Author Topic: Solicitor General Elena Kagan  (Read 11725 times)

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BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #120 on: May 15, 2010, 01:13:51 PM »
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In her article it was a tad more broad, that of the motives of the speaker

Then you should be able to quote where she mentions the motives of the speaker and not the government so that all can see.

sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #121 on: May 15, 2010, 01:38:26 PM »
Been there, done that already. 
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #122 on: May 15, 2010, 04:02:07 PM »
sorry must have missed that post, could you point out where you did so?

sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #123 on: May 15, 2010, 04:19:37 PM »
The last one was posted here, while the article in greater context was located here, along with its link.  "She argued that the government can employ Orwellian restrictions on speech if it thinks such speech might "harm" others, either by direct action or inciting someone else to take direct action"

And what the hell is this "motives" function??  If one is mad, angry, even pissed at a sitting administration, and wants to vent, how is the "motive" any business of the government or SCOTUS? 
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #124 on: May 15, 2010, 04:56:29 PM »
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The last one was posted here,

deals with government motive in suppressing free speech, not the speakers motivation for speaking.

From her actual article:

Consider the following snapshot of impermissible motives for speech restrictions. First, the government may not restrict expressive activities because it disagrees with or disapproves of the ideas espoused by the speaker; it may not act on the basis of a view of what is a true (or false) belief or a right (or wrong) opinion.45 Or, to say this in a slightly different way, the government cannot count as a harm, which it has a legitimate interest in preventing, that ideas it considers faulty or abhorrent enter the public dialogue and challenge the official understanding of acceptability or correctness. Second, though relatedly, the government may not restrict speech because the ideas espoused threaten officials' own self-interest-more particularly, their tenure in office.46 The government, to use the same construction
as above, cannot count as a harm, which it has a legitimate interest in preventing, that speech may promote the removal of  incumbent officeholders through the political process. Third, and as a corollary to these proscriptions, the government may not privilege either ideas it favors or ideas advancing its self-interest- for example, by exempting certain ideas from a general prohibition.47 Justice Scalia summarized these tenets in R.A.V.:"The government may not regulate [speech] based on hostility-
or favoritism-towards the underlying message expressed."'4

http://www.scotusblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Private-Speech-Public-Purpose.pdf

Again she is talking about governmental motivation for restricting speech, not the speakers motivation for speaking.








Plane

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #125 on: May 15, 2010, 06:58:02 PM »
 Have a nice day.


(of course I say this meaning ,as I am thinking, the most malicious and hatefull things that I can possibly can mean , I might ought to be locked up.)

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #126 on: May 15, 2010, 07:12:25 PM »
harmful speech has already been defined

And your motivation for saying have a nice day was not the subject of Kagan's paper.


Plane

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #127 on: May 15, 2010, 07:24:12 PM »
harmful speech has already been defined

And your motivation for saying have a nice day was not the subject of Kagan's paper.



So Judges are not liable to acheive the ability to interpret offensive language?

They won't be decideing how much harm was intended when evaluateing words or actions of the government and citizens?

sirs

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #128 on: May 15, 2010, 07:27:10 PM »
Precisely
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BT

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Re: Solicitor General Elena Kagan
« Reply #129 on: May 15, 2010, 07:51:01 PM »
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So Judges are not liable to acheive the ability to interpret offensive language?

They won't be decideing how much harm was intended when evaluateing words or actions of the government and citizens?

judges are free to go in whatever direction they choose, but then that wasn't the point of Kagan's paper. Her point was that when evaluating ordinances and other legislative actions regarding the First Amendment that justices would be wise to understand the legislative intent behind that legislation.

Her position was based on the ruling  the court had handed down in r.a.v. vs. st. paul