DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: Knutey on September 22, 2008, 12:12:30 PM
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Palin's town charged women for rape exams
While Sarah Palen was mayor, Wasilla charged victims for their rape exams
Interviews, review of records show no evidence Palin knew victims were charged
Former state representative says it seems unlikely Palin was not aware of issue
From Jessica Yellin
CNN
ANCHORAGE, Alaska (CNN) -- Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's hometown required women to pay for their own rape examinations while she was mayor, a practice her police chief fought to keep as late as 2000.
A former Alaskan lawmaker says it seems unlikely that Gov. Sarah Palin was unaware of Wasilla's policy.
Former state Rep. Eric Croft, a Democrat, sponsored a state law requiring cities to provide the examinations free of charge to victims. He said the only ongoing resistance he met was from Wasilla, where Palin was mayor from 1996 to 2002.
"It was one of those things everyone could agree on except Wasilla," Croft told CNN. "We couldn't convince the chief of police to stop charging them."
Alaska's Legislature in 2000 banned the practice of charging women for rape exam kits -- which experts said could cost up to $1,000.
Palin, the Republican nominee for vice president, often talks about her experience running Wasilla, population approximately 7,000, and that has prompted close scrutiny of her record there. Wasilla's practice of charging victims for their rape exams while she was mayor has gotten wide circulation on the Internet and in the mainstream media. Watch CNN's Jessica Yellin check the facts in Wasilla ยป
Some supporters of Palin say they believe she had no knowledge of the practice. But critics call it "outrageous" and question Palin's commitment to helping women who are the victims of violence.
For years, Alaska has had the worst record of any state in rape and in murder of women by men. The rape rate in Alaska is 2.5 times the national average.
Interviews and a review of records turned up no evidence that Palin knew that rape victims were being charged in her town. But Croft, the former state representative who sponsored the law changing the practice, says it seems unlikely Palin was not aware of the issue.
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"I find it hard to believe that for six months a small town, a police chief, would lead the fight against a statewide piece of legislation receiving unanimous support and the mayor not know about it," Croft said.
During the time Palin was mayor of Wasilla, her city was not the only one in Alaska charging rape victims. Experts testified before the Legislature that in a handful of small cities across Alaska, law enforcement agencies were charging victims or their insurance "more than sporadically."
One woman who wrote in support of the legislation says she was charged for her rape exam by a police department in the city of Juneau, which is hundreds of miles from Wasilla.
But Wasilla stood out. Tara Henry, a forensic nurse who has been treating rape victims across Alaska for the last 12 years, told CNN that opposition to Croft's bill from Wasilla Police Chief Charlie Fannon was memorable.
"Several municipal law enforcement agencies in the state did have trouble budgeting and paying for the evidence collection for sexual assault victims," Henry said. "What I recall is that the chief of police in the Wasilla police department seemed to be the most vocal about how it was going to affect their budget."
Croft has a similar memory. He said victims' advocates suggested he introduce legislation as a way to shame cities into changing their practice, and Wasilla resisted.
"I remember they had continued opposition," Croft said. "It was eight years ago now, but they were sort of unrepentant that they thought the taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for that."
He does not recall discussing the issue with then-Mayor Palin.
The bill, HB270, was before the legislature for six months. In testimony, one expert called the practice of billing the victim "incomprehensible." Others compared it to "dust[ing] for fingerprints" after a burglary, only "the victim's body is the crime scene."
During a rape exam, the victim removes her clothing and a medical professional gathers DNA evidence from her body. There is also a medical component to assess her injuries. That component has led some law enforcement agencies to balk at paying.
Henry, the forensic nurse, said charging victims "retraumatizes them."
"Asking them to pay for something law enforcement needs in order to investigate their case, it's almost like blaming them for getting sexually assaulted," she said.
The Alaska Legislature agreed. The bill passed unanimously with the support of the Alaska Department of Public Safety, the Alaska Peace Officers Association and more than two dozen co-sponsors.
After it became law, Wasilla's police chief told the local paper, The Frontiersman, that it would cost the city $5,000 to $14,000 a year -- money that he'd have to find.
"In the past, we've charged the cost of the exams to the victim's insurance company when possible," Fannon was quoted as saying. "I just don't want to see any more burden on the taxpayer."
