Palin Family is All-American -- daughter, 17, pregnant

[Amianthus]

Obviously you're not a follower of James Dobson and Focus on the Family:

Please remind me which ID that James Dobson uses when posting around here?

[BT]

Obviously you're not a follower of James Dobson and Focus on the Family:
http://www.focusonthefamily.com/search.aspx/search?q=teen%20pregnancy

From your link: Doesn't seem like Focus on Family is all about hurling stones at all.

Dear Dr. Bill:

My 15-year-old daughter is pregnant with her boyfriend's baby. Her boyfriend is urging her to have an abortion, and she has asked me for advice on what to do. How would you advise my daughter?

? Amy

Dear Amy:

I feel for your family's predicament. It must be an incredibly difficult time for your daughter right now. I can't imagine being 15 years old and pregnant.

More than anything else, your daughter needs your support and encouragement right now. If you are upset or angry over this unplanned pregnancy, put your anger aside and be there for your daughter. She needs your unconditional love, AND she needs your maturity and wisdom.

As a Christian, I believe every life has incredible worth and value?from conception to the grave. Each of us is made in God's image?the Bible says He knew us before we were knit together in our mother's womb. Because of this, abortion is never an option, regardless of the circumstances. It is the deliberate taking of human life?a life that is loved and cherished by God.

There are many resources available to help your daughter through this difficult time, to help her to understand that there is a precious life growing inside her, and to assist her with the practical help and support she needs. One option that is rarely discussed by the media or in the public school system is adoption. If you agree that she is unable or lacks the maturity to care for the baby herself, there are thousands of loving couples who are unable to have children that would love to adopt this little boy or girl.

If you call our 800-number here at Focus on the Family (800-A-FAMILY), one of our counselors would be happy to talk to you and your daughter during this stressful time. You can also go to a Web site called optionline.org to locate a pregnancy resource center in your local area.

By the way, we have a wonderful packet of resources for teen girls who are dealing with an unplanned pregnancy. It's called "Decisions About Abortion." You can order it by calling us or visiting our online Resource Center.


http://listen.family.org/askdrbill/A000000311.cfm

[Amianthus]

For thousands of years, men beating up women was "normal". So was incest in much of the world.

Only among those who believe urban legends.

[Michael Tee]

<<From your link: Doesn't seem like Focus on Family is all about hurling stones at all . . .  >>

My  "link" in fact linked to 69 other links, of which you selected one only and ignored all the others.  Here's a link to the Focus on the Family opposition to the mandatory vaccination of students in the public education system with HPV vaccine, which protects against cervical cancer.
http://www.family.org/socialissues/A000000357.cfm

A proposed vaccination which undoubtedly will save some young women (those whose parents place religious dogma above the health and safety of their own children) from cancer of the cervix, is opposed by the religious right.  If they succeed in opposing or even delaying the vaccination program, young women who might otherwise have been spared cervical cancer will now get it, thanks to Dobson and his organization.

[sirs]

<<From your link: Doesn't seem like Focus on Family is all about hurling stones at all . . .  >>

My  "link" in fact linked to 69 other links, of which you selected one only and ignored all the others.  Here's a link to the Focus on the Family opposition to the mandatory vaccination of students in the public education system with HPV vaccine, which protects against cervical cancer.

Vs the vaccination itself.  Let's try to keep it honest, Tee

[Amianthus]

A proposed vaccination which undoubtedly will save some young women (those whose parents place religious dogma above the health and safety of their own children) from cancer of the cervix, is opposed by the religious right.

The vaccine itself is not opposed by the religious right, contrary to your statement; forced vaccinations are opposed.

And while this vaccine "undoubtedly will save some young women," forcing all girls to get it will "undoubtedly kill some young women" as vaccines have done so in the past.

[BT]

Mandatory vaccines are not the same as Focus on Families views on teenage pregnancies.

Try to keep it honest

[Michael Tee]

mandatory vaccinations will save more lives than are lost.  If done right, no lives will be lost.  The issue of forced vaccinations is phony because the other side is forced non-vaccinations.    Whether it is the school board or the parents are making the decision, the welfare of the child herself is not in her hands.

