Author Topic: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade  (Read 28498 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Henny

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« on: September 11, 2007, 08:08:45 AM »
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070910/COLUMNIST12/709100315
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Article published September 10, 2007

Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade


THERE is a widespread belief in the Muslim world that President Bush, under the guise of war against terrorism, is in fact waging a latter-day Crusade against Islam and Muslims. In the waning days of this administration, it is becoming more and more evident that there is some truth to that assumption.

An article published in the Los Angeles Times a few weeks ago outlined a disturbing relationship between the Department of Defense and Christian evangelists. The DoD has been delivering "Freedom Packages" to U.S. soldiers in Iraq containing proselytizing material both in English and Arabic as well as the apocalyptic video game "Left Behind: Eternal Forces." In the video, the soldiers of Christ hunt down enemies.

The packages were supplied by Operation Straight Up, a fundamentalist Christian ministry. This group was also planning to hold a series of entertainment programs for the troops called, symbolically, Military Crusade.

According to the same article, another evangelical group, Christian Embassy, has had unprecedented access to DoD facilities and personnel for making a documentary. Their cozy proximity to DoD led one high Pentagon official, Air Force Maj. Gen. John Catton, to assume the group was a quasifederal agency.

Proselytizing by Christian missionaries has a long and checkered history. Burning with zeal to save people around the world, these do-gooders descend with Bible in one hand and loaf of bread in the other to prey on the most vulnerable and needy. Be it in Iraq, Afghanistan, or India, the modus operandi is the same. Almost a century ago, Mahatma Gandhi, the apostle of religious harmony and pacifism, urged Christian missionaries to stop proselytizing in India. To Gandhi, most conversions had little to do with religion and a lot to do with hunger.

Freedom of religion does not include freedom to convert others. I would defend anyone's right to practice his or her religion but oppose any overtures to convert. For the missionaries to believe they have a God-given right to save others is not only arrogant, it reduces human spirituality to a cookie-cutter, one-size-fit-all concept of salvation. It tends to turns sublime into profane.

Most major religions carry a Himalaya-size chip of superiority on their shoulders. Each religion thinks it has the answer to life here and a recipe to secure the hereafter. One wonders what goes through the minds of religious leaders when they gather for their interfaith powwows. They profess equality while holding hands but sing a different tune to their flocks back in their churches, synagogues, mosques, and temples. Unless one is a hypocrite, it is just not possible to be equal and superior at the same time.

The recent capture and subsequent release of Korean missionaries in Afghanistan is a case study in ignorance and hypocrisy. Why would these young people risk their lives in a strange and dangerous land rather than putting all their efforts back in their own country? After all, South Korea, a nation of 49 million, still has 36 million non-Christians to convert.

And how about here in America? If every Christian denomination thinks it has the key to salvation, why don't they, in the spirit of love thy neighbor, try converting other Christians to their brand of Christianity? One would think Christian evangelists would first work to save their own before embarking on saving the rest of humanity.

At a recent interfaith seminar at Lakeside, Ohio, a pastor told me that proselytizing is an integral part of Christianity and therefore it may not be possible for most Christians to accord equality to other religions. While this might be a formidable barrier for some, it has not prevented a great majority of believing men and women of all religions from using faith and reason to move forward from the unattainable goal of painting the entire world in one color. All they have to do it to come down from their celestial high horses.

In a civil (and civilized) society, one should have the right to convert but only out of one's own free will. The government has no right to favor one religion over another and use the instruments of the state to facilitate proselytizing to a captive and captured people in occupied lands.

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2007, 11:34:18 AM »
>>Proselytizing by Christian missionaries has a long and checkered history. Burning with zeal to save people around the world, these do-gooders descend with Bible in one hand and loaf of bread in the other to prey on the most vulnerable and needy.<<

<chuckle>

As apposed to the Muslim hordes who murdered their way across Europe and are currently giving you the choice to convert or die. They descend in packed jetliners or with bombs strapped to their bodies. But hey, a Bible and a loaf of bread is MUCH more threatening.

Good grief.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2007, 11:43:02 AM »
Predictably, Rich misses the point entirely. Despite a spate of murders crosstown, the evangelicals entering the indigenous homes is preceded by a sharp slap in the face ... not as egregious but damned unneighborly.