He suggested the criminals should pay as restitution if and when they're convicted. Repeated attempts to reach Fannon for comment were unsuccessful.
Judy Patrick, who was Palin's deputy mayor and friend, blames the state.
"The bigger picture of what was going on at the time was that the state was trying to cut their own budget, and one of the things that they were doing was passing on costs to cities, and that was one of the many things that they were passing on, the cost to the city," said Patrick, who recalls enormous pressure to keep the city's budget down.
But the state was never responsible for paying the costs of local investigations. Patrick was also a member of Wasilla City Council, and she doesn't recall the issue coming before council members, nor does she remember discussing the issue with Palin.
She does recall Palin going through the budget in detail. She said Palin would review each department's budget line by line and send it back to department heads with her changes.
"Sarah is a fiscal conservative, and so she had seen that the city was heading in a direction of bigger projects, costing taxpayers more money, and she was determined to change that," Patrick said.
Before Palin came to City Hall, the Wasilla Police Department paid for rape kits out of a fund for miscellaneous costs, according to the police chief who preceded Fannon and was fired by Palin. That budget line was cut by more than half during Palin's tenure, but it did not specifically mention rape exams.
In a statement, Jill Hazelbaker, communications director for Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign, said that "to imply that Gov. Palin is or has ever been an advocate of charging victims for evidence gathering kits is an utter distortion of reality."
"As her record shows, Gov. Palin is committed to supporting victims and bringing violent criminals to justice," Hazelbaker said. "She does not, nor has she ever believed that rape victims should have to pay for an evidence gathering test."
Those who fought the policy are unconvinced.
"It's incomprehensible to me that this could be a rogue police chief and not a policy decision. It lasted too long and it was too high-profile," Croft said.
The rape kit charges have become an issue among Palin critics who say as governor she has not done enough to combat Alaska's epidemic problem of violence against women. They point to a small funding increase for domestic violence shelters at a time when Alaska has a multibillion-dollar budget surplus. Victims' advocates say that services are lacking and that Palin cut funding for a number of programs that treat female victims of violence.
In the past week, Alaska's challenges with sexual assault have been in the spotlight again -- in connection with an ongoing inquiry into whether Palin abused her power by firing the head of Alaska's Department of Public Safety. Palin's office released e-mails showing that one area of disagreement between her and Department of Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan was his lobbying in Washington for $30 million to fund a new program of sexual assault response teams.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/21/palin.rape.exams/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/21/palin.rape.exams/index.html)
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"Sarah is a fiscal conservative, and so she had seen that the city was heading in a direction of bigger projects, costing taxpayers more money, and she was determined to change that," Patrick said.
______________________________________________
She was not any sort of fiscal conservative: she had the city build a huge sports complex and left the city treasury rather deeply in debt, despite several millions obtained by her Washington lobbyist in earmarks.
Borrow and squander. It's what 'Conservatives' do, as opposed to tax and spend.
You can tax and spend and still balance a budget. Borrow and squander leaves you in debt.
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well maybe she`s old school
you know like the 50`s when women who got raped are considered asking for it.
and this is a form of personal responsiblity.
shame we can`t find out what`s the demographics of the rape victims.
it might put a different twist to this
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well maybe she`s old school
you know like the 50`s when women who got raped are considered asking for it.
and this is a form of personal responsiblity.
shame we can`t find out what`s the demographics of the rape victims.
it might put a different twist to this
I actually cant see what difference that would make unless they were all Chinese in which case you might get righteously indignant?
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This is an unfunded mandate issue, not a rape issue.
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This is an unfunded mandate issue, not a rape issue.
I bet it was to the women that were raped when THEY had to fund it.
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well ,not chinese but indians
i don`t know how the eskimos are treated there.
but further east quite a few indians are quite miffed toward the paler residents.
I remember some people compare my land of birth to nazi germany in the 80`s.
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I bet it was to the women that were raped when THEY had to fund it.
Only if they were uninsured.
The bill required cities to fund the exams, not allowing them to recoup expenses through third parties like insurers and perpetrators.
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this does answer the large amount of protesters in sarahs town though.
