DebateGate
General Category => 3DHS => Topic started by: sirs on November 13, 2015, 08:03:39 PM
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Not just America or England, now we have them blowing up a Russian plane, and cooridnating terrorist attacks in France, outside a soccer match between France and Germany.
So....what was that about Obama's reference to a "JV team" again?
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They were a JV tam when he said it.
He is no longer saying it, because it is no longer true.
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I know someone with a home in Paris.
Yes I am mad at Isis.
I would not be much madder if I were a Parisian myself,
Hey XO ... I do not know much French, can you help me with this?
Is "je suis parisien" proper and appropriate?
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They were a JV tam when he said it.
He is no longer saying it, because it is no longer true.
They were never a "JV tam". He tried to push it to imply that AlQeada had been largely disassembled, and ISIS was a nothing-much movement
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Obama should resign over this....
hell the same day as the Paris attack the idiot claims ISIS is "contained"!
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The left and Obama sychophants literally decry every time Benghazi comes up, since what it highlights, is like a festering wound. As you look deeper, you see just how bad the situation is. Benghazi was a micro-window of just how disastrous his foreign policy has been
In a nut shell, he campaigns on being this "uniter", who will bring all these factions, both domestic & foreign together. Our allies will come to embrace our "non-cowboy posture, and our enemies will grasp how we are trying to .... "understand" their plight & grievences
Then reality sets in, where with our acute lack of leadership, we alienate our allies, embolden our enemies, and allow terrorists to flourish. Benghazi demonstrates that despite repeated efforts by those closest to the areas of danger, in requesting help, Our executive branch, led by the State Dept, IGNORED THE INCREASING WARNING SIGNS. (just as they ignored that JV team, ISIS). Benghazi demonstrated that we had no response to an attack, as the Executuve branch tried to lay blame on some obscure video, creating this completely "spontaneous protest". Benghazi demonstrates not just an acute lack of leadership & incompotence, but an ever growing requirement to play the CYA game, even going so far as blaming Ambassador Stevens for accepting such a dangerous assignment. AND THEY KNEW, from the outset, that this was a terrorist attack, and not some video....but lied to the American people, and those families who lost loved ones, since the truth would have been far too politically damaging to those in power
What's happening in Paris, may have not been preventable, but it could clearly be seen thru the eyes of what happened in Benghazi, as we watched a growing terrorist threat, go largely unchecked, outside of a few pin-prick drone strikes. And despite pleas for help and additional military force, we sat there, complacent to think by "being nice", that the terrorists would be nice in return
Incompotence in leadership, at an exponential level
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Obama should resign because some Muslims planned an attack on Paris?
France is filled with a generation of young, Muslim Maghrebbis (Algerians, Moroccans, Tunisians) who are neither French nor real Arabs. The idea of these attacks it to provoke hostility among the French against Muslims, who will in turn, join the terrorists, perhaps in France, perhaps in the Middle East. Up to now, they have not dared to rebel, but the goal here is to send them over the edge.
It is a barbaric, but clever strategy, from a tactical point of view.
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Obama should resign because some Muslims planned an attack on Paris?
France is filled with a generation of young, Muslim Maghrebbis (Algerians, Moroccans, Tunisians) who are neither French nor real Arabs. The idea of these attacks it to provoke hostility among the French against Muslims, who will in turn, join the terrorists, perhaps in France, perhaps in the Middle East. Up to now, they have not dared to rebel, but the goal here is to send them over the edge.
It is a barbaric, but clever strategy, from a tactical point of view.
That seems like a reasonable plot to suspect.
Do you think this is that thought out and purposeful?
If it is that implies a leadership that could be persuaded of the uselessness of such a strategy, only of course, if it is not working.
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Obama should resign because some Muslims planned an attack on Paris?
(http://www.baconbites.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/webassets/nyp_logo_230x32.gif)
It's time for Obama to make a choice: Lead us or resign
By Michael Goodwin
November 14, 2015
http://nypost.com/2015/11/14/its-time-for-obama-to-make-a-choice-lead-us-or-resign/
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President Obama is leading, and no, he will not resign. It is idiotic to suggest that he should consider it.
