Author Topic: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam  (Read 2005 times)

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Henny

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Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« on: September 17, 2007, 09:30:54 AM »
Inflating the threat of radical Islam
No, America is not fighting WW IV
Steve Chapman
September 16, 2007
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/chi-oped0916chapmansep16,1,6969008.column?ctrack=3&cset=true

When the Cold War fizzled out, Americans rejoiced. Our long standoff with the Soviet Union, shadowed by the specter of nuclear war, was over, and the West had prevailed. What wasn't clear then was that many Americans would miss something about that era: the sense of being part of a historic, existential struggle between global forces of good and evil, in which we were on the right side.

The collapse of the Soviet empire deprived us of what had been a central part of our political identity. Since the end of World War II, America had stood in the forefront of opposition to communism. That opposition helped define us, and its disappearance left a void.

In 1989, conservative intellectual Francis Fukuyama lamented what lay ahead: "The struggle for recognition, the willingness to risk one's life for a purely abstract goal, the worldwide ideological struggle that called forth daring, courage, imagination, and idealism, will be replaced by economic calculation, the endless solving of technical problems, environmental concerns, and the satisfaction of sophisticated consumer demands."

Most of us soon got over the feelings of drift. But some people have dealt with the loss in another way -- by casting themselves in a grand revival of Armageddon. In this case, it's a titanic war against radical Islam, which, as the alarmists tell it, often sounds like a war between Islam and the West.

This enemy, we are told, is the heir of communism and Nazism, which President Bush often invokes to justify staying in Iraq. In this year's State of the Union address, he said, our foes "want to force our country to retreat from the world and abandon the cause of liberty. They would then be free to impose their will and spread their totalitarian ideology."

Norman Podhoretz, an adviser to Rudy Giuliani, titled his new book "World War IV: The Long Struggle Against Islamofascism." (No, you didn't sleep through World War III -- that was the Cold War.) He says, "The stakes are nothing less than the survival of Western civilization, to the extent that Western civilization still exists, because half of it seems to be committing suicide." By that, he seems to be referring not just to terrorist groups but also to the proliferation of Muslims in the West, which many conservatives see as a mortal peril.

But to equate our current challenges with the Nazis and Soviets is to grossly misunderstand our enemies. Start with Saddam Hussein, who was often compared to Hitler -- though his army, quite unlike the Wehrmacht, dissolved on contact with the U.S. military. His Iraq was secular, not Islamist, and if he posed a danger, it was to his neighbors, not Western civilization.

Osama bin Laden must rejoice to be depicted as endangering our entire culture and way of life. In fact, his movement has failed to gain power in a single country even in the Islamic world, and he hasn't been able to carry out an attack on American soil in over six years. His movement exists today as a fragmented network of terrorist cells, with only a modest capacity to harm us.

Iran, with its fire-breathing president and nuclear ambitions, is supposed to be a looming threat to our existence. But as the world's only superpower, we can easily contain and deter even enemies with nukes -- which is why no one talks about fighting World War IV against North Korea.

The vision of a monolithic Islamic movement hostile to everything we value is equally warped. We usually associate the religion with Arab militants, but the world's biggest Muslim populations are in Indonesia, Bangladesh, Pakistan, India and Nigeria, not the Middle East. Some Muslim countries, such as Turkey, Indonesia and Senegal, are free and democratic. The others vary greatly in political openness and personal liberty -- sort of like non-Muslim countries.

Most Muslims are not terrorist sympathizers. A recent Gallup poll found that only 7 percent of the world's Muslims regard "the 9/11 attacks as completely justifiable and have an unfavorable view of the United States." Nor do many of them yearn to stamp out our freedoms. "When asked what they admire most about the West," reports Gallup, "Muslims frequently mention political freedom, liberty, fair judicial systems and freedom of speech." The striking thing about American Muslims is not how poorly they fit into a tolerant society, but how well.

Radical Islamic elements pose a danger to our security that will demand vigilance, resources, and in some instances, military action. But let's not make it more than it is.

_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2007, 09:56:46 AM »
Quote
A recent Gallup poll found that only 7 percent of the world's Muslims regard "the 9/11 attacks as completely justifiable and have an unfavorable view of the United States."

7%

And yet, people here have indicated how pervasive that belief must be in Islam.  ::)
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
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BT

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2007, 09:59:56 AM »
Political debate is often chock full of exaggerations. I don't believe we need a Department of Homeland Security. I do believe the war in Iraq was justified.

You may believe quite the opposite.

I don't believe Islam is any more dangerous a religion than Christianity, Catholicism, Judaism or any other ism you can throw out there.

I do believe some adherents of each can go to extremes in their interpretations and proselytizing of their views.  And perhaps they need to be monitored as closely as drug dealers and other criminal enterprises.