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this does answer the large amount of protesters in sarahs town though.
That many rape victims in Wasilla? Wasilla pays for the rape kits because that is state law. And Palin hasn't been mayor of that town for years.
I think the protests are manufactured.
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well ,not chinese but indians
i don`t know how the eskimos are treated there.
but further east quite a few indians are quite miffed toward the paler residents.
I remember some people compare my land of birth to nazi germany in the 80`s.
==========================================
You mean China or the Great White North?
I am unsure of the statement Nazi Germany in the '80's. Was that when Hitler forced the Hitler Youth to stay out of the disco's?
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Not to be a wet blankey but it seems the slant on this story now is that Palin had no idea what was going on with this.
I saw a report this morning that it appears that the police chief of Wasila was actually the champion of "we won't pay" positions versus the state trying to cut its budget by forcing the cities to absorb that cost thus being able to cut that spending from the state's budget.
In fact, the state passed a law that said they had to agree to pay those costs in order to get regular state funding.
The idea that Palin didn't know anything about it is perhaps not true or worse, indicative of her ignorance.
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There is no record of Palin commenting on it.
And it is still an unfunded mandate.
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There is no record of Palin commenting on it.
And it is still an unfunded mandate.
True enough.
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You mean China or the Great White North?
canada
not sure about now but in quite afew areas indians were not teated very well .
so bad if a white person kills an indian it`ll never be trace to him.
automaticlly it`s assumed only indians kill each other only.
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Wonder why no one comments on the fact that Illinois, Obama's home state, continues this policy (charging rape victims for their rape kit) that Alaska eliminated.
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Wonder why no one comments on the fact that Illinois, Obama's home state, continues this policy (charging rape victims for their rape kit) that Alaska eliminated.
Probly because it is a RW lie
http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/news_cut/archive/2008/09/vetting_sarah.shtml (http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/news_cut/archive/2008/09/vetting_sarah.shtml)
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Probly because it is a RW lie
The only liar around here is you.
Turns out experts on sexual assault are all too familiar with the issue. "It's been a problem for a long time," says Ilse Knecht, deputy director of public policy at the National Center for Victims of Crime. "We've heard so many stories of victims paying for their exams, or not being able to and then creditors coming after them." In order to qualify for federal grants under the Violence Against Women Act, states have to assume the full out-of-pocket costs for forensic medical exams, as the rape kits are called. But according to a 2004 bulletin published by the NCVC, "[F]eedback from the field indicates that sexual assault victims are still being billed." Knecht says she's recently heard from caseworkers in Illinois, Georgia, and Arkansas reporting that rape victims continue to be charged for their forensic exams.
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/on-health-and-money/2008/2/21/rape-victims-can-be-hurt-financially-too.html (http://www.usnews.com/blogs/on-health-and-money/2008/2/21/rape-victims-can-be-hurt-financially-too.html)
Note that the article is dated February of this year.
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Ouch....that had to hurt
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Probly because it is a RW lie
The only liar around here is you.
Turns out experts on sexual assault are all too familiar with the issue. "It's been a problem for a long time," says Ilse Knecht, deputy director of public policy at the National Center for Victims of Crime. "We've heard so many stories of victims paying for their exams, or not being able to and then creditors coming after them." In order to qualify for federal grants under the Violence Against Women Act, states have to assume the full out-of-pocket costs for forensic medical exams, as the rape kits are called. But according to a 2004 bulletin published by the NCVC, "[F]eedback from the field indicates that sexual assault victims are still being billed." Knecht says she's recently heard from caseworkers in Illinois, Georgia, and Arkansas reporting that rape victims continue to be charged for their forensic exams.
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/on-health-and-money/2008/2/21/rape-victims-can-be-hurt-financially-too.html (http://www.usnews.com/blogs/on-health-and-money/2008/2/21/rape-victims-can-be-hurt-financially-too.html)
Note that the article is dated February of this year.
Wow , ..
But BHO has strong teflon.
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Wow , ..
But BHO has strong teflon.
<
But you guys have bigger moron.
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/16-8 (http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/16-8)
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Cost
According to the Sexual Assault Emergency Treatment Act, the Illinois Department of Public Aid will reimburse the costs of ER treatment if you do not have public aid or private medical insurance.
