Palestinians: Aggressors, Not Victims

[hnumpah]

Show me, H.  Show me this Palestine "border/land" established prior to the end of WWII, it's outline, and its set-up Government running it, not to mention all the other countries that were recognizing this land as Palestine.  I'm all eyes.

But not much brains. How hard can it be to do a simple web search.

First result, right at the top of the page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Mandate_of_Palestine

Followed by:

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/Palestine_Mandate.html
http://www.mideastweb.org/mandate.htm
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/mideast/palmanda.htm
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1922mandate.html

Seems Palestine was recognized by quite a few people, including the Jews.

There. That entire process took about two minutes. Any further orders, Master?

[Richpo64]

>>There. That entire process took about two minutes. Any further orders, Master?<<

Yes.

Show me where, prior to the British Mandate, there was any country called Palestine. Please define the border and type of governement. Then show me Palestine's borders and type of governement after 1923.

[sirs]

But not much brains.....That entire process took about two minutes. Any further orders, Master?

So that's the "civility" & "tone" you wish to precede with?  OooooKaaaay.  I can't help but recall how completely bent out of shape you got when you thought I was somehow demeaning your intellect (when I never was), and here didn't take long for you to pull precisely the garbage you were condeming me for.    

And strange how as of yet, there seemed to be no "land" of Palestine before some mentioned mandate (read; nothing actually done about it)  Strange how also as soon as Isreal resettled, all of a sudden there was this "land" of Palestine, coincidentally, right where Isreal was.  Go figure

[Michael Tee]

<<Show me where, prior to the British Mandate, there was any country called Palestine. Please define the border and type of governement. Then show me Palestine's borders and type of governement after 1923.>>

I think this is what he's looking for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine#Ottoman_rule_.281516_-_1917_CE.29

The Romans joined the province of Judea (which already included Samaria) together with Galilee to form a new province, called by the familiar name of Syria Palaestina.[17]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine#Ottoman_rule_.281516_-_1917_CE.29
During the Roman period, the Iudaea Province (including Samaria) comprised much of modern Palestine, although the Galilee and other northern areas remained administratively distinct. Later, following the Jewish rebellions in the 1st and 2nd centuries CE, Rome united the entire Levant in a new province bearing its Greco-Latin name, Syria-Palaestina.[17][18]
During the Byzantine Period, this entire region (including Syria, Palestine, Samaria, and Galilee) was renamed Palaestina and then subdivided into Diocese I and II. The Byzantines also renamed an area of land including the Negev, Sinai, and the west coast of the Arabian Peninsula as Palaestina Salutoris, sometimes called Palaestina III. Since the Byzantine Period, the Byzantine borders of Palaestina (I and II) have served as a name for the geographic area between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea.


Although what he hopes to prove with it is anyone's guess.

[Richpo64]

Sorry Mike, you have provided no such evidence.

There isn't now, nor has there ever been a country called Palestine. If so, you could show me the geography and type of government it has had throughout it's existence. Obviously you can't do that because there has never been such a country or such a government.

Feel free to keep making a fool of yourself though.

[Michael Tee]

<<Feel free to keep making a fool of yourself though.>>

I wouldn't even attempt to steal your act, Rich.  You seem to hold the franchise on foolishness when it comes to Zionist bullshit around here, and you've done more with that franchise than anyone could reasonably have expected.

"Palestine" was the name of a Province of the Roman Empire, later of the Byzantine Empire and later still was the name of the British Mandate.

What was your point anyway?  There was never an independent country named Palestine, so the Jews have the right to permanently subject the three million West Bank Arabs to military occupation without civil rights for the sake of 270,000 Jewish settlers?  Using your asinine brand of "logic" there was never a country named the U.S. of A., so the British had the right to subject the colonies to permanent subordinate status?  Pa-THET-ic.  Absolutely pathetic.

[Richpo64]

>>"Palestine" was the name of a Province of the Roman Empire, later of the Byzantine Empire and later still was the name of the British Mandate.<<

No, the British Mandate was called the British Mandate and it was referred to as Palestine. The British Mandate didn't create Palestine. No one ever created a national homeland in "Palestine since the Jews did 2000 years before. Jews had been immigrateing to the area since 1880. After WWII the British Mandate was created, then just 5 years later the area was divided into Trans Jordon (east of the Jordon River) and Jewish "Palestine" (west of the Jordon River).

These are just a few facts for you to consider. Well, you won't, but there they are.

[hnumpah]

So that's the "civility" & "tone" you wish to precede with?  OooooKaaaay.  I can't help but recall how completely bent out of shape you got when you thought I was somehow demeaning your intellect (when I never was), and here didn't take long for you to pull precisely the garbage you were condeming me for.

My tone was in response to your demand and its tone. Keep that in mind next time you decide to take that tack with me.

And strange how as of yet, there seemed to be no "land" of Palestine before some mentioned mandate (read; nothing actually done about it)  Strange how also as soon as Isreal resettled, all of a sudden there was this "land" of Palestine, coincidentally, right where Isreal was.  Go figure

You got your answer. The area was recognized as Palestine for quite some time; not necessarily as an independent country, but as a general name for the entire area. You might have known that if you had taken the time to simply read over the history of the area you decided to jump into a discussion about. Then you might come off sounding more intelligent and informed than you did.

