Author Topic: For what it's worth  (Read 4522 times)

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sirs

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #30 on: May 05, 2011, 12:31:15 PM »
Actually, and factually, it was Clinton who didn't have the balls
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2011, 12:35:54 PM »
Clinton could have taken out Bin Laden, and Juniorbush could have done the same. They both had the chance.

But Obama actually did it. All the rest is just rhetoric.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #32 on: May 05, 2011, 12:49:52 PM »
Coulda, shoulda, didn't vs did.  The issue is in being objective, vs being some rabid BDS'er
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #33 on: May 05, 2011, 01:23:38 PM »
Look, shit for brains, if you had any idea where you were, or who you were talking to, you'd know I can't stand John Kerry. Second, Kerry has nothing to do with the facts surrounding Tora Bora. You're building a strawman.

You brought John Kerry into this thread (not I) by posting a link to some report that he chaired

So not only are you pathetically uninformed, you're highly disingenuous.

I just read the words of Centcom Chairmen and people that ran the CIA's Bin Laden
Task Force under President Clinton.

Third, obviously, I'm talking about Bush and his failure to get Bin Laden because idiots
like you are pretending Obama didn't have the balls to pull the triger on Bin Laden
when in fact it was Bush who didn't have the balls.

The head of the Clinton CIA Bin Laden Task Force Michael Scheuer has stated
President Clinton was given eight to 10 chances to kill or capture bin Laden
but refused to act. So if Clinton had acted Sept 11th and Tora Bora probably
wouldnt even have ever happened.

In fact Michael Scheuer had these exact words to say:

Scheuer acknowledged that there is plenty of blame to go around for not getting
Bin Laden, but asserted that Clinton bears most of it:

"Oh, I think there's plenty of blame to go around, sir, but the fact of the matter is that
the Bush Administration had one chance that they botched, and the Clinton Administration
had eight to ten chances that they refused to try
..."


http://newsbusters.org/media/2006-09-25-CBSTES.wmv


"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Kramer

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #34 on: May 05, 2011, 01:42:38 PM »
Clinton could have taken out Bin Laden, and Juniorbush could have done the same. They both had the chance.

But Obama actually did it. All the rest is just rhetoric.

what exactly did obama do?

sirs

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #35 on: May 05, 2011, 01:46:19 PM »
He said "go"
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BSB

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #36 on: May 05, 2011, 01:49:52 PM »
Well, Christian with less, I'm not sure yet whether you're actually as ignorant as you appear or just highly disingenuous. The source of both is poor effort and unfortunately the end product of both makes one a good fit here at 3DHS.  Too bad.  I'm sure you know about some things that I don't and when it comes to what we've been talking about here there are few in the general population who know more then I do.

BSB

BT, new blood? Is it coming?

BT

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #37 on: May 05, 2011, 02:04:34 PM »
Well, Christian with less, I'm not sure yet whether you're actually as ignorant as you appear or just highly disingenuous. The source of both is poor effort and unfortunately the end product of both makes one a good fit here at 3DHS.  Too bad.  I'm sure you know about some things that I don't and when it comes to what we've been talking about here there are few in the general population who know more then I do.

BSB

BT, new blood? Is it coming?

Once we get some of the behavior problems solved, i will be running some google ads to draw new members.

When it's time to flip the switch everyone will have to come into the forums from this link.
http://debategate.com/

And hopefully people will feel comfortable inviting friends from other forums and facebook to join in. Problem with that is you possibly lose anonymity. As it stands now the only people signing up are eastern europeans who i assume are harvesting email addresses for spam. And i reject them so they can't view members lists.

I am open to any suggestions as to how to improve the forum and site and how to increase membership.




Plane

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #38 on: May 05, 2011, 02:51:22 PM »
  We can't kill everyone that wants to be an enemy,there is too much replenishment.

  Every now and then when an enemy rises in signifigance to the point that he is worth the effort and it will really reduce the threat to go get him, then we ought to go on and get him.

  Osama was not born dangerous , I think that the time when he grew in signifigance as an enemy was during Clintons watch, early in the Clinton regime it would have been strange to mount a major operation just to get OBL he just didn't seem all that important , later when he had accomplished more fatal attacks on Americans and others he was getting more attention and more effort in a ramping up of resorces Osama also devoted more and more to avoiding capture or assination, in this era I think the worst mistake was useing important evidence gleaned from listening to OBL cell phone in the conviction of a terrorist at trial, OBL stopped useing cell phones and we lost that handle on his whereabouts.

   While president Bush was chaseing OBL overwhelming power was used at times , I don't see how surgeing more or sooner would have garunteed OBLs being caught, already enough was put into Afganistan to win territory at will , would more have been more productive or redundant? I think we learned with the surge that more sooner would indeed have been productive , going small in Afganistan might be the mistake of this era.

   While Obama is president OBL actually gets run to ground and shot, can't argue that there was ineffectiveness or bad decisions in the face of success.

   Gathering inteligence on OBL started a long time ago and the determination to kill or capture has been long running, what got OBL was persistance.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #39 on: May 05, 2011, 03:12:33 PM »
yeah Clinton had multiple chances to kill Bin Laden that could have prevented the worst attack
on the country in US history......

ya know the President Clinton that never once met one-on-one with his CIA director James Woolsey....course ole Slick Willy always found time to get "face to face" with Monica Lewinsky!

married men gots better things to do that meet one on one with CIA Directors!
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #40 on: May 05, 2011, 04:14:04 PM »
Bin Laden was certainly not turned into an enemy by Bill Clinton. He was a guy who hated godless Communists and discovered, after working with Americans, that Americans were every bit as evil from his point of view as the Russians. And I really donlt think that Monica Lewinsky had one thing to do with Clinton not taking out bin Laden.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #41 on: May 05, 2011, 04:22:05 PM »
Doesn't matter.  Simple math, Clinton had 8-10 chances to take him down.  He didn't take 1
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BSB

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #42 on: May 05, 2011, 07:51:22 PM »
I don't know when Bin Laden became "a bad man" but I do know he learned a lot from us. One of the ways we brought down the USSR was by forcing them to over extend themselves in Afghanistan. He watched that whole thing unfold and turned around and applied the same formula to us. Just look at all the money we've spent fighting terrorism since 9/11.


BSB
 

Plane

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #43 on: May 05, 2011, 07:58:03 PM »
I don't know when Bin Laden became "a bad man" but I do know he learned a lot from us. One of the ways we brought down the USSR was by forcing them to over extend themselves in Afghanistan. He watched that whole thing unfold and turned around and applied the same formula to us. Just look at all the money we've spent fighting terrorism since 9/11.


BSB
  Ah yes , but...  He seemed also to learn that the US is impatient and not persistant!

He was quite wrong on that point.

BSB

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Re: For what it's worth
« Reply #44 on: May 05, 2011, 08:08:55 PM »
Plane: "He was quite wrong on that point."

Yes he was. His assassination, almost ten years on from 9/11, proves your point. Good for us.

BSB