Under the Illinois Crime Victim's Compensation Act, if you report the assault to the police within 72 hours of the crime and if you file a claim application within two years of the date of the crime, you can be reimbursed for out-of-pocket medical expenses, loss of earnings, psychological counseling, and loss of support income due to the crime. Reimbursement can be up to $27,000.
http://sexualviolence.uchicago.edu/immediate-er-cost.shtml (http://sexualviolence.uchicago.edu/immediate-er-cost.shtml)
This is the bill Obama is proud of?
The victims still have to pay and then they have to let a bunch of bureaucrats know they were raped, reliving the circumstances over and over again until they are finally repaid.
This is current law. Alaska did away with user pay in 2000 and Alaska is the backwards state?
WTF is wrong with you people?
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Nice try skylark, but this whole rape kit story is as phony as the day is long, manufactured by Tony Knowles and his buddies on the Obama campaign by revisionist history. Skylark hides the ball in reviewing and quoting from the committee minutes on the Alaska bill. Read for yourself the committee minutes from the Alaska State Affairs committee re SSHB 270-SEXUAL ASSAULT & SEXUAL ABUSE, and you will get a much different story than skylark trys to spin.
http://www.legis.state.ak.us/basis/get_single_minute.asp?ch=H&beg_line=0317&end_line=0714&session=21&comm=STA&date=20000309&time=0820 (http://www.legis.state.ak.us/basis/get_single_minute.asp?ch=H&beg_line=0317&end_line=0714&session=21&comm=STA&date=20000309&time=0820)
The minutes are enlightening and conclusive. Wasilla Police Chief Fannon was, at worst, telling the hospitals at which the rape exams were conducted to bill the victims' insurance companies, which appears to be corroborated by the 2000 Frontiersman story quoting him. But the victims themselves were at no time being charged directly by any police department in the State of Alaska, Wasilla included - this is confirmed in the committee minutes by both Del Smith, Deputy Commissioner, Alaska Department of Public Safety, and Lauree Hugonin, Director, Alaska Network on Domestic Violence and Sexual Assault (ANDVSA). We learn the true culprit (as to why some rape victims in Alaska "sporadically" received bills related to their rape exams) was the hospitals - specifically, changes in accounting procedures used by the hospitals in relation to billing insurance companies for rape exams. According to TRISHA GENTLE, Executive Director, Council on Domestic Violence & Sexual Assault, some Alaska hospitals "have chosen to separate some of the costs of sexual assault exams. Hospitals are adding sexually transmitted disease (STD) and blood tests to the cost of sexual assault exams, and the hospital makes a choice to bill the victim for those charges. Police departments are willing to pay for sexual assault exams, but it is an internal decision on the part of the hospital as to who pays the hospital bill." Read the whole minutes of that committee meeting as linked above - some key excerpts are copied below. The minutes from every other meeting on this bill are at http://www.legis.state.ak.us/basis/get_minutes.asp?chamb=B&date1=010181&date2=120180&session=21&Root=HB270 (http://www.legis.state.ak.us/basis/get_minutes.asp?chamb=B&date1=010181&date2=120180&session=21&Root=HB270) and they all tell the same story, which completely exonerates Palin from the bogus media headlines that she "charged victims for rape exams." Get this out there, quick!!!!!
"DEL SMITH, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Public Safety,
testified in support of HB 270. He noted that it has always been
the position and practice of law enforcement to pay for the
collection of forensic evidence in support of a criminal
prosecution. Under no circumstances, he explained, has he ever
thought it appropriate to bill a victim or even by extension bill
the victim's insurance company. He commented that he does not
think that a victim ought to even see a bill related to sexual
assault whether it is on their insurance form or not. He
emphasized that a police agency investigating a crime should pay
because that is the cost of doing business in the collection of
evidence no matter what the crime; he does not know of any police
agency that has requested payment. The Department of Public
Safety paid $48,659 in fiscal year (FY) 1999 for sexual assault
exams in the state, and so far in FY 2000 the department has paid
$22,880. He indicated that paying for exams had never been an
issue in the department or in the Anchorage Police Department.