Far as i am concerned, you are free to believe what you will, just don't try to make me believe as you at the point of a gun, edge of a sword or the ink of a law.






_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2007, 10:14:12 AM »
Political debate is often chock full of exaggerations. I don't believe we need a Department of Homeland Security. I do believe the war in Iraq was justified.

You may believe quite the opposite.

I don't believe Islam is any more dangerous a religion than Christianity, Catholicism, Judaism or any other ism you can throw out there.

I do believe some adherents of each can go to extremes in their interpretations and proselytizing of their views.  And perhaps they need to be monitored as closely as drug dealers and other criminal enterprises.

Far as i am concerned, you are free to believe what you will, just don't try to make me believe as you at the point of a gun, edge of a sword or the ink of a law.

Actually, I tend to think Homeland Security was a pile of manure as well.

The problem Bt, is that sometimes these exaggerations takeover the language of political leaders.

In Europe, before World War II, Judaism was an extremely dangerous religion. Of course, it really wasn't...but it became such conventional wisdom that those who pointed out the folly of that thought were considered soft or ridiculous.

The science fiction author Iain Banks once wrote:

Quote
...there came a point when if a conspiracy was that powerful and subtle it became pointless to worry about it.

I think that can easily be paraphrased to:

Quote
...there came a point when if a lie was that powerful and subtle it became pointless to argue against it.

Look at the people here. I've asked before, how many people per year are actually killed by international terrorism? No answer. We've pointed out, right here, that very few Muslims actually believe in terrorism and 9/11 being justified.

Yet, what do we hear? That terrorism is a threat against "western civilization" or "freedom" itself. That Islam is a threat. That Christianity needs to unite to fight this threat. We hear justifications for denying people due process, or even the right to know what they are being charged with - even torture.

You're right, people are entitled to their own opinions, but somewhere along the way people have gotten an idea that opinions cannot be wrong. They can! That's why we have data, research, and evidence that goes beyond hearsay, anecdotal, and conjecture.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Michael Tee

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2007, 10:31:50 AM »
Excellent article, Henny, and thank you.  A real breath of fresh air and common sense amidst all the right-wing hysteria and absurdities.  Maybe America is coming to its senses.

gipper

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2007, 10:40:56 AM »
Let me add my two, typically centrist cents. I trust the 7% figure, but I note the potential, especially in economically or perceptually depressed enclaves, to rally behind a vindicator against an outside enemy. This is happening in Palestine and Lebanon, and in pockets throughout the Muslim world, as world recruiting figures for makeshift al Qaeda cells would no doubt verify. I note in this regard that the percentage of Bolsheviks at the start of the Russian Revolution was comparable, as was the percentage of hardcore Nazis in interwar Germany. Danger lurks. To leave it unattended is folly in my book, especially with the potential of WMD falling into the wrong hands. The bywords should be vigilance, respect, but unmitigating pressure on the bad guys in concert with moderate Islam, all the time using the "right tools."

Richpo64

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2007, 12:32:56 PM »
Let's round this number off, if you don't mind. I had always heard it was ten percent anyway.

10 percent of 1 billion is ... 100 million.

100 million.

Nothing to worry about?

Okay.

If ten percent of the worlds Catholics believed that blowing up abortion clinics was justified, you people would be calling for every Catholic church to be abolished from this country. Every liberal in this country would have a stroke (one can dream).

_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2007, 01:02:42 PM »
7% is a small minority.

I ask again, how many people were killed by International Terrorism last year?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Richpo64

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2007, 01:06:59 PM »
7 percent is a damn big army.

70 million people.

Nothing to worry about?

Okay. If you say so.

_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2007, 01:13:06 PM »
7 percent is a damn big army.

70 million people.

Nothing to worry about?

Okay. If you say so.

Did it say they are all forming a great big army?

Try reading the article. Or, you know? Common sense.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Richpo64

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2007, 01:14:50 PM »
Try opening your eyes.

You know, brains.

_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2007, 01:15:59 PM »
Try opening your eyes.

You know, brains.

You mean to the giant 70,000,000 person army that is forming? LOL

You have evidence of this, of course?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

Richpo64

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2007, 01:30:29 PM »
You really aren't that bright are you.

70 million would make a damn big army. See, that's what people call speaking figuratively.

Understand?

gipper

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2007, 01:44:23 PM »
This tit-tat, back-and-forth on inconsequentialities is demeaning to both of you. The issue, I believe, is how I defined it.

_JS

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Re: Inflating the Threat of Radical Islam
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2007, 01:45:42 PM »
I think that is fair Domer.

I certainly think it is a problem, and as you implied there are certainly issues of security that were very lacking pre-9/11.

Yet, is this priority #1? I hardly think so.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.