Isis wants recruits, especially those who speak a European language and have an EU passport. The various attacks were mostly suicide attacks, so they were planned by someone higher up the chain of command from the cannon fodder status.
The plan is to disrupt Western civilization. to show their fellow Muslims that they can get away with damaging Western civilization in the same way Western culture has disrupted the Muslim status quo with women's rights, consumer capitalism and mass participation in how society is run, They want it to be run as Mohammad prescribed: a clerical ruling presence guiding a small wealthy feudal elite.
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Of course he won't resign. No President is going to resign, unless they're about to be impeached. But no, he's not leading either. Far from it. And that severe lack of leadership has been instrumental in the growth & expansion of that JV team, ISIS
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Yeah, like you are the expert.
Get a life, sirs.
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Another priceless & epic rebuttal from the left. Your contributions are indeed appreciated 8)
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As a rule, military strategies are rarely announced publicly. So saying that Obama has no strategy because he has not described one in great detail is bogus.
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As a rule, military strategies are rarely announced publicly. So saying that Obama has no strategy because he has not described one in great detail is bogus.
Is there any reason to suspect that an effective strategy is being employed?
Is there any reason to suspect that a strategy is being employed?
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As a rule, military strategies are rarely announced publicly. So saying that Obama has no strategy because he has not described one in great detail is bogus.
And no one is advocating that Obama lay all our cards down to broadcast what we plan on doing. What he has described IS NOT WORKING, and yet he wants to "stay the course" of a strategy that is patently NOT WORKING. It's neither containing or slowing down the expansion of ISIS.
Currently there IS NO MILITARY STRATEGY, outside of occasional pro-active drone strikes, and reactive "special forces". Even Democrats are noting this, foremost being Senator Feinstein, by no means a conservative Democrat in any shape or form. We HAD the capability of knocking down ISIS to a next-to-nothing rag tag extremists, devoid of any base of operation. But instead, our President decided to punt his leadership to this....and of all people to punt it to, he gave it to Putin. Now Russia is looked to as the go to leader to help bring down ISIS
Thank you President Leaderless
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It would be a strategy to not reveal the strategy. Catch them by surprise. Like the Trojan horse.
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I wish that there were some sign of successful strategy, like wins for us or losses for them.
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It would be a strategy to not reveal the strategy. Catch them by surprise. Like the Trojan horse.
We've already seen and heard the "strategy"....and ITS NOT WORKING. And the trojan horse in this case, it the asinine notion of bringing in thousands of these refugees, with no viable way of vetting them. Then we get to witness our own version of what just happened in Paris, when France allowed so many of these refugees into their country
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I suggest that you know nothing whatever about the State Department's vetting process or how effective it might be.
Admitting refugees is not really related to getting rid of Isis.
In a Frontline documentary last night, there were some Afghans that recently left the Taliban to join Isis. They did this because Isis was paying them $700 a month, guaranteed. This suggests that killing them is not always the best way to decrease the numbers of Isis.
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I suggest I apparently know alot more than you do, considering your desire to give the Government carte-blanche in proclaiming anything they want, and taking their word for it. Oh wait – we’ll vet them, and a "thorough vetting" it shall be! Leveraging the legendary competence of the federal government under Obama, we’ll review the detailed records that they will no doubt carry with them attesting to their disdain for bomb making. We’ll gather references from those who know them: “Abdul? Oh no, he would totally never even consider shooting up a K-Mart full of infidels to achieve the glory of martyrdom.” And we can count on their personal assurances that they aren’t jihadis: “I promise I won’t kill anyone. Cross my heart and hope to die and get my 72 virgins!” (sarcasm alert)
The fact is that importing Middle Easterners is a risk. Is it a huge risk? Maybe. Is it a small risk? Maybe, but either way, there is a risk in bringing these people in, and we just don’t want to take it, supported by about two-thirds of Americans
Nor have I made some direct connection that not admitting thousands of poverty riddled refugees into this country (when we have millions already) is tantamount to ridding ISIS. Those are 2 completely different mechanisms at work, but leave it to you to argue some point, no one is making
And yes, killing ISIS is THE foremost way of decreasing their #'s. But pinprick drone strikes are merely an annoyance to them. We HAD the ability to severely dent their expansion and strength, with little need for "boots on the ground". But instead, President Placate decided to try and play nice nice with terrorists, and scold our allies for daring to go after them with any sustained effort. At this point, only boots on the ground can dent their #'s
And the most ironic part of all, was this was all thoroughly warned in advance, if we pulled our troops out prematurely. Obama has truly solidified his "legacy"
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I understand we are sending a few hundred special forces to Iraq, but they might be wearing sneakers.
