Author Topic: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias  (Read 11146 times)

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Brassmask

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2007, 04:28:25 PM »
Hey, Henny, hope you and the fam are well!

Regarding bias and graphic images. 

If there were more graphic images on the news in regard to what was happening around the world, a lot of conservatives would be less inclined to support Bush's imperial invasions.

It's one thing for them to think that the US is going in to build schools and let people vote and purple fingers and all that.  It's quite another for them to see the realities of limbs in the streets and kids without arms and what the actual reality is.  It is my opinion that those who still support Bush's war of agression and choice think of the war in terms of how "good wars" are supposed to turn out.  They seem to think that all the realities are just the first few minutes of the "Saving Private Ryan" but they pass by quickly and then we get into how all the troops are Tom Hankses and their causes are just (even when they have absolutely no choice in the causes) and soon the smoke will clear and there'll be a new Jeffersonian Democracy in the middle east making things all-good for America.

That may not be how they think but their defences and actions indicate that is how they think.

Henny

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2007, 04:37:01 PM »
Hey, Henny, hope you and the fam are well!

Regarding bias and graphic images. 

If there were more graphic images on the news in regard to what was happening around the world, a lot of conservatives would be less inclined to support Bush's imperial invasions.

It's one thing for them to think that the US is going in to build schools and let people vote and purple fingers and all that.  It's quite another for them to see the realities of limbs in the streets and kids without arms and what the actual reality is.  It is my opinion that those who still support Bush's war of agression and choice think of the war in terms of how "good wars" are supposed to turn out.  They seem to think that all the realities are just the first few minutes of the "Saving Private Ryan" but they pass by quickly and then we get into how all the troops are Tom Hankses and their causes are just (even when they have absolutely no choice in the causes) and soon the smoke will clear and there'll be a new Jeffersonian Democracy in the middle east making things all-good for America.

That may not be how they think but their defences and actions indicate that is how they think.

Hey Brass, we're doing well. Hard to believe the boys will be 3 soon... it seems like just yesterday when they were born!!

I'm inclined to agree with you on this, which was where I was headed to begin with. But Prince brought up a good point about not seeing graphic images of Bosnia or Kosovo either, which were under Clinton. So then what's the reason?

domer

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2007, 04:38:58 PM »
What a fabulous thread! Is this the Henny effect? It's so good to see you again, Henny. I trust all is well with the baby and your lucky husband!

Henny

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2007, 04:49:44 PM »
What a fabulous thread! Is this the Henny effect? It's so good to see you again, Henny. I trust all is well with the baby and your lucky husband!

Domer! It's been a long time! Everyone is well here, and I hope the same is true with your family. :D

domer

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2007, 04:52:31 PM »
At its most basic levels, with detail left to illustrate the point but not define it, what we are talking about is "the social creation of reality," as I studied in college sociology. Different historical ages, and different political eras both embody and create a dominant view of the world. Hence, Renaissance Italy was different from Stalinist Russia. In a sense, the dominant view establishes a paradigm for thought, one believed to be most advantageous to its time. The Enlightenment, for example, untethered scientific inquiry from religious stricture, as confounded Galileo.

Ultimately, the utility of a given mode of thought determines its survival as a paradigm. In this regard, beyond indisputable "sheer" facts, the orientation of the media in America now, in my opinion, is most conducive to the fulfillment of the promise of our liberal democracy, as founded and as extrapolated to its best.

Lyndon

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2007, 05:00:53 PM »
As a fellow European resident, and one who has also lived, worked and travelled in the US I would back up Henny's main point that news outside the US is simply more raw and honest. I think we get to see more honest footage of the more violent aspects of the Midlle East and trouble spots round the world. As Henny said, Saddam Hussein's execution....well pretty graphic. The distinction is narrowing in the internet age and I would daresay most people on this board access more than their own mainstream media so hopefully such national distinctions are becoming a thing of the past.

Henny: You also said:  "The news here is all the time anti-Bush, and quite often anti-American. People seem to be fascinated to see everything that is happening in the U.S., but only to complain about it. LOL."

