and a posturing rightwing dolt, not anything that remotely resembles a "newsman" He's Ann Coulter in drag.

If we assume that disposing of Al Qaeda and the Taliban in Afghanistan is necessary, then 10,000 more troops there are really needed.

The problem with any presidential candidate is that the only thing that an honest candidate can say is "I will try", because no candidate has the knowledge of the current situation, let alone future developments to the degree that he can really make absolute statements.

In movieland, this honest candidate would be Jimmy Stewart, perhaps played by Denzil Washington, and the people would see his sincerity and elect him over the other blowhard, who says he KNOWS he can do this or that for sure, because they know a blowhard when they see one.

But we do not live in movieland, we live in a place where people really do think "lite" foods will cause them to be less heavy despite all the evidence they see on their bathroom scales, and there are far too many people who will believe the lying blowhard over the honest man.

They prefer the preacher who says that he communicates with the Demiurge on a daily basis over the one who merely says he believes.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."