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The US has to date carried out EIGHT THOUSAND air missions against Isis. I think they consider this more annoying than a pinprick.\
The idea that somehow the number of immigrants allowed in should be decided upon by polls is an interesting one.
Perhaps we should raise taxes the same way. Being as the right wing thinks of taxes as punishment. I imagine that the preferred tax rate would approximate zero.
To date, almost no immigrants have committed acts of terrorism. So the current vetting process seems to be successful.
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Air "missions" is not the same as air strikes. We were performing thousands of sorties a week, compared to what....7, maybe 8, currently? Yes, its a mere pin prick to what we COULD do
And no one claimed polls should be used to decide, Professor deflection. Polls simply indicate what the predominance of the country is supporting or not supporting at any given time
So, we're to just let them in, and HOPE we don't have our own version of Paris?? I think not...and nor does the vast majority of the rest of the country
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Pilots have been returning with their warload unused because the rules of engagement are so strict.
This may change , and targets of opportunity may be engaged, with some increase in effectiveness and some increase in unintended damage.
http://wearechange.org/surprise-pilots-frustrated-at-white-house-for-ineffective-air-campaign-against-isis/?doing_wp_cron=1448325998.4685180187225341796875
Pilots are forced to seek approval before engaging each target, a process they say takes an hour on the average. By the time approval is received, conditions on the ground or the air often change.
..........................that U.S. pilots are averaging 14 strikes per day targeting the Islamic State.
“Compare that to the first Gulf War,” she said. “The United States averaged 1,125 strikes per day. In Kosovo 135 strikes a day.”
....................Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., recently charged that 75 percent of U.S. pilots return to base without having released a single weapon,
http://www.westernjournalism.com/us-military-pilots-get-fed-up-boldly-say-exactly-what-obama-didnt-want-them-to/
.............a similar statement made by a pilot of an American A-10 attack plane after it was revealed that the ISIS headquarters had been located in Raqqa, Syria. It was not destroyed, however, because of a heavy civilian presence. “We have not taken the fight to these guys,” the pilot told the The New York Times in an email.
............................... White House press secretary Josh Earnest reaffirmed the Obama administration’s rules of engagement. “There are military rules of engagement that our military leaders established for those airstrikes,” Earnest said. “We are very cautious about making sure there are no civilian casualties.”
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Pilots have been returning with their warload unused because the rules of engagement are so strict.
Exactly. It's a "semantics game", to claim "thousands of air missions", when 75+% of those planes come back with their full ordnance
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I am not deflecting anything.
Isis in Syria is one group, and Isis outside of Syria is another. Destroying Isis in Syria will not necessarily prevent attacks like the one in Paris or the bombing of the Russian plane.
I am pretty sure that the specific battle plan against Isis is not going to be revealed to the world. The element of surprise is very important in all military operations.
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ISIS IS ISIS REGARDLESS OF WHERE THEY ARE. ITS THE SAME FRICKEN GROUP. KILLING AS MANY ISIS SOLDIERS AND SUPPORTERS AS POSSIBLE, WHEREVER THEY ARE WILL GREATLY LESSEN SUBSEQUENT ATTACKS LIKE THE ONE IN PARIS AND BOMBING OF RUSSIAN PLANES
THERE IS NO ELEMENT OF SURPRISE, WHEN WE'RE NOT ATTACKING TO BEGIN WITH
UNDER THIS PRESIDENT AND HIS "BATTLE PLAN", HE'S ALLOWED THIS "JV TEAM" TO EXPAND INTO A TERRORIST MONSTER. THE TIME FOR "SURPRISE" WAS REQUIRED LONG AGO, WHEN THEY WERE STILL THIS SUPPOSED "JV TEAM"