He reiterated Representative Croft's comment that Alaska Cares
handles juvenile sexual assault exams, and the department is
pleased with the proposed CS because it leaves payment of
juvenile exams with Alaska Cares.....
CHAIR JAMES asked if she understood correctly that Mr. Smith is
saying that the department has never billed a victim for exams.
MR. SMITH replied that the department might have been billed, but
he has not found any police agency that has ever billed a victim.
CHAIR JAMES said she understood then that some other entity
billed victims and that the department did not think HB 270 was
necessary for the department.
MR. SMITH answered that he did not think HB 270 was necessary for
the Department of Public Safety under the current administration,
but he would feel more comfortable if there were a law that would
make sure sexual exam billings were discontinued.
LAUREE HUGONIN, Director, Alaska Network on Domestic Violence and
Sexual Assault (ANDVSA), ..... emphasized that it is incomprehensible that the
victim should have to relive the crime upon receiving a bill for
the assault exam from his/her insurance company. Just as Mr.
Smith had testified, billings have not come from police agencies
but have come from hospitals. She hopes everything can be done
to expedite the proposed CS because people must understand that
it is not acceptable for the system to re-victimize someone who
has gone through such a horrible experience.
TRISHA GENTLE, Executive Director, Council on Domestic Violence &
Sexual Assault, testified in support of HB 270. She said that
the council believes that the proposed CS needs to be on the
record so that when those rare situations do arise, hospitals and
police officers have clear direction not to charge sexual assault
victims for the exam. She noted that in those cases when a
victim wants an exam but the police do not think it is justified,
the victim can get a medical exam. She explained that a forensic
exam is a very specific process; in most parts of the state there
are sexual assault response teams available to cooperate with
police. She explained that sexual assault response teams are
made up of trained nurses, examiners, and advocates who are able
to meet with a victim. She acknowledged that there are times
when a victim is not sure he/she wants to go through with a
forensic exam, but he/she has health concerns so instead of going
through a forensic exam he/she chooses to go to a doctor for a
medical exam.
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN said he understood that a medical exam choice
on the part of a victim is a personal choice and would not be
affected by the proposed CS.
MS. GENTLE agreed with Representative Ogan's statement and added
that the victim's exam would not be identified as a sexual
assault exam.
REPRESENTATIVE OGAN commented he is puzzled as to why hospitals
are sending bills to victims when the exam has obviously been
ordered by a local police department.
MS. GENTLE answered that there have been changes in hospital
protocol, and hospitals have chosen to separate some of the costs
of sexual assault exams. Hospitals are adding sexually
transmitted disease (STD) and blood tests to the cost of sexual
assault exams, and the hospital makes a choice to bill the victim
for those charges. Police departments are willing to pay for
sexual assault exams, but it is an internal decision on the part
of the hospital as to who pays the hospital bill. She indicated
that there is an issue of insensitivity."
Posted by: Peter Melaragno at September 22, 2008 07:02 PM
http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/273965.php (http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/273965.php)
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>http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/273965.php (http://confederateyankee.mu.nu/archives/273965.php)<
You would blieve a cyber reg alled Yhe Confederate Yankk. All that gibberish above is just gibberish- What is wrong with you people i obvious You all are fucken liars and the whole world knows it now.
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There is nothing lower than a hospital billing department. They will double bill two parties, double the amount of a bill, or both. They will try to charge collection fees when they have refused payment at the time of treatment and sent no bill for months. They lie, they cheat, the steal, and you can assume that there are many errors on each bill.
So I am not surprised that they send bills to the rapee as well as the cops, hoping that both parties pay.
How a "rape kit" could possibly cost $1000 boggles the mind as well.
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<<How a "rape kit" could possibly cost $1000 boggles the mind as well.>>
That's because business can do things so much more efficiently than government. If government were putting the things together at cost, it would probably cost about 20 cents, but that would be wrong because it's communism. The whole mind-set boggles the mind.
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It's not the rape kit that costs a grand . It is the add on tests, possibly mandated by government, that add to the final costs. Tests like STD detection and services like morning after contraception.
But the important point is that apparently CNN passed on a story it did not research completely. It is also apparent that Knute is not interested in digging for the truth.
Perhaps his brand is not worth protecting.