They're all crazy!

[Christians4LessGvt]

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/melanie-hunter/dem-congressman-forces-will-rise-if-isis-destroyed-are-nearly-evil-isis

[Xavier_Onassis]

There will always be some Muslim fanatics that want to reestablish the Caliphate, because it is mentioned in the Koran, just as the End Time scenario with seven headed monsters, Armageddon and all that crap is mentioned in the Bible.

Defeating Isis is a job for the Sunni Muslims. All the US and other non Muslim countries can do is help. We have proven many times in Asia that we cannot turn Asian societies into anything we would like them to be: in Korea, Vietnam, Philippines and Iraq. It is akin to trying to create a perpetual motion machine: impossible. A am all for giving the enemies of Isis what we can to help them, but we have no business sending troops. If we could spare the men and the money it would be useless. The Muslim World is not yearning to become Southern California, though there are a few who think this is what they want. 

[Christians4LessGvt]

We have proven many times in Asia that we cannot turn Asian societies into anything we would like them to be:

what is wrong with how Japan and South Korea turned out?
i would say South Korea and Japan have turned out nicely.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Japan was the only success. It was a functioning democracy by the early 1950's. South Korea had a series of brutal dictatorships and military dictatorships from 1952 all the way through the late 1980's. Taiwan was a dictatorship until finally Chiang Kai Shek's son was forced out, also in the 1980's The US took over the Philippines in 1898 and ruled until the Japanese invaded, and again from 1945 until the present time. It is only marginally democratic.
The US tried very hard in Vietnam, and less so in Laos and Cambodia, and the results were pretty awful.The Arvin was better equipped, larger and better trained than the Viet Cong, but when the US left, they turned tail and ran. The same happened in Iraq. The troops we trained were unwilling to risk their lives for a US made government.

[Christians4LessGvt]

Japan was the only success.

Uh?
South Korea is a huge success.
The brutal dictatorships ended 25 years ago!
South Korea is #16 in the world on the Human Development Index.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
South Korea is such a clear stark comparison to North Korea commi failure.

[Xavier_Onassis]

My point is not that South Korea is not successful: it is that South Korea is not successful because of the US, which supported Syngman Rhee and a series of right wing oppressive governments.  The South Koreans found their own way: it was not until the Carter administration that the US started supporting South Korean style democracy, which is not what the US had in mind for it.

North Korea is not so much Communist as it is a hereditary neo-Confuciust state. Marx never advocated the worship of a royal family or the building of internment camps for 20% of the population.

[kimba1]

not really sure these example works at all.
japan was a direct engagement. we`re not engaging isis directly. south korea didn`t win in fact the war pretty much never stopped it was just a mutual ceasefire that fizzled out the war .sort of

I`m must point a very dangerous problem here. the statement "giving the enemies of Isis what we can to help them". I believe most of the conflict we have now is a product of this strategy.

enemy of my enemy is my friend is a great sounding quote but it has a pretty bad track record.

star trek 2-- Arab proverb coined by a prince who was soon decapitated by his subjects

[Xavier_Onassis]

I simply am saying that the American track record for invading Asian nations and trying to make them more like us is a poor one. I am all for giving the Kurds and other Sunnis and others who oppose ISL the air support and advice they might need to beat ISL. I maintain that even if we went into Syrioa and Iraq with everything we had (except for nukes), I do not think we would end up with a satisfactory result. We armed the Iraqi Maliki government to the teeth and what did they do? They turned and ran like little girls and left tons of weapons behind for ISL to play with. I oppose wasting my tax dollars in this fashion.

ISL is a Sunni Muslim problem and a Shiite Muslim threat. We cannot support Assad, either. There does not seem to be any ideal solution. Not doing sumb thuings should be paramount.

[kimba1]

I do believe this needs to be addressed but caution needs to be greatly address because none of these situation are new but stuff from previous actions. not saying it`s possible just pointing out we should try not to get our ass bitten

[Xavier_Onassis]

I agree. Our asses should be many clicks away from their teeth.