I agree there is a lot of interest in what is happening in the US and people here, as a proportion of the population, are more critical of Bush, but I disagree with the term 'anti -American'. Most of us here who are highly critical of the Bush administration's policies do not consider ourselves 'anti-american'. We are anti 'most, if not all, of the Bush admin's foreign policies'. 'Anti-american' to me always implies a term to which I and a lot of Europeans simply do not recognise.

Brassmask

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2007, 05:06:24 PM »
Hey Brass, we're doing well. Hard to believe the boys will be 3 soon... it seems like just yesterday when they were born!!

I'm inclined to agree with you on this, which was where I was headed to begin with. But Prince brought up a good point about not seeing graphic images of Bosnia or Kosovo either, which were under Clinton. So then what's the reason?

(OMG, I know, Henny.  It's great and crazy that they are growing up so quickly.  We're in the midst of potty training and he's taking to it well.  I had no idea that you had MOVED abroad.)

The thing about the graphic images from Bosnia and Kosovo is that I seem to remember seeing lots of pictures of starving prisoners and such and I wasn't even paying that much attention in those days.

Graphic images are unsettling and tend to lead Americans away from wanting to be at war as they should but with THIS "war" in particular and the way its been so horribly, criminally mishandled and was a "war" of choice, seeing death and mutilation and dismemberment and bloodshed would, I think (and would hope) lead Americans to convulse in agony over this whole mess and demand our immediate withdrawal and amends to the people of Iraq.

That would be disastrous for the Bush "administration" since it only behooves them for the US to stay mired in Iraq for the next two years till Bush can toddle off to clear brush on his farm and drink himself to death and Iraq is someone else's mess to clean up.

This is why the media here is biased for the (alleged) rightwingers in the White House, UP.

Amianthus

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2007, 05:10:31 PM »
I agree there is a lot of interest in what is happening in the US and people here, as a proportion of the population, are more critical of Bush, but I disagree with the term 'anti -American'. Most of us here who are highly critical of the Bush administration's policies do not consider ourselves 'anti-american'. We are anti 'most, if not all, of the Bush admin's foreign policies'. 'Anti-american' to me always implies a term to which I and a lot of Europeans simply do not recognise.

IIRC, Henny has moved to the Middle East.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Henny

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #23 on: February 07, 2007, 05:14:59 PM »
Henny: You also said:  "The news here is all the time anti-Bush, and quite often anti-American. People seem to be fascinated to see everything that is happening in the U.S., but only to complain about it. LOL."

I agree there is a lot of interest in what is happening in the US and people here, as a proportion of the population, are more critical of Bush, but I disagree with the term 'anti -American'. Most of us here who are highly critical of the Bush administration's policies do not consider ourselves 'anti-american'. We are anti 'most, if not all, of the Bush admin's foreign policies'. 'Anti-american' to me always implies a term to which I and a lot of Europeans simply do not recognise.

Hi Lyndon,

I should clarify. I'm talking about the local satellite... Jordan and Palestine, etc. (I'm living in Amman.) There are some extremes here, but I should offset that by saying quite fairly that although I've met my share of vitriolic and angry people, there are a large number who do make the distinction.

Henny

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #24 on: February 07, 2007, 05:22:49 PM »
(OMG, I know, Henny.  It's great and crazy that they are growing up so quickly.  We're in the midst of potty training and he's taking to it well.  I had no idea that you had MOVED abroad.)

The thing about the graphic images from Bosnia and Kosovo is that I seem to remember seeing lots of pictures of starving prisoners and such and I wasn't even paying that much attention in those days.


(We're working on potty training too, and he thinks it's a great deal of fun. I will SO GLAD when diapers are over for good! And yes, we moved here last July... I thought I emailed you an update. Anyway, I just requested to add you to YIM Friend list, open it up when you have a time. I'm here a lot, albeit GMT+2)

That's the thing about it... I wasn't paying much attention in those days either. Gone are the rose-colored glasses...

Lyndon

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #25 on: February 07, 2007, 05:28:33 PM »
Okay, thanks Ami and Henny. I much appreciate the clarification.

