Author Topic: Dinner with Ahmadinejad  (Read 34564 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #30 on: September 27, 2007, 11:59:05 AM »
I wouldn't go near so far as to claim "armageddon", but I do find a scary trend how in so many generations, there seems to jump up some "group" that wants to rid the world of Jews

Spoken like a true westerner.

Pray tell Sirs, will you list these generations and groups that wish to see Jews exterminated?

Why do you find that strange, but not groups that wish to see other ethnic or religious groups exterminated?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #31 on: September 27, 2007, 12:26:06 PM »
JS, I find your oft-expressed hostility to the historical plight of Jews, packaged now as a vindication of the rights of OTHER oppressed, to be a harsh verdict by a would-be compassionate man and a disingenuous distortion of the dynamics of history, laughable coming from a self-proclaimed intellectual of essentially moral concerns.

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #32 on: September 27, 2007, 12:46:51 PM »
Domer, I have nothing but compassion for the historical plight of the Jews. I've even posted a very thought-provoking poem in here by Irving Layton on Christianity's role in the history of Jewish oppression. The only response I received was from a Canadian Jew (thank you Tee).

I've pointed out Fascism and Nazism's relationship with Christianity and the disservice that the modern revisionist view of lumping Nazism in with paganism and occultism does.

I'm also one of the few here who defends the European nations that make it illegal to deny the Holocaust. So, impugn me all you like, but I'll let what I've said speak for itself.

On the other hand, there are many ethnic groups and religious groups that have faced and do face religious persecution. Genocide has happened in history both before and after the Holocaust. It is not a crime against Judaism to point that out Domer.

Despite western views, the Jewish people are not the only people to have ever been oppressed. Moreover, the apartheid state of Israel is doing enough to oppress others as we speak. By all means, call me anti-Semitic (it wouldn't be the first time you've done so), but I cannot roll my eyes hard enough when I read Sirs and others post something like: "I do find a scary trend how in so many generations, there seems to jump up some "group" that wants to rid the world of Jews" with an obvious focus on only Iran and Israel, to the exception of the rest of the world (and the history that goes along with that world).

I know a political hack statement when I read it. There is no compassion there for the historical plight of the Jews, Domer. I think you know that.

I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #33 on: September 27, 2007, 12:55:14 PM »
Yes, but the Jews are OUR victims, and we have a role in unraveling the hairball. Your panoramic view of the jolly history of genocide does not address that. Remember, all politics is local, and in a very real sense this problem is "local" for us.

Christians4LessGvt

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11139
    • View Profile
    • "The Religion Of Peace"
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #34 on: September 27, 2007, 12:57:41 PM »
"JS, I find your oft-expressed hostility to the historical plight of Jews"

JS  are you anti-semitic?
« Last Edit: September 27, 2007, 12:59:25 PM by ChristiansUnited4LessGvt »
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #35 on: September 27, 2007, 01:00:45 PM »
Yes, but the Jews are OUR victims, and we have a role in unraveling the hairball. Your panoramic view of the jolly history of genocide does not address that. Remember, all politics is local, and in a very real sense this problem is "local" for us.

"Our victims?" No more than the Roma, the Native Americans, and the African-Americans.

I don't have a "jolly history of genocide." It is a despicable and repeating aspect of history.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #36 on: September 27, 2007, 01:01:10 PM »
"JS, I find your oft-expressed hostility to the historical plight of Jews"

JS  are you anti-semitic?

No.

Are you?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #37 on: September 27, 2007, 01:07:58 PM »
Yes, take responsibility for what is ours. While the Roma are stretching it for my historical lineage, I take my share of responsibility for blacks and Native Americans. It seems that you want to dilute to the point of rinse-water your responsibility -- and your heritage's -- for the plight of Jews.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #38 on: September 27, 2007, 01:13:36 PM »
JS, I find your oft-expressed hostility to the historical plight of Jews"

JS  are you anti-semitic?
================================================
One observes that people do not ask, ever, if someone is anti-Gypsy or a host of otherr things one might be, as though anti-semitism is some sort of diabolic disease, and all that profess it should be treated as lepers or worse.

