more "government efficiency"

[Universe Prince]

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-me-wildfires29-2008jul29,0,1425971,full.story

Hunter says he has no regrets about his end run around the chain of command. "California was on fire, I got 'em the planes," he said in a recent interview. "That's my job." To professional firefighters, though, it was a prime example of a "political air show," the high-profile use of expensive aircraft to appease elected officials. Fire commanders say they are often pressured to order planes and helicopters into action on major fires even when the aircraft won't do any good. Such pressure has resulted in needless and costly air operations, experienced fire managers said in interviews. The reason for the interference, they say, is that aerial drops of water and retardant make good television. They're a highly visible way for political leaders to show they're doing everything possible to quell a wildfire, even if it entails overriding the judgment of incident commanders on the ground. Firefighters have developed their own vernacular for such spectacles. They call them "CNN drops." [...] Pressure to use aircraft has grown as wildfires have become larger and more dangerous, and as more subdivisions have sprung up in fire-prone canyons and woodlands. When a column of smoke appears in the distance, frightened homeowners want dramatic action, and an air tanker pouring red retardant on a blazing ridgeline is undeniably dramatic. As a result, Americans have become conditioned to think officials aren't taking a fire seriously until they unleash a ferocious aerial attack. "If there's a fire and there's not an air tanker circling in California, people go, 'Oh my God, we're defenseless,' when in fact we're probably not," said Scott Vail, a retired Forest Service incident commander. [...] Hunter, who makes no secret of his impatience with the Forest Service bureaucracy, has pushed legislation to speed the process for mobilizing military planes during wildfires. He suggested that fire managers are slow to request military aircraft because they want to give business to private contractors. Incident commanders say they're reluctant for different reasons: The big military tankers cost a lot and often aren't effective. L. Dean Clark was fire management officer at the Chiricahua National Monument in southeast Arizona when the 1994 Rattlesnake fire broke out in the Chiricahua Mountains. Clark recalled standing with a group of ranchers as they watched C-130s release clouds of retardant high above steep canyons and rugged pine forests. "It was a pointless exercise in humidity-raising," said Clark, now retired. "They couldn't get in close enough to do much good. The feds needed to be showing the citizens they were doing everything they could to put out the fire. . . . It was a laughable example of a waste of federal money." Long before it reached the ground, the retardant had dissipated into a mist.

Aren't you glad the politicians care about us so much?

[Plane]

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/front/la-me-wildfires29-2008jul29,0,1425971,full.story

Hunter says he has no regrets about his end run around the chain of command. "California was on fire, I got 'em the planes," he said in a recent interview. "That's my job." To professional firefighters, though, it was a prime example of a "political air show," the high-profile use of expensive aircraft to appease elected officials. Fire commanders say they are often pressured to order planes and helicopters into action on major fires even when the aircraft won't do any good. Such pressure has resulted in needless and costly air operations, experienced fire managers said in interviews. The reason for the interference, they say, is that aerial drops of water and retardant make good television. They're a highly visible way for political leaders to show they're doing everything possible to quell a wildfire, even if it entails overriding the judgment of incident commanders on the ground. Firefighters have developed their own vernacular for such spectacles. They call them "CNN drops."

Is'nt this a natural consequence of the people holding electorial power?

The solution might be better education of the public so that the demands for action were demands for more effective actions.

The best thing the public could demand might be homes better sited and built for resisting fires , or preventative measures like wet season burn off of tinder in the woods.

[fatman]

The best thing the public could demand might be homes better sited and built for resisting fires , or preventative measures like wet season burn off of tinder in the woods.

Or a complete revamp of existing Forest Service policies, only this time, leave the ecowhacko's out of the equation.

[Plane]

The best thing the public could demand might be homes better sited and built for resisting fires , or preventative measures like wet season burn off of tinder in the woods.

Or a complete revamp of existing Forest Service policies, only this time, leave the ecowhacko's out of the equation.

Is the problem equal on Federally owned land as it is on Privately owned land?

I live in the east where there is much less Federal land.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Is the problem equal on Federally owned land as it is on Privately owned land?

I live in the east where there is much less Federal land.

=================================
I am going to go out on a limb here and offer the thought that the problem of the government putting out forest fires is pretty much limited to land with trees on it, and the dryer said trees are, the greater the problem.

There are more trees and dryer trees in the West. Also, a higher percentage of the trees in the West belong to the government.

I think Georgia Pacific owns more dry trees nearer the Pacific than near Georgia. I suppose they put out their own fires.

[Plane]

http://www.fs.fed.us/forestmanagement/

Timberland is a unique investment.  You can't take a walk with your kids across a mutual fund, a money market account or a CD.  Across our website, you'll see pictures from land that we own and/or manage.  While monetary returns are extremely important to you and to us, this collection of photographs emphasizes the broad appeal and natural beauty of this potentially outstanding investment.

http://www.buchananforest.com/


http://www.fl-dof.com/forest_management/index.html

http://www.crfm.org/


I suspect that the lay of the land and diffrences in rainfall do make a lot of diffrence, but I am asking in particular whether the Priviate vs public ownership makes a diffrence too.