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2007, 12:00:39 PM »
Domer predictably eats a dozen eggs, a pound of bacon, two pounds of potatoes, and a pot of coffee for breakfast. He then feels ashamed and regretful. To make himself feel better he attacks people on the internet.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2007, 12:03:41 PM »
Know thyself.

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2007, 12:30:22 PM »
Brilliant retort fatman.

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2007, 12:34:59 PM »
THERE is a widespread belief in the Muslim world that President Bush, under the guise of war against terrorism, is in fact waging a latter-day Crusade against Islam and Muslims. ......

Nice    :-\    Start with a false premise.....no need to go any further.  Where the hell anyone would believe such is beyond me.  But realizing where the likely sources of the accusation come from, now that's the real story
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Mr_Perceptive

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2007, 01:00:38 PM »
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070910/COLUMNIST12/709100315
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Article published September 10, 2007

Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade


THERE is a widespread belief in the Muslim world that President Bush, under the guise of war against terrorism, is in fact waging a latter-day Crusade against Islam and Muslims. In the waning days of this administration, it is becoming more and more evident that there is some truth to that assumption.

An article published in the Los Angeles Times a few weeks ago outlined a disturbing relationship between the Department of Defense and Christian evangelists. The DoD has been delivering "Freedom Packages" to U.S. soldiers in Iraq containing proselytizing material both in English and Arabic as well as the apocalyptic video game "Left Behind: Eternal Forces." In the video, the soldiers of Christ hunt down enemies.

The packages were supplied by Operation Straight Up, a fundamentalist Christian ministry. This group was also planning to hold a series of entertainment programs for the troops called, symbolically, Military Crusade.

According to the same article, another evangelical group, Christian Embassy, has had unprecedented access to DoD facilities and personnel for making a documentary. Their cozy proximity to DoD led one high Pentagon official, Air Force Maj. Gen. John Catton, to assume the group was a quasifederal agency.

Proselytizing by Christian missionaries has a long and checkered history. Burning with zeal to save people around the world, these do-gooders descend with Bible in one hand and loaf of bread in the other to prey on the most vulnerable and needy. Be it in Iraq, Afghanistan, or India, the modus operandi is the same. Almost a century ago, Mahatma Gandhi, the apostle of religious harmony and pacifism, urged Christian missionaries to stop proselytizing in India. To Gandhi, most conversions had little to do with religion and a lot to do with hunger.

Freedom of religion does not include freedom to convert others. I would defend anyone's right to practice his or her religion but oppose any overtures to convert. For the missionaries to believe they have a God-given right to save others is not only arrogant, it reduces human spirituality to a cookie-cutter, one-size-fit-all concept of salvation. It tends to turns sublime into profane.

Most major religions carry a Himalaya-size chip of superiority on their shoulders. Each religion thinks it has the answer to life here and a recipe to secure the hereafter. One wonders what goes through the minds of religious leaders when they gather for their interfaith powwows. They profess equality while holding hands but sing a different tune to their flocks back in their churches, synagogues, mosques, and temples. Unless one is a hypocrite, it is just not possible to be equal and superior at the same time.

The recent capture and subsequent release of Korean missionaries in Afghanistan is a case study in ignorance and hypocrisy. Why would these young people risk their lives in a strange and dangerous land rather than putting all their efforts back in their own country? After all, South Korea, a nation of 49 million, still has 36 million non-Christians to convert.

And how about here in America? If every Christian denomination thinks it has the key to salvation, why don't they, in the spirit of love thy neighbor, try converting other Christians to their brand of Christianity? One would think Christian evangelists would first work to save their own before embarking on saving the rest of humanity.

At a recent interfaith seminar at Lakeside, Ohio, a pastor told me that proselytizing is an integral part of Christianity and therefore it may not be possible for most Christians to accord equality to other religions. While this might be a formidable barrier for some, it has not prevented a great majority of believing men and women of all religions from using faith and reason to move forward from the unattainable goal of painting the entire world in one color. All they have to do it to come down from their celestial high horses.

In a civil (and civilized) society, one should have the right to convert but only out of one's own free will. The government has no right to favor one religion over another and use the instruments of the state to facilitate proselytizing to a captive and captured people in occupied lands.