So the real question is, as between school board and parents, which is more likely to keep the welfare of the child closest to heart?  Obviously the school board, because they have no ideology to follow, and will undoubtedly be in accordance with the wishes of the majority of the parents.  The minority of parents who don't agree with the school board and don't want the vaccinations are primarily influenced by religious doctrine, which means that extraneous factors are being allowed to influence decisions that should be governed only by considerations of the child's best interests.

[sirs]

mandatory vaccinations will save more lives than are lost.  If done right, no lives will be lost.

So, you can cite the URL that demonstrates 100% correct application of vaccinations with no death related instances, please

And even done "right", certain, very serious & deadly complications can arise, such as Guillian Barre.

But returning to the point, the issue remians your callous misrepresentation of Focus on the Family's opposition to MANDATORY vaccinations, vs the vaccination itself.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Quote from: Xavier_Onassis on Today at 12:27:34 PM
For thousands of years, men beating up women was "normal". So was incest in much of the world.


Only among those who believe urban legends.
======================================================================
Oh please. All you have to do is read the literature of medieval times and the writings of various explorers.
I really do not think that Fray Bernardo de Zahagun and Inca Garcilaso de la Vega can be called "urban legends".

[Xavier_Onassis]

Quote
Palin is probably immensely vulnerable becuase she's gotta be on the record a hundred times opposing sex ed in schools, opposing condom distribution in high schools, etc.


Palin has no problems with contraception. She doesn't believe Abortion should be used as an alternative to birth control.
==============================================================
No one believes that abortion is a good alternative to birth control in principle.
Just like no one believes that a tree is a proper way to stop a car.
But then, when it is either a matter of hitting the tree or going over the cliff, the tree does not look as unreasonable.

It's when a woman is faced with either having an abortion or raising a child for the next 18 years that it becomes an issue.

I continue to think that this sorta proves that abstinence in this case (what Palin seems to have preferred over sex-ed or pills or condoms) are not such an effective alternative. As for Palin abd her daughter as well, they are ree to do whatever they wish. But this particular incident does not seem to reveal the sort of thoughtful leadership skills that one might need to run a country in the event that the Geezer-in-Chief should shuffle off this mortal coil, as it were.

[Amianthus]

mandatory vaccinations will save more lives than are lost.  If done right, no lives will be lost.

So, quantity counts? If I only kill one person, it's no big deal?

The issue of forced vaccinations is phony because the other side is forced non-vaccinations.

Since when does my choosing whether or not to get a vaccine for my daughter force you to not get one?

Does that work for abortions as well? Since you advocate a choice whether or not to get an abortion, I can now claim that your advocation of choice is inherently forcing me daughter to get one?

[Amianthus]

Oh please. All you have to do is read the literature of medieval times and the writings of various explorers.
I really do not think that Fray Bernardo de Zahagun and Inca Garcilaso de la Vega can be called "urban legends".

I would suggest that "more common than current times" does not equate to "normal behavior".

[Michael Tee]

If HPV vaccination is not mandatory in the schools, or at least offered to all students with an opt-out parental option, then millions of girls won't get the vaccine at all.  This is just a fact of life.  To pretend that every parent is zealously on top of health issues and will get the HPV vaccine for his or her daughter whether or not it's offered in the public schools is just crazy.  Many girls who would take the vaccine if offered in the schools will not get it if it's not, either because their parents just don't give a shit, aren't up on these topics or are confused by scare tactics and misinformation spread by organizations like Focus on the Family.

If the number of girls killed by the vaccine were anywhere close to the number of lives saved by the prevention of cervical cancer, the vaccine would never be offered.  Jeopardizing your daughter's health because of minuscule chances of adverse reactions or bad vaccine is like refusing to take a heart attack victim to the hospital in an ambulance because he might get killed in a traffic accident on the way.

[Amianthus]

If HPV vaccination is not mandatory in the schools, or at least offered to all students with an opt-out parental option, then millions of girls won't get the vaccine at all.

We don't do vaccines in school in the US. They just send out a list of "mandatory" vaccines (for which you must document the reception back to the school) and a list of "recommended" vaccines.