[sirs]

So that's the "civility" & "tone" you wish to precede with?  OooooKaaaay.  I can't help but recall how completely bent out of shape you got when you thought I was somehow demeaning your intellect (when I never was), and here didn't take long for you to pull precisely the garbage you were condeming me for.

My tone was in response to your demand and its tone. Keep that in mind next time you decide to take that tack with me.

Yea, calling me stupid is equivalent to requesting that you show me some physical boudries to support your thesis.  Yea, nice try.  Might convince knute perhaps, though.

And strange how as of yet, there seemed to be no "land" of Palestine before some mentioned mandate (read; nothing actually done about it)  Strange how also as soon as Isreal resettled, all of a sudden there was this "land" of Palestine, coincidentally, right where Isreal was.  Go figure

You got your answer. The area was recognized as Palestine for quite some time; not necessarily as an independent country, but as a general name for the entire area. You might have known that if you had taken the time to simply read over the history of the area you decided to jump into a discussion about. Then you might come off sounding more intelligent and informed than you did.

See, did it again.  I'm just not intelligent.  The SAME thing you were repetatively blasting me for supposedly doing to you.  The fact you can't demonstrate any physical boundries that were recognized and upheld as Palestine, especially when Isreal was allowed to resettle, yet I'm the one lacking intelligence.  Well, it was fun while it lasted.  How's it feel to apparently be me?     

[The_Professor]

>>Rich, I understand this. As an evangelical Christian, it is clear to me they are entitled to the land of the Philistines and all surrounding territory to include all land at the height of any Jewish hegemony. God gave them this, IMHO.<<

We agree.

>>However, I am offering a real life compromise here. Let's move 'em, lock stock and all, to somewhere else no one will want so the hostility is gone.<<

How do you justify something like this when you admit Israel is clearly their land to befin with? Why on Earth should Israel acquiess to mudrerous terroriists if it's their land by birth? If you're a Christian who knows your Bible, why on Earth would you force Jews off the promised land before you would make Arabs live up to their end of the bargain? Why not do what was intented in the first place? Move the "Palestinians" to Jordon. Any Arabs currently living and working in Israel could certianly stay, but since the Arabs caused the refugee problem, they should do what they should have done years ago and taken in the refugees instead of using them for political gain.

Well, sometimes, you must compromise in order to reach consensus. I'm not worried on this score; God will take care of the Jews no matter where they are, so big deal, just relocate them. Doesn't matter where; in fact, the worse, the better.

[Michael Tee]

<<Jews had been immigrateing to the area since 1880.>>

So what?  They've been immigrating into Toronto since about that time too.  It's news to me that immigration gives the immigrant the right to take over the country from the majority inhabitants.  I don't think we're gonna try that here in Toronto.

<< After WWII the British Mandate was created, then just 5 years later the area was divided into Trans Jordon (east of the Jordon River) and Jewish "Palestine" (west of the Jordon River).>>

Why are you so fixated on names?  The real story is in the numbers.  In 1922 they were 11% of the population and with the rise of Hitler they quintupled the Jewish population in just 15 years.  But they still weren't a majority and they don't have the right to push out the people who were there before them.

<<These are just a few facts for you to consider. Well, you won't, but there they are.>>

Well, I DID consider them.  I just don't agree with what you concluded from them.  I'm not against a Jewish homeland either.  I think they oughtta have one, with lots of nukes and a big army and air force.  I just don't think they have the right to treat other people like shit, no matter how badly they've been treated themselves.  The Arabs aren't responsible for what they went through during the war.

[sirs]

The Arabs aren't responsible for what they went through during the war.

They are the ones that took a military approach in trying to "interact" with Israel, immediately following the war

[Richpo64]

>> ... so big deal, just relocate them. ...<<

There's lots of prophecy tied up in that soil, wouldn't you agree? Since we agree that God gave the Jews the land, wouldn't it be kind of a big deal if they just decided to up and leave? "Say God, we've decided the land you promised us isn't worth the trouble. We're all moving to Jersey."

[Richpo64]

>>Why are you so fixated on names?<<

lol ... So now I'm fixated on names? You're the one attempting to create a country out of whole cloth. I'm just giving you a simple fact. There was NEVER a country named Palestine, no matter how much you wish there where. It's a lie created by Israels enemies that usefull idiots perpetuate. Jews have always been there, and they always will be. "Palestinians" don't want a country, they want to kill Jews. If they wanted a country they have had many opportunities to either create one, or join one. The real agenda for Arabs in the area is to burning desire to kill ever Jew they can find.

If the Bush Doctrine reaches fruition sometime in the future, and Democracies replace the dictatorships currently ruling the majority of Arab countires, Israel will have peace and so will the rest of the Middle East. Until that happens Israel has every right of sovereign nation to protect itself against the monsters promising Jewish genocide.

[hnumpah]

I'm just not intelligent.  The SAME thing you were repetatively blasting me for supposedly doing to you.  The fact you can't demonstrate any physical boundries that were recognized and upheld as Palestine, especially when Isreal was allowed to resettle, yet I'm the one lacking intelligence.

Read.

Learn.

Then get back to me.