Cheers,

 Lyndon

sirs

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #26 on: February 07, 2007, 05:38:33 PM »
Regarding bias and graphic images.   If there were more graphic images on the news in regard to what was happening around the world, a lot of conservatives would be less inclined to support Bush's imperial invasions.

Minus the added opionated qualifiers, the appropriate response is "well, d'uh".  If we were receiving the same 24/7 "reporting" of WWII, especially after such events as the Battle of the Bulge, hell, even Normandy, support for Roosevelt's "overt misuse and overextension of our forces, and the slaughtering of thousands upon thousands of our boys" would surely have been near abolished, with cries that we must 'talk" to Germany & Japan, find out what they really want, and end this conflict ASAP

"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Brassmask

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2007, 05:45:06 PM »
Regarding bias and graphic images.   If there were more graphic images on the news in regard to what was happening around the world, a lot of conservatives would be less inclined to support Bush's imperial invasions.

Minus the added opionated qualifiers, the appropriate response is "well, d'uh".  If we were receiving the same 24/7 "reporting" of WWII, especially after such events as the Battle of the Bulge, hell, even Normandy, support for Roosevelt's "overt misuse and overextension of our forces, and the slaughtering of thousands upon thousands of our boys" would surely have been near abolished, with cries that we must 'talk" to Germany & Japan, find out what they really want, and end this conflict ASAP


I don't think so because it was plain that Hitler and his buddies wanted to take over the world.  Not because Roosevelt was insinuating it and then denying insinuating it.  Not because, like Bush, Roosevelt claimed to know more because he had access to more intel than the regular Americans but because news was flying around the globe that the Germans were dropping bombs everywhere and had invaded Poland and Pearl Harbor had undeniably been attacked by the Japanese.  It wasn't like a few guys attacked Pearl Harbor in a commercial plane and then Roosevelt tried to say in order to combat that group of guys who attacked Pearl Harbor, we have to go to war with Germany.

Our troops who were killed then were actually fighting bad guys and were stopping agression against neighboring nations by the Germans and Italy.

Iraq is nothing like WWII in reasoning.

sirs

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2007, 05:48:12 PM »
Regarding bias and graphic images.   If there were more graphic images on the news in regard to what was happening around the world, a lot of conservatives would be less inclined to support Bush's imperial invasions.

Minus the added opionated qualifiers, the appropriate response is "well, d'uh".  If we were receiving the same 24/7 "reporting" of WWII, especially after such events as the Battle of the Bulge, hell, even Normandy, support for Roosevelt's "overt misuse and overextension of our forces, and the slaughtering of thousands upon thousands of our boys" would surely have been near abolished, with cries that we must 'talk" to Germany & Japan, find out what they really want, and end this conflict ASAP


I don't think so because it was plain that Hitler and his buddies wanted to take over the world. 

So does militant islam and Islamofascism.  And the point remains, if 24/7 viewing of the carnage of world war II were broadcast, including daily reports of the thousands of our soldiers, being lost DAILY, "support for the war" would have certainly degraded


« Last Edit: February 07, 2007, 06:44:28 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Brassmask

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Re: Speaking of the Media's Liberal Bias
« Reply #29 on: February 07, 2007, 06:32:58 PM »
Quote
So does militant islam and Islamofascism.
 

Wanting it and invading a country to do it are two different things that require two totally different responses.

Quote
And the point remains, if 24/7 viewing of the carnage of war were broadcast, including daily reports of the thousands of our soldiers, being lost DAILY, "support for the war" would have certainly degraded

That's conjecture at this point.  Seeing tanks roll down the Champs de Ellyse (sp?) as men weep is a surefire sign that the US needs to be involved and invested in stopping the spread of Nazism. 

Seeing poor video of bin Laden in a cave with a gun beside him is not a surefire sign that we need to invade Iraq "pre-emptively".

The cause was immediate and growing with Germany and the Nazis and Americans could look to that and know that the lives lost on our side were stopping a phenomenon of destruction, not a looseknit group of fundies who have some money.  Germany was a nation with an army that Americans could see rolling across borders, killing as they went.

Saddam hadn't even tried another feeble attempt at invading Kuwait and had absolutely NO connection to the Saudis who attacked us on 9.11.