The AIPAC seems to have been quite successful in tainting anyone who does not approve is everything that Israel does or opposes any part of the vast aid that the US donates to this very small middle-class country to which the US donates more than any other, is anti-semitic and should be ostracized entirely, all their ideas should be rejected. But anti-semitism as defined nowadays is defined by the AIPAC, and their contention is that anti-Zionist is equivalent to anti-semitism.

I note that they seem to have not managed to taint Jimmy Carter with this, but are still going after any academics- even Jewish ones- that disagree with Israeli policies and handouts to Israel. There must have been some interesting AIPAC committee meetings discussing Carter and others.

A person who disagrees with Israel is anti-Zionist, not anti semitic, by the way. A true anti Semite should have scribbled at least one swastika, I think.

There was a time when being Jewish in the US was a disadvantage, but that time has passed long ago. American Jews have more power and more money and more representation in Congress than damn near any other group. They are over represented in Congress and the Senate and vastly overrepresented in the bureaucracy.

This is rarely pointed out, though, because anyone doing the pointing would be accused of anti-semitism.

If I am a descendant of an Ulster Catholic, and I feel that SinnFein or the Provos have the right idea about uniting all of Eire's 33 counties, and I send them money, I will likely be jailed if caught. I am not allowed to express my political belief that all of Ireland should be united.

On the other hand, I can send all the money I wish to AIPAC, and lobby my government to subsidize Israel's colonization fo the WB and constant mistreatment of Palestinians, I will never be chastized, not even in the papers.

There is not even a word for being anti-Irish unity that I can use to lambaste my detractors like anti-Semitic.

I would like to point out that I am partly of Irish ancestry, and think that a united Ireland is a pretty good idea, especially since the Auld Sod has gotten mostly rid of the Brits as well as the insufferable wet blanket to progress that was the Holy Mother Roman Catholic Church, and is now the most prosperous nation in the EEC.  I don't support the Sinn Fein or the Provos, because I think they have become counter productive and irrelevant these days. I expect that eventually the Ulster Protestants will see that union with the Euro-based EEC and the Irish Republic will be greatly to their advantage. This might take a couple of generations, but the days of suffering as Frank McCourt did in Limerick are over and the wait will not be painful at all.

.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2007, 01:25:54 PM by Xavier_Onassis »
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #39 on: September 27, 2007, 01:32:23 PM »
Yes, take responsibility for what is ours. While the Roma are stretching it for my historical lineage, I take my share of responsibility for blacks and Native Americans. It seems that you want to dilute to the point of rinse-water your responsibility -- and your heritage's -- for the plight of Jews.

My heritage is German as well, so the Roma are fully a part, if you look at it from your perspective.

But I do see it from a very world point of view. I'm a socialist. It is the class struggle that concerns me most. Tell me something Domer, when you drive or walk around Mott Haven in the South Bronx, St. Ann's Avenue - who do you see?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #40 on: September 27, 2007, 01:35:23 PM »
I happen to drive and walk around the Castle Hill section o the Bronx, truth be told, a black and Hispanic area, mostly, and I see friends. What's your point?

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #41 on: September 27, 2007, 01:42:23 PM »
As long as we're asking personal questions, socialist, what do you do when you go to work?

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #42 on: September 27, 2007, 01:44:37 PM »
I happen to drive and walk around the Castle Hill section o the Bronx, truth be told, a black and Hispanic area, mostly, and I see friends. What's your point?

I see the face of Christ in the poor, destitute, hopeless. It does not matter what religion or ethnic background they represent. It does not matter what beliefs they hold or what choices they've made in the past. New York, Nashville, Atlanta, Gaza, Tehran, Cairo, London, Baghdad...

That is Christianity. That is Socialism.

If you want to know what I believe, that's what I believe.
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

_JS

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3500
  • Salaires legers. Chars lourds.
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #43 on: September 27, 2007, 01:45:19 PM »
As long as we're asking personal questions, socialist, what do you do when you go to work?

Are you asking what I do for a living?
I smell something burning, hope it's just my brains.
They're only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains
   So stuff my nose with garlic
   Coat my eyes with butter
   Fill my ears with silver
   Stick my legs in plaster
   Tell me lies about Vietnam.

gipper

  • Guest
Re: Dinner with Ahmadinejad
« Reply #44 on: September 27, 2007, 02:01:51 PM »
Yes, what do you do for a living?