I am not one of these types, but it does appear the article is seriously biased. That is okay, but inflammatory statements are not conducive to proper debate. As one example, the article states "All they have to do it to come down from their celestial high horses."

Partisan crap, as it were. Come on. Get a grip.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 01:50:11 PM by Mr_Perceptive »

Henny

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2007, 01:43:20 PM »
I am not one of these types, but it does appear the article is seriously biased. That is okay, but inflammatory statements are not ocnducive to proper debate. As one example, the article states "All they have to do it to come down from their celestial high horses."

Partisan crap, as it were. Come on. Get a grip.

Perhaps, and I do see your point.

But looking into the article I think that there is valuable information to be extracted, and worth noting that the author discussed all 3 major monotheistic religions:

Most major religions carry a Himalaya-size chip of superiority on their shoulders. Each religion thinks it has the answer to life here and a recipe to secure the hereafter. One wonders what goes through the minds of religious leaders when they gather for their interfaith powwows. They profess equality while holding hands but sing a different tune to their flocks back in their churches, synagogues, mosques, and temples. Unless one is a hypocrite, it is just not possible to be equal and superior at the same time.

Mr_Perceptive

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2007, 01:52:06 PM »
Yes, the author did and I commend that. Then, he should have stayed away from hyperbole. But, typical, nonetheless.

And, it is true that most religions feel they and only they are correct. Good thing, too! Otherwise, their theology would be suspect, would it not?
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 02:49:57 PM by Mr_Perceptive »

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2007, 02:44:10 PM »
>>Proselytizing by Christian missionaries has a long and checkered history. Burning with zeal to save people around the world, these do-gooders descend with Bible in one hand and loaf of bread in the other to prey on the most vulnerable and needy.<<

<chuckle>

As apposed to the Muslim hordes who murdered their way across Europe and are currently giving you the choice to convert or die. They descend in packed jetliners or with bombs strapped to their bodies. But hey, a Bible and a loaf of bread is MUCH more threatening.

Good grief.

Yes, because we went up to the pagans in Europe and asked them "are you saved?"

 ::)

Quote
the evangelicals entering the indigenous homes is preceded by a sharp slap in the face ... not as egregious but damned unneighborly

I agree with Domer.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Mr_Perceptive

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2007, 03:08:05 PM »
Certainly not surprising.

I see that you have agreed with him more than Sirs. Tells me from where the missile comes.

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2007, 03:15:36 PM »
Certainly not surprising.

I see that you have agreed with him more than Sirs. Tells me from where the missile comes.

I'm Catholic. I find it annoying to hear "are you saved?"

Besides, I did not realise there was a scorekeeper for 3DHS.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Mr_Perceptive

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2007, 03:24:41 PM »
Certainly not surprising.

I see that you have agreed with him more than Sirs. Tells me from where the missile comes.

I'm Catholic. I find it annoying to hear "are you saved?"

Besides, I did not realise there was a scorekeeper for 3DHS.

"Saved?" Yep, I do believe in Jesus Christ as Saviour, but then I suppose you do as well. I was raised Lutheran. I try to attend services regularly. Good for the soul, etc. The "are you saaved" is, I believe, a question to the effect of "are you saved into the Kingdom of Heaven?" Catholics and Lutherans, for that matter, do not view it thusly, or at least phrase it that way. Same thing, I suppose.

Scorekeeper? Well, I did go back and see where people stand. When in battle, verbal or otherwise, you analyze the opposition, loyal or not.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 03:30:18 PM by Mr_Perceptive »

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Evangelical groups make war on terror look like a Crusade
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2007, 06:09:01 PM »
>>Yes, because we went up to the pagans in Europe and asked them "are you saved?"<<

Can you present an instance of Christians killing pagans who refuse to convert in oh, say the past 300 years or so? This article is simply a lame attempt to deflect current events and point a finger at ancient history. It makes the simple minded revert to the template.

Christianity has it's checkered past, that can't be denied. What is being denied is not only Islams past, but it's present. Why? I really don't know.

>>I agree with Domer.<<

Of course you do.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 06:12:37 PM by Richpo64 »